Lessons learned coaching the slalom course from scratch

[Horton]

Since the beginning of the COVID-19 lockdown, I have had 2 different college-age women working as nannies in trade for skiing and coaching. I had skied with both of them a little in the past but when my daughter’s schools closed I really needed help at home so one or the other of them has been at my house almost every day since.

 

Maddie progressed from not running the course at all to running 26mph (with gates). Abbs has progressed from getting a few at 28mph to running 32mph at 22 off. In both cases, I think I learned as much as they did. This was the first time I have ever been the exclusive coach for skiers at this level and have been able to take a long term approach to their development.

 

With Maddie, I made two mistakes that showed me the conventional wisdom may be wrong. I thought that 25 mph was slow enough. The other error was believing that full length 75 feet of rope was not the best thing for a skier at this level. Needless to say when I slowed to 23 and let the rope out ALL the way she started running the course. It was not long until we added gates and she was running 23 & 25 with a few goes at 26 (whatever the actual speeds are in metric)

 

I credit the success of both of these women on the fact that almost all of the coaching focused on stance / stack / structural alignment. When we started, both of them 1) had the typical beginner broken stack / hips back 2) neither of them held their position through the wakes 3) both of them let up through the wakes and then pulled again past the second wake. We talked about stack/alignment is a wide variety of ways but hardly talked about anything else.

 

I also instituted a “no squirreling” rule. What that means is we stay on the subject and even if I see some other glaring issue we do not talk about it. 95% of all the skier / coach conversation is about stack in one way or another.

 

[mike_mapple]

@Horton its funny my dad used to always say you can never use too much rope when teaching or working on form. I used to always laugh at people who said they can ski 15-22 because its to long ect and he would go out there at 24-26mph and run the course to show them. I also like your No squirreling rule, that makes it easy for the skier to focus on one thing instead of trying to adjust 3-4 things on the next pass.

[ToddF]

Actually coaching vs giving advice

 

Coaching forces you to look at physical movements differently.

Coaching forces you to adapt to different strengths and body types

Coaching forces you to Rethink what works and why

Coaching forces you to Understanding how your athlete thinks and perceives their own movements

Coaching forces you to figure out different ways to motivate your athletes

 

 

 

“coaches” who teach the same technique/model to everyone are more advice givers than coaches

So kudos for being a coach

[bsmith]

I had often wondered why so many on this site thought that 15 off was the best way to start every new skier on the course. As @Horton saw with Maddie, going really slow with a full long line made by the course doable for her at her initial level of skill. If Maddie had been forced to only ski at 15 off, she would have still ultimately run the course, but it would have taken longer and possibly discouraged her. I think that there is no doubt that she had more fun learning by being able to run the course as early as possible in her development.

 

Hopefully, that old canard about 15 off being the best way to learn the course is now fully disproved.

[Horton]

@bsmith I will tell you that as soon as she could run 23 mph long line consistently I shortened to 15 off instead of going faster. Long line helped a lot but as soon as I could get her away from it I did.

[bsmith]

@Horton As a beginner course skier, the decision to go shorter line or faster speed first is something that I am wrestling with right now. I am getting a late start on skiing a course this year (will do so tomorrow) and trying to decide whether to stay long line up to my top speed of 34 mph and then start shortening the rope or whether to go ahead and shorten to 15 off right now at 26 mph which I am able to do.

 

Based on what you did with Maddie, you would advocate to go ahead and shorten to 15 off and then work on building speed. But that approach will take me longer to make a 34 mph run. Why do you think shortening the rope first is the best approach? And if this topic should be addressed in a new thread, let me know and I will create one.

[skispray]

@bsmith I don’t think you’ll end up needing more time to bag 34 mph if you ski at 15 off.

[Horton]

@bsmith NO NO NO do not stay at long line once you can run a pass at any speed. Long line 34 mph is harder for me to run as 32 off 34 mph.

[bsmith]

@Horton Wow! That is a pretty emphatic response saying that long line is just something to get you running the course and that once you can do so, never use it again! I was not expecting that.

 

I got so used to running long line when I was first trying to make a full pass that it doesn't seem like a bad thing. It feels like I could just keep increasing speed and making passes up until my max speed. I guess there is some technique issue that kicks in starting from 15 off that if you master properly, then long line feels terrible.

 

Since you don't seem to have any doubt whatsoever on this point, I should probably take your word on this and never ski long line again.

[Horton]

@bsmith with 75 feet of rope the boat is always pulling you down the lake. As the rope gets shorter you can actually get "free of the boat" and cast out early at the ball. Long line has it's place but it is limited.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

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@Horton why didn’t you teach them the mini-course?

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Sorry I couldn’t resist ?. Seriously, that is a good lesson. It’s amazing how much we can learn by coaching others.

[quinne]

Helpful thread. Now looking back through older discussions on how to practice a stacked position.

[Horton]

Sort of off topic but Maddie is now crushing 30 mph. So much fun!

 

Sadly Abbegayle is working her day job now and Maddie is off to college next week. Anyone want to trade teaching homeschool for ski rides and coaching?

 

 

[RGilmore]

Famous particle physicist Frank Oppenheimer often said "Docendo discimus" which is Latin for "the best way to learn is to teach".

[BTheis]

@Horton do you believe a 170 to 180 skier can make the course at 24 mph?

[Horton]

@BTheis yes. A bigger ski would help.

[h2onhk]

@horton I'm in a similar situation with my oldest daughter. 11yr old. Skiing on a slalom since she was 6 but never had any real desire to improve and just skied for fun and I was cool with that. Put her on her mom's bigger slalom last year and her free skiing improved a lot. We use a portable course on public water and have to take it in and out every time we use it. Because of all the new COVID boaters this year, we haven't had it in much. She loves coming along and helping put it in and out and this week for the first time she actually gave the course a shot. Ended up with 2 buoys (minus the gate) at 17mph long line. AND SHE LIKED IT! Your statement " 1) had the typical beginner broken stack / hips back 2) neither of them held their position through the wakes 3) both of them let up through the wakes and then pulled again past the second wake." Describes her style to a T. How did you help your nannies get through this phase and find that stack position through the wake?

 

I want to keep it fun for her and avoid as many of the big crashes across the wake as possible. If she really gets the addiction and pushes herself to get that next buoy and falls hard in the process, it would be of her choice and not mine and with a pre-teen daughter that means everything.