Triceps

[Than_Bogan]

My triceps are weeeak.

 

In the last coupe of months I decided I needed to remove at least one "e".

 

The reason is, late last season I began to sort of understand what has to happen after the centerline at -38 and shorter. The more I played with this both on shore and in the course, the more I realized that this position requires not only a lot of core strength, but also the triceps power to hold the rope where it needs to be relative to your body.

 

I've always thought of triceps as fairly unimportant in slalom, and I think I still buy that through at least -32.

 

But it seems like advancing into -39 (which I recognize may never happen) is going to require not only a megaton of coaching and practice, but also the triceps and core strength to physically achieve the required movements -- notably what everyone has lately been calling the "Reverse C." In that position the upper body is kinda upright but the rope handle stays locks to the hips. As far as I can tell, this requires holding the handle down using triceps and holding your hips to it using lateral core muscles.

 

Am I thinking straight on this?

 

 

[mwetskier]

the pic of this guy from a article on here on handle control should tell us all we need to now about the importance of triceps

 

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[jayski]

I have to politley disagree, triceps are not a major factor at all in skiing, you are being pulled by the boat, it's all back, traps and legs for the major ones as far as managing the load, triceps are used for 'pushing' purposes (ex. Push ups, bench press, dips), if any arm muscle is more relevantly used it would be your bicep and way too much in error for some...there is no pushing in slalom, very few pros have large or even really defined triceps.

[The_MS]

There are lots of skiers out there that do not have large triceps and can put up very large scores.

[aswinter05]

I agree with @jayski , How do triceps come into play at all? Triceps aid in pushing things away from the body or extending the lower arm from a 90 degree angle to a straight position....

 

I'd be curious to know how triceps could aid my skiing so I can hit the gym a litter harder in that area :)

[disland]

Its important to not have any imbalance in any development. As such given that skiing works the bicep and lat so much all skiers need to work tricep and pec to stay balanced in order to avoid overuse injuries caused by imbalances. just like you need strong abs to ensure you dont have back problems

[BraceMaker]

I'm with disland - if nothing else what you are seeing in that picture is an isometric contraction of both the triceps and biceps.

 

You have isometric, concentric, and eccentric contractions - these terms refer to what the Joint is doing while the contraction occurs.

 

For instance if you are holding a dumbell with your elbow flexed at 90 degrees and it is not moving you have isometric contraction of the elbow flexors. If the dumbell is slowly raising you have concentric contraction of elbow flexors, and if itis slowly straightening you have eccentric contraction of the elbow flexors.

 

Training triceps is good, because it allows you to stabilize the elbow joint in ANY position, not just fully in extension.

 

We use our antagonist muscles to dampen oscillations, stabilize, and keep our body still and calm.

[Than_Bogan]

Hm, total misinterpretation so far I'm afraid. I knew I should have made the original post longer :).

 

Nobody is saying that triceps are a critical group. (If they were, I would have to be in a different sport!)

 

What I am hypothesizing, however, is that they do have one very important use and they have to be up to the task. For most people, this threshold may be so low as to be inactive. For a guy who can't bench 100 lbs (well maybe a few times I guess), some effort may be needed to get there.

 

The specific movement that (I think!) requires triceps doesn't really take place at -32 and longer, and is potentially optional even beyond that. But there comes a point where you spend a lot of time travelling up-course rather than cross-course, dictated by the geometry of extremely short lines.

 

To manage this, there is a movement from about the second wake almost out to the buoy line where the skier is NOT leveraged against the boat, but must "maintain contact" or "handle control" or "reverse C" or whatever one chooses to call it.

 

This requires standing relatively upright but holding the rope to your hip. In this position, the force of the rope is trying to pull the rope handle away from your body: either by forcing your shoulder joint to rotate or forcing your elbow to bend. The latter failure is prevented by triceps.

[Than_Bogan]

Btw, I'd claim the biceps are the group we shouldn't be using "at all." I can think of no spot in the course where I want to be bent at the elbow.

 

As always, I could totally missing something.

[Chef23]

@Than_Bogan coming off the second wake when you are controlling the handle the trailing arm elbow is bent.

 

Sorry don't know how to embed a picture.

 

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.schnitzskis.com/images/926_Nate_Smith_DSC_3676a.JPG&imgrefurl=http://www.schnitzskis.com/natesmith.html&h=613&w=926&sz=115&tbnid=Un1zpUu6o-zIjM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=136&zoom=1&usg=__hoLnd9LNGqoUUmgKdIZnZGGTQgM=&docid=9xSoivVxumQRiM&sa=X&ei=luJQUY75JfG-0QGSm4HQAQ&ved=0CFgQ9QEwBg&dur=974

[Than_Bogan]

@Chef23 Interesting picture. Do we think that's intentional? It's not what I understood to be the goal at that point, but I'm totally new to understanding this move.

[ForrestGump]

@Than_Bogan Watch CP in that transition area. Looks just like Nate in that pic only he rotates the handle vertically. As will all of the elite skiers to some degree(have a bent arm in the transition). The goal is to keep the core moving with the handle, not to have the arms straight. As you transition the ski underneath you, the reaching arm/trailing arm elbow will bend. It's the natural movement of the body. As long as the upper arms and elbow are in to the core during the transition, you'll keep the core moving with the handle which is what generates width, spacing, and speed control.

[Than_Bogan]

Awesome! Thanks folks. I am slightly smarter now.

[SkiJay]

"... I am slightly smarter now."

/@Than_Bogan

 

You rock Than! I've given up on getting smarter. It seems I have to forget something before I can fit anything new in there.

[Gloersen]

It's dated but the "technique move" of the trailing arm described is probably still applicable in regards to tight handle control. Even if reasonably strong, implementation is challenging, imho.

 

[Deep11]

Hmmm weird - @than_bogan knows this stuff yet seems accepting of contrary ideas. I agree to some extent with Than the biceps aren't the muscles doing the work at the point off the second wake (photo if it embeds). Yes the trailing arm is bent but that's a reflection of trying to keep the elbow on the hip which is achieved by bracing the lats and the triceps. Getting pulled up causes the arm bend. So perhaps building the triceps is a good idea?

Failed! - How do you embed an image ? :(

[Deep11]

Ah ha - if in doubt read the instructions (or in this case FAQ). Seems a bit like asking a passer-by directions - would rather get lost!

[Than_Bogan]

Contrary ideas are the only ones of interest. The other ones, by definition, are already in my head.

[ForrestGump]

The only benefit to a stronger tricep, as I see it, is the ability to hold the arms straighter in the power zone behind the boat.