Why not ski in Class F Tournaments?

[disland]

Why pay a sanction fee for class F? Do you really need insurance? Just have a fun tournament without a sanction.

[Horton]

I have been brainwashed to ski for my rankings list score. Resistance is futile.

 

Sadly I am part of the machine and part of the problem. The rankings list is likely part of the what is wrong with the sport.

[Kelvin]

I am just close enough to getting a score or 2 that would qualify me for nationals. I would hate to do it in a tournament that didn't count.

[disland]

@horton, what's wrong with the rankings list. I think its fun

[BrennanKMN]

I just want to go turn some balls with like minded individuals for a fun weekend. I don't have much desire to climb the sanctioned ladder.

[dbutcher]

Food for thought: Does an unsanctioned tournament run a risk of being unfair competition because there are no rules???

[disland]

Full disclosure, I did enter Darwins revolt 2.0 tournament in September.

 

Although ranking list is fun. I am talking about AWSA ranking list, (dont give a hoot about IWWF)

 

Skiing a handicap event against other skiers for cash is way more fun.

[klindy]

To clarify Class F scores DO count on the ranking list up to level 5. Clearly those like @disland and @Kelvin will ski better than the max score but for those who don't, Class F scores will show up.

 

Also my understanding is adding Class F to a class C Tournament is FREE. Having a class F group allows the sponsor to have 4 pass min and gate mulligans etc.

[Bill22]

Only downside I see to class F is around here class F always has to go off the dock first.

[Horton]

@disland There are some in the sport that think the rankings list marked the end of competition. Many skiers go to tournaments not to compete locally but to get a score for the list.

[Jody_Seal]

George you buying the beer?? Ill be there!! :D

[Bruce_Butterfield]

@ob1 I think that's the main point. All the money that currently goes to sanction fees, official's comped entries / hotel can be applied to more important things. What do you think most skiers would rather pay for - sanction fees and officials or beer?

[ALPJr]

I want to have fun, enjoy the day and do my best to get a PB. A nighttime lakeside fire, with food and brew is good too. Never going to be an elite competitor so don't care about a ranking.

[disland]

@OB1 sounds like a class "D". Follows 90% of the rules (basically everything except tower judges) and should count to the ranking list.

Interesting idea

[208skier]

I go to tournaments to hang out with other skiers and have fun. I am competitive and like to know where I stand but at the end of the day, I'm not good enough for rankings to matter. Moreover, my wife isn't interested in skiing tournaments and neither are my daughters - yet. Hopefully one day. For this to be a family event for me (which is what I want) it has to be a good social event. The tournaments I ski fit the bill. I would absolutely ski class F, especially if some aspect of it was compelling enough for my wife to enter. Not sure what that looks like exactly.

[Jody_Seal]

Actually George is on to what is real in the sport. The rankings ideology has been a true bane in the three event world. When we had basic tournaments where the best skier of the day won or a certain level of performance was attained (rating) got a skier to the big show's we had far less problems in the sport. It did not matter if drivers from one area were putting on the big swerve nor did it matter if drivers and judges in another area were allowing slower then actual boat times as it put ass's in the seats. And when these skiers went to the bigger show's it was run straight up and skiers knew what they were up against as it was who won that day.. We had 1000 entry nationals then!!

 

Then The analites and techno-geeks said hey we need to make it so you have to hire a small army of staff to run an event or what is now called a tournament (I call em trials) and we have to have this one kind of speed control so as everyone has to adapt to a certain style and we have to have all this techno crap to read performances and report scores!!!

Did you all know in 1996 AWSA had nearly 20,000 members!! in 2017 AWSA is down to less then 7000 members. What happened ??? did these nearly 13,000 skiers die?? Nope their still out there and a lot of them still run buoy's and ride around on the water but they realized that skiing tournaments was not fun anymore due to the Analites and techno-geeks.

 

I had an epiphany last Wed night and I came to the conclusion as a band leader in this sport I was utilizing resources, energy and my time for absolutely no return of investment. This current group of AWSA leaders have drawn up the design for the lid of the Coffin and are now trying to figure out how to implement final burial of this sport. At that time last Thursday morning I chose to apply what resources and energy I have to the handle end of the rope rather then the dying baggage at the other end.

I used to encourage all to be heard and go to your membership meetings. What waste of time and energy. BOS I believe now has a far more reaching impact and source of skier input then what the AWSA meetings have to offer.

 

Maybe BOS could become a new sanction body for the sport?? Or at least here is a platform to bring forth a better solution for the skiers involved.

 

 

 

[Horton]

@Jody_Seal Amen to everything you say above except the last 2 sentences.

[Horton]

@Jody_Seal the one other thing I have to add is that as much as I question how the sport has been run for the last 20+ years I do understand that the culture of America has changed also. Golf may not have lost the % of participants that we have but golf courses are closing down more then they are opening up. Many sports are in trouble and then oddly others are growing. Our sport was REALLY STRONG in the 1970s and 1980s. Things simply change. Could better administration have helped us? Hell yes but I am not sure anyone could have actually grown the sport in the last 10 years.

