Tournament timing

[disland]

Does anyone have an estimate for the avg time per skier if using turn and burn?

[RichardDoane]

@jdarwin

[disland]

Most of our skiers elect T&B but I have never timed it to see how long it takes

[lpskier]

In my experience, "turn and burn" is "turn and leave." Then the officials that are left to ski third round have to sort out who skis and who officiates. Personally, I would do away with that format if I could.

[disland]

Our members love it. Things move faster and we can get done before the glare gets bad, as our lake runs east west, and in the fall glare comes earlier

[dbutcher]

Turn and burn typically eliminates 2 early passes per skier for those who do it. It may save two and one half minutes per skier for those who do it. As stated above, it makes round 2 longer but round 3 shorter. Sometimes skiers who are late in the round two running order get irritated. And you do lose officials. Shuffling officials can slow things down. Additionally, some skiers who ordinarily would skip round three, take round three as turn and burn. I'm not convinced that turn and burn makes a tournament day end that much earlier. But having the choice is good for skiers. That's what's most important.

[6balls]

People wanting/needing to leave early have done it. I've done it to dodge 3rd round glare and it's a bit like practice...who doesn't run their toughest pass on the second try sometimes?

 

I'm also pretty gassed by round 3 (especially on day two so round 5) after sitting around in the sun all day judging etc and having already skied two tourney rounds that day (plus travel fatigue). It's kind of nice to finish early, cheer on the other skiers, get in a tower and relax.

 

If it's not there...no biggie I'm fine skiing traditional as well.

 

How much it shorten's a tourney depends on how many T/B saving the 2.5 min or so/skier that @dbutcher posted above. The late round 2 guys who ski 3 rounds need to be ready their 3rd round comes up fast!

[MrJones]

I do not like turn and burn. If you are early in the rotation of skiers for the tournament it's great.... for you. For people at the end of the group it's terrible. You have a massive gap in time between your first and second round, then basically no time between your second and third.

 

I understand the reason people like it. You have a long drive or a flight to catch. My issue is that often these skiers could just ask to ski early in the day's rotation and have the same result. It may not be fun to ski and 7:30 am (I'm an old guy and don't like it), but why not do that rather than throw off the flow of the entire tournament.

 

Of course, to each his own. It's still much better than a day at work!

[disland]

@MrJones we only have 25 skiers so dont have long waits

[MISkier]

I always thought the reason it was introduced was to give the skier a second crack at the "wall pass" while still being warmed up and not have a need to ski the previous passes again. That would be my only reason to do it and I would start that attempt right at the pass I just missed.

 

Time, or trying for an early departure, was never a factor for me in the appeal of T&B

 

I've only actually selected the option once - the first time it was ever offered to me. All other times, I just skied the 3rd round.

[sunperch]

I think the efficiency of the T&B is lost by making the skier return to the "beginning" end of the lake for the first pass of the 3rd round. Doing this wastes time (including the sit times at each end of the lake, if applicable) and boat gas. Why not let the skier start that which ever end is closest? The skier can choose to start at whichever speed and line length he/she wants, therefore calling it cheating does not make sense. I personally have only bettered my score one time by choosing the T&B option, so I usually wait for the 3rd round to ski.

[klindy]

@disland 7 minutes a skier is a good number with average end wait times of about 45 seconds or so. Kids and older (or slower speed) folks take a little longer. Get real casual at the dock and you'll add another minute.

 

If I recall we always ran about 8-8.5 per skier in the past at the fall tournament at your lake. That includes changing boats etc.

 

I'd suggest using 1/2 that time for any 3rd in the T&B format. So 12-13 minutes for the last two rounds per skier that chooses to T&B. May not be exact but I bet pretty close.

 

For reference, at the last few regionals and nationals we averaged just about 6.5 minutes a skier overall. At the last few records I've been CJ at we were essentially just over 7 minutes a skier and we didn't push things overly aggressively. That said, we didn't lose a ton of time at the dock either.