gavski

@adamhcaldwell - good question...i talked at length with Goenn Campbell about this and he recommended i give it a try as a means to soften the over stiff supershell. I guess he felt that one of the aspects missing from hardshell setups - apart from the powershell, was the ability for the ski to washout/ feather the hard edge that is set as you approach the 1st wake in the same way that a rubber boot does.. As soon as i tried it, the ski felt smoother and more progressive from hook up through to edge change... What i am struggling with at the moment is the pinned cuff. I am generating huge force through to the back of the cuff straight into my achillies - i have bent a couple of steel plates used to lock the cuff fwd....i have removed it for the time being until i get though the ‘start of season pain barrier’... My RS-1 rear is aggled fwd approx 15deg, and the supershell was at 18deg..maybe i should reduce the front to match the rear.?..i have also cut out the plastic side panels from the inside of the RS-1 boot.. The final modification made was to drill out the cuff rivets and cant the cuff over to match my lower leg...i have to say, that feels great...the boot feels balanced - no more bias to one side...

No bend. No effect on the release..

Yup....this is what I use... I then used it as a template to make a 5mm spacer, but found that was too much of a lift..

FW only added his heel lift weeks before he won the worlds...his stance on the ski was night and day different... I have a heel lift because my femur is unusually long...but i know that, because i had it measured and compensated for...the difference it made to my movement patterns is plain to see..just like with FW... Fore/ aft alignment is waay narrower than latteral...so getting somewhere close is better than leaving it uncorrected..remember, we are talking about balance at extreme ranges of motion, way outside the norm, not simply walking...

Not sure.. but he is a clear 1sec clear of the rest, which is huge...aside from his technique, his setup is waaay superior... Wonder if nate can ski as well in a hardshell?? I reckon if the time was taken to set it up for him properly before his first set, he would rip....

Sorry for the long link: http://harbskisysems.blogspot.com/2017/01/hirscher-before-boot-changes-that-are.html An example of Worldcup of boot tech experts getting it wrong...

