208maverick

I think the simplest and most direct way to combat this is to put a GoPro about 3' off the bottom and actively film what's taking place as a ski boat goes over top. I don't think you're going to see much bottom disturbance at all, but film would give you some pretty good stuff to work with. If any of your ski group has scuba gear, about 30 minutes of playing around finding the right location, depth, etc... should give you everything you need.

Repaired shoulder is my throttle side. Pretty painless duty. Shoulder rehab is going exceptionally well. Labor Day skiing may not be out of the question, albeit VERY careful skiing.

... if you've ever had to pick your brother out of the water at high speed (seal training style) because he sent a drenching wall of water atop an amorous couple on a becalmed catamaran one night, and then crashed immediately thereafter, giving the male contingent of the amorous couple and opportunity to dive into the water and catch your brother with intent of serious bodily harm...

Thanks. I tend to heal up fast from crap, doc was thrilled with how his repairs went, and things seem to be progressing nicely so far, so I'm not gonna complain. I've got 52 straight summers of skiing the same lake, so if I have to miss one I guess it's OK. Besides, boat driving is fun and I can talk smack all summer long w/o having to back it up for a year. Any progress on your full boat vs rtp vs hrt dilemma? We've got Wiley hiwrap rear boots and I think at one point decided one was too tight, called wiley's, and they sent us a larger set of wraps (basically going from L to XL wraps, or maybe XL to XXL, or something like that) to make slipping in and out easier. It was an easy fix for us. Anyway, I know I've got a set of wraps hanging on the wall at the lake. It'll be 2 weeks before I head back up there, but if you're still trying to figure things out then I'll drop those in the mail to you and you can have a free pair of wraps to carve up and experiment with.

That was discussed, but the consensus was to try the shims first to make sure that addressed the problem as the amount of grinding was going to be excessive. (Boot fitter's comment was "... I think we're looking at a shop record here -- pretty sure we've never seen this much cant before...")

Thanks. That's the route I was going to follow if there wasn't already something out there available. (Shim angle is already known from snow ski measurements.)

As for sizing help on the Radar HRT, I typically wear 11.0 - 11.5 and have a wide, high volume foot, and fit the STD size just fine.

Me (age 60) and my brother (58) have skied with full front and back boots for the last 30 years and both made the switch late last season (him to Wiley's RTP and me to Radar's HRT). We both made the switch so we could go back to doing dock starts and kick into the back boot. We're strictly open water skiers and probably aren't going to notice the subtle nuances that make the difference between getting 3 balls or 4 on a course, but both of us are pleased with our respective choices. I personally went with the HRT because I like to have something behind my heel, and once up, I honestly don't notice the difference associated with not having a full back boot. My HRT is a BOA adjustment, and I've found that if I'm doing a dock start, I'll shove my foot in dry on the dock and tighten the BOA to feel comfortable. Once I take my foot out to do the dock start, I'm able to kick that back foot in relatively easy when it's wet but it's still secure enough that I don't have to adjust the BOA while skiing. If I'm doing deepwater starts, I'll shove my foot in while in the water and crank the BOA down while getting prepped for my pull out. Starting in the latter fashion, I'm able to get a little tighter fit on my back foot, but I'm not sure that it makes any difference in my skiing. I'd offer to give more feedback as the summer progresses, but my skiing plans are shot for the summer. (Went under the knife 3 weeks ago for a "... short-and-sweet-20-minute-procedure-to-remove-a-bone-spur-in-my-shoulder-that-will-leave-me-100%-in-6-days"...) and woke up 4 hours later with a completely re-built shoulder and 6-month recovery time.) Looking forward to 2024. LOL.

