kirkbauer

I don't know if I accidentally hit something from time to time, or if it just happens randomly, but about once per day I end up getting into a "Change Event" screen that I can't get out of. Normally I just leave it up or I have to turn the battery switch off/on again to reboot the system. Is this user error or something wrong with my boat? Here is a video that I took showing the problem. Funny enough while taking this video I did get out of it eventually and that's the first time I've been able to do that. Perhaps it was that I hit the Profiles button at just the right time? Ignore the beeping -- I was sitting at my dock and that's the shallow water alert.

So I had an incident with backing the boat of of my boathouse with the bimini up and bending it as you see in the picture below. It's a brand new boat so I'm not completely sure what the bimini should look like, but I think it bent the two long poles that attach to the windscreen. Is it possible to get replacements for those poles? Is that something I go directly to Mastercraft for?

@Mastercrafter Your point is valid, but I want to note that a Tesla requires a lot more semiconductors than a normal vehicle. Although I think that's just an argument that Tesla has superior supply-chain management, at least in this area. Tesla is much more vertically integrated.

@Jody_Seal I'm a sucker for this kind of stuff, but it is tough to find out how much of this is accurate. But I did find that this 994H can carry 77,000lb per load. So that's only 6.5 loads for 500,000lb. How many loads can be done per hour? It depends on how far it is driving I guess, but I'm sure it doesn't drive far. So perhaps one hour for 500,000lb? That's 150 gallons of fuel. That Tesla battery will last at least 300,000 miles. That's 2,000mpg. That's better than your typical car isn't it? Of course, to properly compare, we'd need to figure out how much fuel is required to mine the materials to create an internal combustion engine, which also won't be insignificant. And the energy required to smelt it, etc. And the energy required to extract, transport, and refine the gasoline.

@Clydesdale Agreed completely (except that I think Teslas specifically are great for long trips, but we can agree to disagree on that!). Cold weather, towing, living somewhere very rural, not having a garage or a place to charge at home, etc, are all good reasons to avoid an electric vehicle. And just like one-size-fits-all doesn't work for normal cars or boats, the same is true for electric cars. If you commute round trip <50 miles per day, then almost any electric vehicle would be great for you. If you mostly go long distances, then vehicles with larger batteries and a great charging network are the only option. I also agree -- unless you want to build a very specific electric competition ski boat that can only operate say 30 minutes between charges, then the weight of the current battery technology is going to be a big limiting factor for a ski boat versus a wake boat. There are, however, some promising low-weight battery technologies being developed that might completely change that though.

The Tesla batteries last for a lot longer than I expected. 300,000 to 500,000 miles. That’s about $0.05/mi if you keep the car that long and replace the battery. Of course the new battery will likely be much better than the original. And you almost no maintenance other than that (and tires).

@Jody_Seal almost everything in that post is factually incorrect. I'm going to address the false information in the order in which it appeared. Yes, there is valid concern around gas taxes paying for the roads, but gas taxes have always been an iffy way to pay for roads. Why would a car that gets 10mpg need to pay more to maintain the roads than a car that gets 60mph? In Georgia, we have to pay a separate EV tax to maintain the roads. The average electrical service is not 100 amps. For the last ~25 years most new homes have 200 amps. My home has 400 amps. Yes, there are homes with 100 amp service out there, but I wouldn't call it the average. It's also possible to upgrade your service to a higher amperage (not cheap but doable). And most electric vehicle drivers charge overnight when the power grid isn't doing much else. The MOST you can charge at, even with a hardwired Tesla wall charger, is 48 amps @ 240V, not 75. You use a 60 amp breaker for 48 amps. Finally, about half of the Tesla owners I know charge out of a regular 15-amp outlet (charging at a rate of 12 amps @ 120V). Using the math about how many EVs can charge on a street with 25 homes (which I have no idea if that's accurate), it would be 37 EVs out of 25 homes if they are charging at 12 amps 120V. My vehicle would get 84 miles of range charging at 12amps for 12 hours each night. That's plenty for most people. The "average speed including charging time" of 20mph is a joke. When your car is charging, you're sleeping. Why would you count that time? Now, why would it take 10 hours to charge a 16kWh battery if you were charging at 75amps? It would actually take right about an hour. But that doesn't make sense because you can only charge at a rate of 3.7kW per hour (which is ~30amp at 120 or ~15amp at 240). So, again, the 75amps required to charge is hyperbole. But even at 3.7Kw per hour, that's about 4.5 hours for a full charge. And, finally, the most egregious error in your post (perhaps?) is the cost of electricity. $1.16 per kWh? I just Googled for the most expensive electricity in the US and I get $0.34/kWh in Hawaii. Here in Georgia, I pay $0.15 during the day and $0.04 when charging overnight. So, to re-do the math using my rates, 16kWh battery @ $0.04/hr = $0.64. Google says the range is 53 miles not 25 miles, so that's just about $0.01 per mile.