Forgive the snow skiing references...still valid, nontheless... Optimal Footbed - What does it mean in skiing? Why we post the footbeds. If the footbeds are doing their job, then the ankle will be at (or close to) neutral subtalar alignment when the skier stands on the footbeds in the skiing stance. This is where the ankle is positioned to transfer load from the foot (heel) up into the leg without that load tending to roll the ankle inward or outward. When a skier tips a ski on edge with engagement (edge hold), the ski tends to push back – this is often referred to as “pressuring” the ski. The pressure underfoot pushes up into the leg through the foot and ankle. If the calcaneus is everted when the skier stands on the footbed (the foot is “pronated”), then when this pressure pushes up into the foot and ankle, it tends to increase (or worsen) the eversion and pronation. This often causes the knee to roll too far to the inside (making it difficult to release) and it can cause enough internal rotation of the tibia to make the tail of the ski wash out. Posting the inside of the footbed helps to keep the ankle closer to neutral when the pressure comes into the foot and ankle. If the calcaneus is inverted on the footbed (“supinated”), then when the pressure pushes up into the foot and ankle, it tends to roll the ankle further to the outside. This actually flattens the ski (un-edges it) when the skier is trying to hold it on edge. Posting the outside edge of the footbed keeps the ankle closer to neutral and helps to prevent it from rolling outward and un-edging the ski. The need for articulation A human being standing upright is not stable – we have to work constantly to maintain our balance. If you faint, you will fall down! We learn how to balance as a baby and young child, so we don’t think about it. However, it is happening any time that we are standing up. When we stand with both feet on the ground, we maintain our lateral balance by leaning on one leg or the other. If we start to “lose our balance” to the left, for the briefest moment we have more weight on our left leg and we can push ourselves back to the center. In skiing, most of our balance is on one foot at a time – sometimes entirely on one foot. How do we maintain lateral balance when we take away one foot? We need to be able to push against one side of the foot or the other. This creates the leverage needed to keep us upright. Try this yourself... stand on one foot on a hard surface, and have someone push you gently to one side or the other. If you are pushed toward the inside, you’ll press the arch and big-toe side of your foot harder onto the oor. If you are pushed to the outside, you’ll press the little-toe side of your foot down onto the oor. These aren’t our only reactions to maintain balance. You‘ll lean your body, reach with your arms, and move the other leg around trying to stay on one foot. Our foot is quite narrow, and if we want to balance on one at a time we need to keep our balance centered within the width of the foot. That’s only a few cm of travel in either direction before we “lose” our balance. However, the more we can do with our foot, the less we have to do with our upper body, and that’s more efficient. Now, stand on a squishy, deep carpet and try the test again. You’ll find that your foot has to roll farther to either side before you find the support that you need to push against in order to regain your balance. In skiing, if our foot has to roll farther to find balance, then we will have a harder time edging the ski and controlling its edge angle, and we’ll be wasting effort by moving all of our body to stay in balance. This is what happens if we have too flat of a heel cup in our footbed (for the mobile and/or pronating foot); too soft of an arch; or too large of a boot. Now, find a footbed with a high, stiff arch – one that fills your arch when you stand on it and is hard to push down or compress with the foot. (If you don’t have one, wedge some dense foam underneath the arch of a softer footbed.) Stand again on the hard floor with this footbed and repeat the one-footed balance tests. Since the soft- floor-test made it diffcult to balance, you might think that filling in the arch would work the opposite way, making it easier to balance. However, this isn’t usually the case. If the arch of the footbed is too high or too unyielding (stiff or dense), then the foot cannot roll to the inside to create the push against the floor that helps us regain balance. If we have this situation in skiing, we lose the fine-tuning of our balance and of the edge hold. In extreme situations, the skier loses the ability to roll the ski on edge – the foot cannot roll inward at all. This can be the result of a footbed with too high or stiff of an arch; having a footbed that is too wide, so that the arch is blocked (prevented from moving in and downward) by impingement with the inner boot wall; or by having a boot that fits too tightly next to the arch and ankle, preventing the navicular and the medial malleolus from moving inward. The footbeds that we make need to reflect both aspects of their role – having the correct base angle to help the foot and ankle deal with pressure loads, and having the correct arch height and fliesability to give the foot the support and articulation it needs to maintain balance. The more footbeds that you make and the more diversity of skiers and feet that you work with, the more you will see the need to custom-tailor each footbed for each skier. The indoor one and two-footed tests help you to assess the efficacy of your footbeds. If you can watch skiers skiing with your footbeds, and with other footbeds that are non-ideal, you’ll learn to see the influence of the footbed on the skier’s on-snow performance. This forms the base....next you then have to consider the boot fit....then the cuff & fore/ aft alignment. Then the balance tests static and dynamic, (floor and on snow) then readjust and refine...

Nate is in a rubber boot...the d3 t-factor is stiffer laterally than a cutt down hardshell. i can’t the same internal rotation from the like of FW, TW, WA or CP. I know for sure that FW has a footbed with a heal lift...shortly after he won the worlds, europeans and became no1.. Not an expert, just read around and extensivley researched the subject - like you...i am open to all ideas/ opinoins..i have tried most, been subjected to good and bad setups. As i said wayback, this is a devisive and misunderstood subject..be wary of someone claiming to be a world cup boot tech...many an elite athlete has been handicapped by a so called expert...jow many of these experts ski at an elite level and understand the movements required to ski at that level? You are already waaaaaaay above 99.9% of them both in knowledge and skiiang ability....

@adamhcaldwell - “The droping of the arch and rolling of the foot is what allows the knee to move over the inside edge of the ski more and producing more control over the roll angle.” But only in one direction, to the inside, which might not be desired on your onside... I agree a flexing arch is critical, but not an arch that flops flat or is pressed flat to begin with - this would create a bias the towards the inside...you want to have a knee that tracks straight...when you walk, does your knee drop inside?? I somehow doubt it....do you think a deadlift squat in the gym with knees that track inwards is optimal? I tried a set without my footbed and it didnt work for me...my arch ached like a bitch, and my equilibrium felt slightly off centre...like a hard shell without the cuff cut down -but weidly in the opposite direction as the the flattened arch moved my lower leg away from the outside of the cuff.. I live in barefeet and flip flops, so i get the whole footbed argument. I even have barefoot running shoes..however, in the ‘normal’ case, my foot is free to move with only my bodyweight...in a ski boot, yiu are clamping the foot down into an unnatural state and then loading it with 5 x your bodyweight.... personally, i would rather have a foot held ‘naturally’ with a footbed that allows controlled flexing of the arch. My knee tracks forewards, not inwards with any loads being transmitted through my skeleton in alignment - as it was designed for..not off kilter becuase my foot has been rolled flat = ankle rolled on = knee tracking inwards etc... As i mentioned to you before, you might have a foot that has a naturally low arch, so this works for you..i am loving all your r&d & innovation, but on this point, i will have to disagree...be wary of the info in ‘skiers manifesto’- sounds convincing, but it is written by scientists - not specialists with 50yrs + in the game and over 10000 documented skiboot alignments...the info is sound and great for general footwear, but not for skiing dynamics.....just sayin’....