Does anyone have any suggestions for finding shims that I can slide between binding plates and ski top surface to cant the bindings outward? I've got a friend that is a great athlete but happens to be VERY bowlegged, and has always inexplicably struggled with snow skiing and water skiing (lot of leg fatigue in both sports, and way more than her fair share of pretty spectacular crashes). I took her along with me to my favorite snow ski shop last winter to help her upgrade her boots, and the salesman (a very experienced bootfitter) took one look at her legs and asked if her legs "wear out early" during a ski day. She noted that with her degree of bowleggedness, she's gotta be constantly on her outside edges, making her skis want to take off in opposite directions or forcing her leg muscles to hold her legs in an unnatural position 100% of the time. The fix there was to designate one ski as her left and one as her right, and then put some shims beneath her binding and ski topsheet so that her skis actually sit flat on the snow when she's in a normal stance. It made a noticeable difference in her snow skiing comfort, and that made me start thinking about how that would apply to water skiing. She skis on two just fine (albeit a much wider than normal ski stance) but has never been able to stay up on a slalom ski. I think her wide stance on two is a function of where those skis naturally position themselves to allow them to ride flat on the water beneath her bowed legs, and her crashes on one (always the ski darting to one side or the other as she tries to slip her back foot into the boot) are probably a function of the ski having to go on edge when she centers it beneath mass to get her back foot into the rtp. She's not been successful at doing a deepwater start with both feet in the bindings, so if I can find some shims (I'll match the angle of the shims they threw onto her snow skis) I'd like to experiment with that next time she attempts slalom by kicking a ski off. Thoughts??? Suggestions??? (My alternative is to jury-rig some shims, but that's less easily accomplished on the boat.)

I've got a little more water time under my belt on the Omni Wide so will chime back in with some observations. (FWIW, I'm 6'2" and 245#, am an open water skier, and am on the 69" Carbon Omni Wide.) I'm very much enjoying this ski -- would definitely make this purchase again. Deepwater starts are noticeably easier on me than on my previous Carbon V, but the biggest difference I'm seeing is in the reduced drag once up. With my Carbon V (and pretty much all previous skis) I'm used to shoulder and arm fatigue letting me know when to end any particular run (or the ski ends it for me when I get sloppy from fatigue) and really feeling it in my shoulders at night while trying to get to sleep. With the Omni Wide, my runs are noticeably longer, my quads and cardio are now the limiting factor which ends my run, and there is no pain at night in my shoulders. (Feeling fatigue in my quads after a weekend of skiing instead of in my shoulders and lats is a new experience for me... LOL.) It's more difficult for me to draw comparisons from a performance standpoint because I'm not sure how much of what I'm feeling on the water this summer (and good runs vs bad runs) is ski related versus new hip related, but my sense is that the Carbon Omni Wide may be a little more forgiving than the Carbon V (which is saying something because I loved the V for that trait) and that like the Carbon V, I'm very unlikely to find the limits to this ski as an open water skier. If I was chasing balls, my sense is that the Carbon V is probably the better ski, but as a guy that skis open water all the time, I'll choose the Omni Wide over the Carbon V for it's forgiveness and huge advantage in reduced drag. Both are great skis. The Omni Wide is going to let me ski more, with no limiting factors that affect how I ski.

Thought I'd close the loop on this. I made two changes that have made a big difference. Switched from a Connelly Carbon V to an HO Carbon Omni Wide (5/16" more width from tip of front boot thru the tail) and I built a beginner style ski handle (deep V to allow ski to ride inside the V) with my favorite handle. The new ski has enough less drag in deepwater starts to be noticeable, and being able to Nestle the ski in the V of the rope took care of the lack of front foot lateral control I have with the new hip.

Can finally report back. Got the Carbon Omni Wide in hand and had it side by side with the Connelly V last night as I swapped bindings over. The Omni Wide is about 5/16" wider than the V from the tip of the front boot all the way thru the tail. Difference in width is a little larger than I expected which is what I was hoping for. Skied it a couple times this am. It definitely has less drag on the deepwater starts than my V (not huge difference but noticeable) but the reduction in drag after up was VERY noticeable. I skied it enough to know i'm gonna like this ski. Looking forward to getting it on nice water and learning its ins and outs. 2 runs on marginal water aren't enough for me to tell differences between the two skis. (Honestly I think the rest of my skiing this summer is going to be more about learning to ski with a new hip than it is about learning a new ski.) Thanks to All on the feedback on skis.

Work blew up this week so just got my hands on the ski today. No water time until next week.

@MitchellM -- yeah, I'm expecting a subtle difference in the deepwater starts instead of something dramatic. (And it's the "wide" model that I've got coming and is the one marginally wider than the V in the forebody.) I think this ski is actually 1/4" wider in the tail than the V, which is probably what I'll feel on the starts more than anything. (That and the crash tonnage reduction program I'm on -- dropped 12# in July to make August more enjoyable to ski, and am targeting another 8.) Gonna find out I guess. But not today apparently. Checked Fed Ex tracking this am to see where the ski was in it's 300 mile journey from Wiley's to here, expecting delivery this afternoon. Apparently Fed Ex is sending the ski on an all expense paid trip to California, because it's currently in Oakland. Kind of a deflating start to my day. Lol.