You can’t really trust an article that considers the government buying actual goods and services a subsidy. SpaceX does better work for less money than all of the competition, and therefore has won military and NASA contracts.

I feel like a lot of different things are being comingled here, and most of them have nothing to do with boats :) Are electric boats viable? Are electric tow vehicles better? Is electric propulsion better, in general? Is electric propulsion better for the environment? Should there be government mandates to accelerate the adoption of electric vehicles? The reality is that the answer to most of these is "yes" but not necessarily all of them, and in most cases the answer depends on the specific situation.

@Mastercrafter If/when you decide on Cybertruck vs F150 Lightning, pay extra attention to the charging networks. I don't know what charging network the F150 will use, but unless it truly competes with what Tesla has, the Cybertruck is likely going to be the only option for long-distance driving. Also, if Uber drivers are replacing brake pads on their Teslas, they are driving it wrong. I'm an aggressive driver and in 6 years and 50,000 miles on my Tesla Model S, the brake pads were worn only 10%. Of course you can use your brakes all that you want to (and they are heavy vehicles) but it's so easy to almost never touch the brake pedal.

One more comment. Electric vehicles came first, but battery technology was horrible. Then gasoline engines took over. And gasoline engines are amazing. But battery and electric motor technology has grown so much that the tables have turned. As a thought experiment: if things had gone differently, let's say we hadn't discovered oil, or let's say that batteries were better ~100 years ago. Let's say that everybody was driving electric cars. Then I invented a gasoline-powered car. How would I possibly market that invention? I think people would think that my "gas-powered car" was a crazy idea, far inferior to what they already had. Specifically I think I'd hear comments like this: Wait, I'd have to have a tank of liquid explosives in my car? What happens if I get in an accident? Wait, I'd have to go to a special store to "recharge" my car once or twice per week? Wait, I'd need to get my oil changed once or twice per year? Wait, I'd have this Rube-Goldberg-esque contraption with thousands of moving parts instead of a simple electric motor? Wait, my car sits there and wastes fuel when I'm waiting in line and not even moving? Wait, if I accelerate quickly it wastes more fuel than accelerating slowly? Wait, my car would exhale dangerous gas whenever it was running? Wait, we'd have to re-engineer parking garages, tunnels, etc, to safely vent that gas? Wait, my air conditioning and heater won't work unless the "engine" is running? Wait, I can't leave my air conditioning running while I'm in a store on a hot summer day? Wait, I can't park outside a Starbucks and do work and listen to the radio without running out of batteries? Unless I run the engine the whole time?

@Bruce_Butterfield I think you are correct that Teslas are very cool cars, but I think you are incorrect to consider them high-end or luxury cars for only the wealthier people among us. A base model 3 is fully loaded at $42,690. According to Consumer Reports, the average new-car price in 2022 is now $47,000. I'm not saying that $43k is cheap, but it's obviously below average. Additionally, for the more savvy consumers out there, they'll realize that they'll be saving a ton of money for the next 5-10 years after buying a Tesla. Virtually zero maintenance (no oil changes, no emissions testing, no transmission fluid, no changing of brake pads, etc). And obviously you'll save a lot of money on gas. So the Total Cost of Ownership is extremely attractive compared to the average new vehicle. I've said it above and I'll say it again. I'm not an environmentalist. I bought my first Tesla 8 years ago (when it definitely was only for the "rich") and it was the best vehicle I had ever owned (and I've owned some great vehicles). The driving experience is superior. The acceleration is incredible. The mobile connectivity, free upgrades, etc, are great. Autopilot is amazing and takes so much load off of the driver. I never realized how much I hated getting gas until I had a Tesla and I wake up every morning with a "full tank". For the first 6 of those 8 years of Tesla ownership, my wife had a nice gas-powered vehicle. But we never took it on road trips. The Tesla driving experience, especially Autopilot, more than made up for any slight inconvenience on charging. So you can talk all day about government subsidies, lithium mining, carbon emissions, coal power plants, charging delays, etc, etc, but if you haven't owned a Tesla, you just don't know what you are missing. It's a superior automobile to almost anything else ever produced, and for most (but not all) driving applications. Like I said, I've been an owner for 8 years, and I wouldn't drive anything else, not even when other options were sitting in my garage. Unless I need to take a load of crap to the dump, then I'll borrow a pickup truck.