Awesome news - will you be accepting occasional guest skiers for drop in sets?

@ozski - just wondered why you went for the 67 as opposed to the 66”?

@adamhcaldwell - what liner do you use in your hardshell? And how did you cut out the bottom and still make it fit the boot/ your foot? I have a spare strada liner that i might experiment on....

@adamhcaldwell - What an amazing discovery...i have cut down the outside of my boot by another 5mm or so...not wanting to do anything by halves, i drilled out the ankle rivets and pulled to boot apart..the plan is to align the cuff to my lower leg. I have worked out a neat ankle rivet replacement that will allow easy removal and refitting of the cuff and a way of adjusting the lateral cuff cant...i also sprayed up the boot in Denali colours..but i am not convinced that i have the right shade of blue... Anymore thoughts of whether you are now able to switch between a double boot to rtp with little or no change in set up?? Does your recent double boot revelation change your thoughts on the different ski set ups?

@adamhcaldwell - awesome video...very enlightening...now that you have found out what works, will this change your fin and ski set up numbers that you published with the new CG fin for “double boot”? Are you now able to swap over the double vapor bindings to your hardshell and kicker and not change the fin etc?? Interesting that you can swap out the vapor front and your hardshell with no impact on your skiing or setup..

a photo of your boot would be great as a reference to work against....

@BraceMaker - the injectable foam liners exists in the snow ski world, but i am mot entirely sure about their effectiveness...once again, a boot that is baldly/ not aligned to you but a snug foam filled fit is still no good....it’s just snug.... @disland - very accurate observation. @dchristman - sad truth is that not even the manufactures have it figured out...... Found this from the Roxa Skates site - it is the Reflx Supershell: What do you notice about the heel to toe height ratio?? Why do we have it mounted flat??

@skialex - I would be interested to see how you modified the cuff to be angled outwards...interestingly the new supershell has this feature incorporated... The further up the foot/ leg you make your adjustments, the greater the amount you have to make...canting underfoot requires the smallest amount of correction, however is a the hardest to achieve simply...(does that sentence even make sense???)) @adamhcaldwell - fully agree with you re: surface underfoot effecting you’d ability to balance....don’t forget that static balance is very different from dynamic balance...just because your setup is good for stationary balance, doesn’t necessarily make for good balance when moving...balance required to ride a bicycle is different to balancing a stationary bicycle...

@adamhcaldwell - were those footbeds you tried ‘custom’? I hate footbeds that are bought off the shelf - they make my feet really hurt...if you cut the footbed down to 3/4 length, you will still have the balls of your feet and toes touching the ski/ hardshell or liner...remember that a ‘soft’ footbed is not spongey and soft...i am only referring to the arch support...your foot is held in neutral and your arch is allowed to flex and move naturally...it is not blocked or held....you maybe one of the lucky ones that doesn’t need a footbed to have a ‘subtalar’ neutral foot.. @Fehlindra - i think you would benefit hugely from cut down hardshells....

