Restoring a classic ski lake

[Horton]

easy button?

 

[Horton]

I just gave myself a dislike for a stupid idea

[thager]

Does your "dislike" show up with no indication of the cowards I.D?

[Horton]

@thager

 

[h2onhk]

I'm a little confused. The whole course sits in 3-4' of water and the rebar has been driven the into bottom like a stake to hold each of the buoys?? Or is it just the turn balls? How far is the rebar sticking up out of the bottom, 6", 12"?? the skier is potentially less than 3' away from impalement?

 

Trying to think of ideas but I first have to fully understand the current situation

[scottleeds]

My first slalom memories were at your parents lake in about 1988. Sad to see the lake change hands. Regarding the slalom course, seems like the easiest solution is shorten the rebar with a hack saw. Then use rebar clamps to tie your sub buoy line on. You can also use rebar caps to cover the cut ends. It will take some time, but it should work.

[MISkier]

@Horton, those are both "Disagree", not "Dislike". And, I think some of us cannot see the avatars when it is Dislike or Disagree. I know I can't. I see only the counts for those ratings, not who actually generated them.

[A_B]

I don't see the owners of the disagrees or dislikes any more. Assumed the Admin wanted to keep identities hidden so as not to get into cyber bullying or some such.

 

[Horton]

The deal with the dislikes is off topic but I don't really know why we see him sometimes and we don't others.

[Horton]

@scottleeds I'm not sure what the diameter is but it is pretty thick so the idea of cutting it is very unappealing. I really don't know what I'm going to do.

 

The lake will not be changing hands. My mom doesn't have any intention of leaving the property anytime soon.

[DavidN]

A couple rebar clamps and a bolt cutter. Easy, quick and cheap.

Put clamp on, attach rope/cable for the buoys and cut the rebar above clamp.

 

Something like this...

 

 

[Horton]

@DavidN I think that's a pretty smart idea but the rebar is close to half inch thick - definitely not the skinny quarter inch stuff. I don't know if bolt cutters would do it.

 

I'll be out there this weekend for my dad's memorial and I will take a second look at the thickness but I think he installed the super beefy stuff 50 years ago.

[thager]

@Horton Wear a rubber suit and use a sawzal with a diamond blade. Take video! >:)

[Horton]

@DavidN holy crap I just did a search and realized there si such a thing as a hydraulic rebar cutter. that may be exactly the solution. Of course that means I will the operating a hydraulic jack cutter in zero visibility water but how hard can that be?

[skimtb]

Can you just bend the rebar over so it points down? May need to make a tool to do that if nothing exists.

Then clamp to the vertical part where it comes out from lake bed - that is presumably in the right spot?

[DavidN]

@Horton - just a matter of using the right tool.

 

 

 

I’d choose that one over using a sawzall under water all day long. :D

[Horton]

I was in visioning the old school bolt cutters I used when I was a kid to remove padlocks. there's no freaking way I am strong enough to do it that way but I find some 3/4-in hydraulic cutters for like a hundred bucks. That's freaking genius

[jimmyjamesbrown]

>:)

 

Cutter sounds like the way to go, there are tools specifically for this.

[Cnewbert]

1/2” rebar? Just bend it 90° flat against the bottom. Slide a 6’ length of maybe 3/4” ID pipe over it. With that much leverage it should bend like butter quick, easy and very cheap. It would be a fraction the effort of cutting it no matter what you use. And you could still use the still firmly anchored but no longer sticking straight up rebar as buoy anchor points right at the point of the bend for the new course.

[thager]

@Horton and @Gloersen $69 at Northern Tool for hydralic rebar cutter.

[jimski]

Any thing left standing fairly straight after 50 years should be fairly soft and or rusty.

Uses a 3/4 or 1 inch inside diameter pipe slide it over top of the rebar and bend it back and forth a couple times and it should snap off at the ground level. Then just pound the stub in the mud.

Worth a try this weekend

I my self would find some one handy with a welder and make a puller that sits on the bottom with a long pipe and pull it all out.

[jimski]

How far away from the shore line are the anchors

Put a strap on the rebar and move your tractor into place and use a come along to pull them out or just use the tractor bucket and a strap to pull it out

Lots of good ideas here show us the video

I wouldn’t want it left in either

[Cnewbert]

@jimski, I suggested something similar a couple of posts before yours. Except I suggested just bending them flat against the bottom where they pose no harm nor any chance of impaling a skier, but still might make good anchor points for a new set of buoys. Of course if they are so rusted they break when bending flat, then it might be best just to break them all off.

[BraceMaker]

@jimski the cycle time of swimming in and out and climbing up and down off a tractor makes that a horrible process.

 

Anything repetitious you do in the water you basically need a work barge where you can have all the stuff you need to complete the task ball by ball, because it is a huge effort to move to each ball x the whole course.

[skimtb]

I’m still curious what “cold” water means to @Horton. Here, you walk or play hockey on cold water in the off season.

[Horton]

So this weekend I'm going to go out there with a stake puller and a hydraulic rebar cutter. There is one or two stakes that are completely unnecessary and are super scary. Those come out Friday. Those come out before a boat goes in the water.The long term decision is to remove any rebar that is not 100% necessary.