@wettek69 my guess is that at least 50% of filling up is for daily driving, probably much more. That's not needed for EVs. Only road trip driving needs supercharging. It will vary heavily by brand, but for Tesla, I have only waited to charge one time in 7 years and 50+ road trips. The number of supercharger stations have exploded along with Tesla ownership. Also you know how busy it is before you arrive so you can choose charging stops that aren't very busy. Until you experience it for yourself you just won't understand the awesomeness of driving a Tesla. I know I didn't.

I have never towed with any of my Teslas (I live on a lake), but there are some misconceptions here about how charging for a Tesla works. I have gone on a TON of long-distance trips with my Model S, Model X, and Model 3. There are Superchargers almost everywhere. Your first leg leaving home gets you about 3 hours of driving. Then, you can charge for 20 minutes and drive 2 more hours. Or you can charge for an hour and drive 3 more hours. Charging to 90-100% takes way longer than charging to 60-70%. For me, I'm happy to have a bathroom break every 2-3 hours. And I usually do the "charge 20min drive 2hr" option unless I want to sit down for a nice meal, in which case I'll make the stop an hour and then I can drive for 3 more. So, an 9 hour drive in a gas car, if you are taking minimal breaks, will take maybe 9 hours 30min. The same drive in my Tesla will take 10 hours (three 20min charging stops). It's really not a big difference, and I personally enjoy 20 minute breaks (bathroom, snacks, drinks, etc). The whole picture will be decently worse if you were towing a trailer though. And for anything besides a Tesla I believe it is not nearly as convenient (much fewer fast-charging options, if any).

Well, except maybe the weight issue. With current technology I think it would be a heavier boat, which is not great for the wakes. Lithium Air batteries might solve that. But I agree with the rest of your points, as I'm also a 100% Tesla household. It's just superior technology; any environmental benefits are just icing on the cake from my perspective.

That's fine with me. I'm not an environmentalist, and I'm not anti-oil. Use the oil to make the boat, but don't waste it pushing it around when electricity can do it much better.

Yes, my guess that a proper water skiing boat would be the last one to go, hopefully once they have found much lighter energy storage options. But overall, pleasure boating could be a great use-case for electric propulsion. I think it makes the most sense for a boat that is stored at a dock, etc. They spend much more time sitting than going, and for many boats, weight isn't a huge issue. For a boat that is stored in your garage and then transported to the lake, weight probably matters more, and you are going to want more than a couple of hours of usable time once you get it in the water. But for boats sitting at the dock when not in use, getting electricity to them is easier and safer than getting fuel to them. In other words, here at my home, running a charger down to my boat is easier, cheaper, and safer, than trying to install some sort of at-home gasoline-distribution system. It would be really cool to never have to go to the marina to get fuel. I agree it is best to stay away from political discussions here, so I'll try to do that now. But there are just so many advantages to electric propulsion and most of them have nothing to do with politics or the environment. As I mentioned before, I'm not an environmentalist, I just appreciate less waste and more elegant solutions. Here are some things to consider: You can charge at home or at the dock (very convenient). You can mostly charge at night when electricity usage is at its lowest point and power plants are sitting idle. This makes better use of our existing infrastructure and will probably save you money (e.g. my overnight energy costs are almost nothing here in Georgia). Better and more instant torque Much simpler and less maintenance than internal combustion We could argue about whether we'll run out of oil or not, but one thing is almost for certain: as we use the easier sources of oil, we will have to turn to more difficult sources of oil, which likely means more expensive. And internal combustion engines only run on oil, that's it. Electric motors can run on anything -- not directly, obviously, but we have a ton of ways to generate electricity, and we are likely to find even more ways in the future As our need for oil reduces, if that money was redirected towards research I think we have some real good possibilities for the future: much better solar panels, fusion, and plenty we can't even think of right now. Ultimately, as long as vehicles are tied to oil, our options are limited. Think of it as a society that doesn't have the concept of money. An economy that solely works on the barter system is significantly hampered. When money is introduced as a medium of exchange, society prospers. It's the same thing here -- electricity is the medium of exchange. Any electric vehicle can use it, and there are tons of ways to produce it. You don't have to design each vehicle for each specific energy source.