You can heat the boot up to flatten the sole...that would go some way to redressing the tendency for hardshells to position your heel lower than your toes....if you place the boot on a hard surface and press the front of the boot down - so the the flat area under the ball of the foot is flat, you wil notice that the heel of the boot lifts. The amount of lift is different between the various boot manufactures and can be quite marked..if you were to place a ‘wedge’ under the heel that filled this space, i guarantee that you will be in a better fore/aft balance position...remember, these boots are modified hockey/ skate boots that for some reason are missing the heel peice.... Apart from your bare feet and a couple of specialist running shoes, almost all of our footwear has a heel raised higher than the toes...especially those that require ‘dynamic’ balance... The other slight issue with hardshell liners is that there is very little pressure applied on-top on the toes, unlike in a rubber boot...the issue is that lack of pressure applied to the top of your toes effects your ability to maintain ‘fine’ fore/aft balancing...only when you rock back enough for your toes to touch the top of the liner/ hardshell, will your body react...by that stage, you have fallen back onto your rear foot....this was discoverd by AM... you can test this for yourself..stand barefoot, feet parallel..gently lean back and take note of what feebback you are getting you are about to tip backwards...what happens to your toes? How quickly can yu react?. Now get someone to apply a downwards pressure to your toes and repeat...were you able to pick up a rearwards movement earlier? Could youl apply a corrective movement quicker?? Were you getting quicker feedback?? Try sticking some foam ontop of the toe section of the liner..the idea is to pack out the space between the liner and the boot...$100 you can fit your fingers in the space - especially if you have thin liners....the foam needs to be thick enough to apply a snug downwards pressure to your toes....

The more i think about it, (sweeping statement coming up) all the problems that ‘we’ have been experiencing have all been since we switched to hardshells...i firmly believe that because of the fact that the hardshell provides sub-optimal alignment, everything else has been a sticking plaster to offset this problem...i don’t seem to remember anyone on rubber boots having any similar issues at all.... If you get your front boot aligned properly, both lateral and fore/aft, then everything else just clicks into place. I appreciate that a rigid rear boot is probably not going to help matters unless you get that aligned also - just like @mwetskier......I guess the optimum setup would be hardshell front and rubber rear.... Just a point of clarification on terminology....canting is the wedging of the boot/ binding plate in order to facilitate a knee that tracks fwds over the CL of the ski...laterally rotaing the boot is pivoting the boot either clockwise or anti-clockwise - normally associated with the rear boot...

@adamhcaldwell - i would definitely aim for the front knee to track straight over the CL of the ski. This will give you the most balance to your turns - ie it requires equal amounts of pressure to get the ski on edge. Think of your car with neutral tracking of the wheels...otherwise it will be heavily biased to one side - your HS... I have had my front boot laterally rotate outwards - i couldn't work out why i couldn't ski anymore until i took a good look at my strada boot..difficult to spot that it had rotated outwards because the securing screws had loosened slightly.... As for the rear boot - sadly i have no insight..i know that there is some 'magic' tuning to be had as KLP 'whispered' my ski setup that included the rear boot.. tbh, i have only rotated out the rear boot to release lateral pressure on my knee and to allow the hips more range of movement...i have seen some rear bindings inwardly rotated...looks awkward..whenever i have skied on a rtp, i could always feel my heel twisting out to the side of the ski - so i went to a rear boot..having said that, my rear boot is completely loose - it might as well be a rtp, but my heel is held laterally.. sorry - not much help..

I feel your pain...try removing 1deg off your wing,and moving your binding fwd 1 hole....or 1/8”... Cold water skiing has been discussed at length on this forum. So the theory about why and how is out there.... Try reducing the boat speed a little...water temp about 60F, take 0.5 mph off...in the winter months i would rather be skiing shortlines etc at a slightly reduced (factored) boat speed than hacking around full speed undoing all my progress made over the summer... (For every 1degC below 20degC water temp, i take 0.2kph off the speed) therfore 18degC = 57.6kph, 15degC = 57kph etc)

Some reading around the subject - will give you a better understanding and a quickfix that i have successfully used on snow and water.... https://goo.gl/2wP54v

This will give you an idea about the power of canting...not a great video, but you will get the idea:

@adamhcaldwell - my bad....a rigid/ hard footbed is obvious - i think...cork or hard plastic that does not deflect/ move at all..your foot is locked in place, unable to flex/ move... The other footbed - think SIDAS: https://goo.gl/FUqHNN The material is a little more flexible and just as supportive under foot...however, the arch support is a little more pliable. in other words your arch is supported, but still able to move/ flex in a natural fashion, as opposed to just collapsing flat...imagine running with a flat foot - ouch....imagine running with a rigid footbed - ouch... The footbed is not padded, thick, spungey etc. i have cut my footbed down to 3/4 length so that my toes and ball of foot are in direct contact with the liner...only my arch and heel are supported...