ZO Training with PP??

[MWJumper77]

I am trying to train for tournaments where we have to ski behind ZO but all I have is a PP boat. Trying to get that feel f the ZO Building Speed at the base vs PP which is Hammer on Hammer off...any suggestions? Letter changing? Anything?

[thager]

I think your question is for jump but for slalom If you have a switch I used Kx++ and px 20 with PP Classic. Felt similar to ZO for a 196 lb guy if skiing was in synch. If out of synch not similar at all. More punishing! Don't jump anymore so no help there.

[Dirt]

We have been messing around with PP Classic KX + and PX 70-100. Very brutal but sounds like ZO. The gates are completely different. PP Classic comes into the course at almost 36 mph and lets you pull it down to 34 mph. It does not add gas until 1 ball with the switch.

Anyone else mess with this?

[eleeski]

I simulated with KX- PX10 and ran the baseline down so my skier weight was 100# overweight. Then I ran .005 hot. That felt a lot like C3 on ZO. For slalom.

 

I jump letter A and sproing straight over the ramp (no cut) so my jump input is worthless.

 

Tricks with the paddlewheel felt the same as B3 (and honestly the same as C3 where I ski now).

 

Eric

[MWJumper77]

I know this isn't a jump site but yes this was for jump practice thank you for the insight though.

 

[Horton]

Jump! ZO to PP? There is a disaster I had not thought about.

[Klinger]

It has been two years since I have jumped with Perfect Pass... But the biggest thing to remember when you are behind ZO is to be as progressive as possible from the turn to the ramp. With PP, if you turn hard and go, the switch will engage right away and stay on all the way throught the base of the ramp. With ZO, if you hammer it hard out of the turn and then ride into the bottom, the switch will stay engaged, but it will not be gassing hard into the ramp because it already gassed hard to start with, and it trying to make a good time.

 

The moral of the story is- if you can be progressive from the turn to the jump, and really load hard from the wakes to the base, you will be fine behind anything you jump behind. ZO will make you fly if you load like this!! Have fun!

 

[Horton]

Just cut later

[Dirt]

Here is a 32 off slalom video with kx+ and px 80. Does it sound close to ZO?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfZ_NiJjXos

 

[jimbrake]

Dirt - what did Fritz say about the feel of that pull?

[Dirt]

He said it felt difficult and different from PP.

[jwr]

I jump practice behind pp and I was having a lot of trouble this year with gas into the bottom. I finally came to the conclusion that I was getting too wide on the boat. This was causing me to sink some in my turn and overload the boat. Even though I was pulling through the ramp zo would hit me real hard at the begining and let off at the base, which would cause me to lose my acceleration and put me on my heels. PP will pull like a freight train all the way. What helped me is to go back to a 3/4 and make a nice slow turn with momentum and then progressively pull into the ramp. I run r on pp and zo and the pull feels the same since I have been doing this. I may go back to a full double but make sure I don't get any wider then the driver. If you watch freddy he let's off his counter at the white water and only gets out to the driver. That way he doesn't load the boat too early. I was told you can't pull too hard because the boats are so powerful they will eat you up. In fact with zo it is just the opposite. If you pull too hard in the beginning the boat wont have anything left for you at the ramp. The keys seem to be turn with momentum and be progressive. As freddy says you want to sneak up on the boat.

[thompjs]

jwr - A couple of years ago at a SR Judges clinic, Freddy came and talked about ZO jump programming. As it turns out, increasing the letter on ZO may actually give you less into the bottom of the ramp. ZO knows about where the skier begins to cut and then crosses the wakes, once you cross the wakes it is recomputing how hard it needs to accelerate to make a perfect time at the MT ball just past the ramp. If you dig too hard from the outside or have too much letter, ZO has no room for giving it to you hard into the ramp. If you go back to your doubles you might try going down a letter or two. Freddy said at the meeting that if you punch in his weight and distance, he was running one or two letters LESS than its calculation.

 

I did get to see Freddy jump from the boat back in the PP days and even then he was just getting up to the driver.

 

 

[jwr]

That is a good point, and I've tried that a little, but I don't get enough zo time to dial it in. Going to try it some more if I can get some zo time.

 

What you are describing has been a big part of my problem. Also going 33 doesn't help because I can set a pretty hard angle and pull the boat down out of my turn. Don't think it will be as easy at 35. Maybe that will.

 

All I want is everything the boat has on my counter and a nice progressive pull through the ramp.

 

I need more zo time to figure out the lowest letter I can use and still get good times.