Everybody, thank you so much for all of the answers to newbie questions. I was able to drain the ballast tank on the trailer and now it is empty. Next time I'm in the water I'll try to partially fill it again and see if the gauge works. Perhaps it is just a gauge problem. I'm a very rusty out-of-shape skier so I'm thinking for now better to have less weight anyways than perfect boat balance. Now I just need to wait for some better weather; the weather got cold again right when my boat arrived.

Here is under my observer seat. Is that the ballast tank on the left? It isn't transparent so I can't tell if anything is in there. When you turn on the pump to empty the tank, does it go out the side right next to the observer seat (same place where I see water going out when I'm trying to fill it)?

@FSSPCat water only comes out of the side of the boat when I fill, but not when I drain. So am I right to assume that either (1) the ballast tank is full and the draining method isn't working or (2) somehow something is blocked and the water is going over the side instead of filling the tank?

OK, so based on the video (if anybody has time to watch it), what's going on? If the ballast is full and you keep filling it, does it spill overboard? Could that be my problem, that the ballast is already 100% full? So perhaps the emptying system isn't working?

My ballast system only has a single tank (according to the display), so it wouldn't seem that it would be for balancing the boat, unless perhaps it is only on the observer side to compensate for a boat with only the driver inside? I made a video showing how it is behaving and would love some opinions on what's happening here. I don't have a way to get the boat to a dealer so I'm hoping to solve this on my own. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaLuNgm2iVE

Thanks everybody so far! I think I'm good, except for the ballast thing. I'll play with it more and probably post a video for feedback.

Up until my first boat was delivered yesterday, we were an all-electric household, with two Teslas. I'm not an environmentalist; they are just awesome vehicles in pretty much every way. On the other hand, I do hate waste, and I think EVs are less wasteful, so I'm happy about that. I have also been happy that I haven't been having to buy gas -- at least until I start using that boat! I think electric boats will absolutely be the future, especially for watersports. They do spend most of their time parked or at idle. The challenge will be the charging infrastructure -- tossing some solar panels on the roof of your dock isn't going to do it unless you only use the boat a couple of hours a week or so. Each of my Tesla chargers are 50 amps and it can take as much as 8 hours to fully charge (if I'm pretty much empty, which isn't very common). I can drive for ~3 hours on that charge. Boats use more energy than cars do, so you'd probably want even more batteries and even better charging. But for us water skiers, it is probably not going to happen. From my perspective, there doesn't seem to be a lot of money in the pure ski boat category, so it's going to take a while before they'll want to do a full electric redesign. That's my guess. More importantly, the weight of the batteries probably won't lend itself to the kinds of wakes that we like. That might change in the future if we get lighter batteries (e.g. Lithium Air).

I've never owned or even operated a Prostar before, and I just had my 2015 Prostar delivered. I read through the manual but I feel like it wasn't very useful, so I have a few questions I'm hoping some of you can help me with. 1) My boat has a screen where I can fill/drain the ballast tanks. Presumably this might be helpful for wakeboarding. When I try to fill the ballast tank, I hear a pump running, but water just shoots out from the side of the hull next to the observer's seat. I don't think it is actually filling any ballast tank anywhere. Is something broken on my boat? 2) At speed the boat wants to turn right pretty quickly if you don't hold on to the wheel. Is that normal? 3) The manual mentions multiple batteries, but I'm pretty sure my boat has just one battery, under the port side rear storage container. 4) I'll be doing slalom skiing but not on a course. When I set up a profile, does it matter if I set it up as "Practice" versus "Tournament"? Thanks in advance!