 

I am just saying that the ranking list may not the # 1 thing pushing membership down. The list of things that have driven members out of AWSA is LONG.

 

[Jody_Seal]

@Horton

John you probably have never set foot in one of these meetings be it state level or BOD level in your life, but the truth be known little or no growth will happen when the same 10 individuals are sitting at these table's as what was sitting there 15 years ago. This goes to state regional and national board level's as nothing gets changed to encourage the sports even minimal growth, or overall competition improvement except the ideology of those 10 individuals agenda's. The same turd gets re-wrapped into a glossier package every year. That turd being the rankings ideology!

 

[klindy]

@Jody_Seal did you resign as director? Why do the same10 indivuduals keep getting reelected??

[Jody_Seal]

Yep that was my epiphany last week. Checked out, rather be in the peanut gallery .

[Wish]

Well that's kind of a bomb shell.

[Mateo_Vargas]

I blame the baby boomers. They all caved and let their kids wakeboard.

[Horton]

@"Mateo Vargas" No I think wake is the whole problem. we just live in a different world.

[lpskier]

@Jody_Seal Off topic, but thank you for your years of service.

[jcamp]

I'm really close to a new line length and have been pushing for it the last couple of years. It's going to happen this year. But if I did it in a class F for the first time I'd 1) think "damn" it's not going to show up on the rankings list! and 2) think hmmmm, were the tolerances the same as a class C and did I REALLY run that?

[6balls]

Yah driver's, boats, boat judges and call it a tourney.

 

I can't be "safety" despite my M.D., my advanced trauma life support, advanced cardiac life support, pediatric advanced life support, advance life support in obstetrics (hey, someone may go into labor, right?), neonatal resuscitation, basic life support, and my work on inpatient, outpatient and ER patients.

I did take some time out of my schedule a while back and watch some videos, learn how to flip people safely to face up in the water etc in order to do the pre-req's for safety. Now I need to be junior safety dude at a couple of tourney's before I can be a basic state safety guy.

Funny thing is if someone gets seriously hurt at a tourney and I'm there they are not going to look to the safety person...I know what happens at hockey games and football games when I happen to be in the stands. Just my beef...but I should be able to be safety right out of the box or watch a video and answer some questions regarding safety issues that are not necessarily part of my training but are sport specific.

 

 

[Jody_Seal]

Great post Dave,

My Daughter just went jumping through hoops to get her safety rating. She is a DPT has all of the first aid certificates yet still had to do the run around to get her rating. Funny she is one of my valued first responder Vested swimmer at the Masters as she is also a jumper and knows the drill. I have another buddy said screw it! He was at the time a Navy corps man, Medic and Seal trained combat master Chief and Navy diver attached to a Seal unit. he could attend to shot up and blown up personnel in and out of the water, over see a baro chamber yet could not be recognized as a safety person at a waterski tournament.

judging has gotten a bit easier to attain a higher rating but yet it is still a bunch of BS to become a judge. Driving? forget it! I and Lyman maybe the only sr drivers that went out of our way in the last year at least in our region to sign off on a couple young drivers and encourage them to jump in the seat.

Last year our Region had a request to the drivers committee and ratified at the summer BOD meeting to allow Sr rated slalom drivers the opportunity to test for reg trick drivers rating. many a 3 event tournament only 1 three event driver is available with a half a dozen slalom drivers standing around, every one of them saying they would love to help out but no Bueno! did not see that as an action item on the recent BOD packet. IT IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE TO DRIVE TRICKS!!

Yet they managed to put together a mobile phone app to keep up with whatever waterskiing. Did we really need an phone app to keep up with rankings?? Again misguided resources run amuck!!

[bigtex2011]

Joe Darwin was our safety trainer here in the SCR

[bishop8950]

Of topic, but why not have a "fast track for safety"? I host a tournament every year and struggle to find a rated safety person but we always have fireman and doctors skiing!

[Edbrazil]

Back in the 1960s and into the 1970s, the non-sanctioned Eastern tournament called the

Frostbite was regularly held as the very last water ski event in the East, in October. The

first year, they had nice weather. About the 2nd year, there was snow of the ramp. They

moved it up a bit earlier. This event used to be one where Rules ideas were being tried

out, and some of these got incorporated into the regular Rules. Original organizer Lex

Carroll (RIP) was the event innovator. Lex kept on trying to get the Mixed Doubles event

re-introduced into the regular Rules (M. D. was discontinued about 1967). Kept trying

out scoring ideas. I remember that a partner and I scored over the maximum possible

100 points from one judge (oops). Tom Kelly (RIP), in the 1968 Frostbite, recorded a

jump distance in excess of the current Sr. Men record. May have given him the incentive

to go for it next year. Where he did succeed in getting the record in a regular tournament.

 

So, anyway, I sure do favor Class F events (didn't exist then), especially for testing out

new ideas. On July 4, 1976, we ran a head-on-head Slalom event at Ultra Pond in New

Hampshire, as an extra non-sanctioned event at our sanctioned tournament. The concept

caught on, of course. Adopted by the Pro Tour, when it started up in 1984.