 

For anchors that that are actually part of the course I'm then going to evaluate if cutting them off a few inches off the bottom, install safety caps and then rebar clamps suggested by @DavidN

 

It has occurred to me that after I cut off a piece of rebar close to the bottom now I have a newly sharpened spike as opposed to a 50-year-old blunt spike. it is also occurred to me that in the process of bending or cutting the old rebar it may break leaving me with rusty sharpened spikes. considering there is literally zero visibility in the water I am giving some serious consideration to safety.

[RichardDoane]

Just don’t forget the rules

 

 

[gyoung]

You can buy dedicated reo bar benders that would bend past 90 degrees. If they bend and don’t snap you could possibly bend it like a hairpin and attach the sub bouy to that

[gyoung]

 

[76SS]

A tetanus shot should probably be the first thing on your list. @Horton

[Mateo_Vargas]

A true restoration would require pulling out that metric slalom course and replacing it with an imperial one.

[Horton]

@Mateo_Vargas imperial course is still there. I'm not sure which anchors are which but there's definitely two sets side by side. The boat guides will never be perfectly straight because some of the balls are imperial and some are metric.

[Jetsetr]

Not going to matter if you get impaled on blunt or pointy rebar it has the same unpleasant results...and it’s not pretty...

 

[Horton]

@Jetsetr yep. That's why I'm fixing it and probably not going to let hardly anybody ski there even when it is fixed

[JaredSmith]

Let me get this right @Horton, are we talking about the first ever man-made ski lake built in the world? Nothing is worth doing unless done right, especially this lake! Take everything off of the bottom of the lake then do as suggested by @Bruce_Butterfield and use 18" x 18” square 4” thick concrete blocks with stainless steel eyebolts and pvc holes on opposite corners to pin to the bottom with rebar. Yes this is some work and expense but I'm sure you could get it all done for free if you just ask then let those that do the work ski for free for a negotiated period of time.

[Horton]

@JaredSmith you are welcome do come do this work - I will not. I plan to use Horton Lake just a few times per year. Fixing it right is simply not worth it for me. It is too shallow to ski on seriously besides I live on a lake that is 8 feet deep, has a RC course and is where my boat lives. Even the minimum amount of work I am going to do may really be a boondoggle.

 

In the next few years we will likely put the lake on the market and I will recommend to any prospective buyer that they drain and re-dig.

[JaredSmith]

Not for me since I don't live close to the area but I'm sure there are people who do. :)

[Dirt]

Horton talking about doing work has been amusing. Like @MS talking about not drinking beer, @skidawg talking about turning in his guns or @thager talking about not making funny smarta** comments anymore.

[Horton]

like @dirt not pissing off co-workers, supervisors, lake owners, judges, drivers or random citizens

[rico]

 

[Horton]

@rico point taken

[Onside135]

The most expensive slalom course is a ski!

[Stevie Boy]

If you think it is too shallow and do not intend to ski on it much , probably not at all, why not just pull the rebar to make it safe and sell it to somebody who will redig and make the lake really useable, instead of slowly being taken over by nature.

[mmskiboat]

@Horton I'm sure you have thought of this but when I have worked under water I wear gloves to reduces risk of cuts. Also after years of white water kayaking water cuts from rocks would get nasty fast it not cleaned well.

 

Here are some amazon ones:

 

Gloves 1

 

Gloves 2

 

I also would protect your feet.

 

 

[Mick04]

@Horton, are you planning to attach a temp buoy to the each rebar before you work on cutting it? Attach as close to bottom as possible, cut right above it. I can imagine “losing” the stub of a sharp freshly cut hunk of rusty rebar, then having to feel around for it in 0 visibility. Yikes, even with Kevlar gloves.

[LeonL]

After reading all the ideas it sounds like bending over flush with the bottom and connect your buoy is best. The suggestion to put a marker buoy down first is good, in case it breaks off. @Horton in your first post you mentioned "cliff" of 9" at shoreline? That would simple to grade out.

[KRoundy]

Is the rebar a grid that is laid across the bottom of the lake or it is just individual pieces of rebar driven into the bottom? If the later, I think your original idea of a puller is good idea. Attach, wiggle back and forth quite a bit and pull. I'm guessing it will come out with a reasonable amount of effort - depending upon how long they are and how they were pounded into place.

 

We are all going to want a lot of video of what happens.

 

Plus - prayers for you and your family at the memorial. Hope that everyone enjoys celebrating a life well-lived.

[Horton]

@LeonL if while bending the rebar flat it onto the lake it breaks off I then have razor sharp spikes sticking up off the bottom.

[klindy]

@Horton if it's breaks off so easy bending it over, you're unlikely to be able to pull it straight up too. If it does break off, I'd recommend having someone with a welder make up a device using a 3-4" 3/4" pipe nipple with a cap on one end. Then weld a piece of round bar or pipe to the top of the pipe cap. The bar/pipe should be long enough to extend out of the water. If the rebar shears off, slide the open end of the pipe nipple over the remaining stub and drive it deeper into the mud. At least it will be out of the way. The relatively short pipe nipple will allow you to get it on top of the rebar and keep it from sliding off. It should be able to get deep enough into the bottom without being too difficult.

[wski1831]

cut the rebar(bolt cutters should do it) Sleeve over it with a pipe. The pipe protects from rebar and if u have threaded end you can add a piece so you don't have to pound it underwater.