So, here's what I've learned to date. The omni wide is about 3/8 of an inch wider than the standard omni at it's widest point. (It's also about an 1/8 " wider than Connelly's V and 1/4" wider than the Senate.) The omni "wide" is also the widest of the three at the tail by the same amounts. A carbon omni wide is gonna show up on my doorstep next week so will figure things out on the water next weekend.

"...This might sound crazy, but I've learned the hard way that your shorts make a big difference when it comes to drag. Heavy trunks that absorb water are a killer. Lightweight trunks make a HUGE difference..." Tight neoprene shorts are my friend for skiing. "... Have you thought about the HO Carbon Omni Wide?..." I only really considered a ski change as a stopgap measure [until my hip is at full strength again] because I have a great deal on a 71 Senate Alloy... Once I learned that ski was the same width as the 69 Senate, then that interest died. I think it probably makes more sense for me to use a drop ski and stick with the ski I'm most familiar with [and expect to use long term] to figure out any new quirks. "... I may go back to the dock start which never has the drag of starting from 0 with body and ski fully submerged. When you get the timing mastered its much easier than deep water..." I picked up and installed a Radar HRT in place of my back boot with this in mind. Will end up stepping off the back of another boat. Haven't really played much with that yet.

"... @Stevie Boy so just to spit ball here. The more surface area the ski has the more lift it has the less strain you should feel ASSUMING the angle of the ski to the water is pretty flat and the driver doesn't hammer you. Now if the ski is upright in the water that surface area isn't lift but is drag. I don't really like to talk to people about balling up in the water I think really what you want is a straight back, straight arms, flexed hips flexed knees and your back heel as close to your butt as you can get it. And then when the boat goes you are essentially rotating ontop of the ski which flattens the ski out in the water. When you are a "ball" your shoulders curve forwards and people tend to push with that back foot which turns the ski into a vertical plank and then they're finished the boat keeps moving and bang the handle pops out..." This is an awesome description and pretty much captures what I'm struggling with. You described very well how I typically pull out, having gravitated to this thru the years being a big guy on too small a ski. Pulling my back heel close to my butt while putting forward pressure with my front foot gets the ski riding high very quickly and my deep water starts take minimal effort. What I'm finding now however is that my hip is relatively weak in that particular position and I'm unable to force that ski flatter in the water, so it's riding more vertical in the water for a longer time, I'm collapsing into a ball, and creating a lot more drag. I think I'll drop the idea of a ski change and just go to a drop ski until my hip is strong enough to resume that technique.

"...I found it best not to change equipment after my THR (and back surgeries) - but I waited a year after my THR on the advice of my PT - and had no issues..." Both my doc and PT said I'd probably find little quirks until the hip is a year old, but both gave me the go ahead to both snow ski and water ski as long as I didn't get stupid and was willing to pay attention to signs of fatigue/pain. My recovery has gone so well I really didn't expect to have any problems water skiing and figured I'd be light years ahead of where I was last summer skiing with a severely pained hip. This particular little quirk was a bit of a surprise to me. LOL.

"...I recently stepped down from a 71" to 69" senate. The 71 was marginally easier to get up on. If the 69 is a 10 effort. The 71 was a 9.5..." Yeah, when I realized the 71 was the same width as the 69 I figured any advantage might be minimal... I was sorta hoping I was wrong and was counting on the collective wisdom here to tell me otherwise...

"... Change of technique may get you through, stay in a ball until you are going along, then slowly stand up. Even ride two skis or drop one until you get some strength back...." Coming out of that "ball" is where things go to hell... Hip is lacking in that particular movement right now [one of only 2 weak spots left with surgery recovery] and there's a short span where I've got little lateral control of the ski with that front foot. 1 out of 3 times it goes like clockwork, but if ANYTHING is off it's game over because there is no way for me to correct in that particular range of motion. I've actually found that fast, hard hit to work best for me right now, I think because that moment of instability is shortened. On the bright side, there's no hip pain involved in this, but it's taking its toll on my forearms and shoulders such that my runs are pretty short and sweet once up. Would be simplest and probably smartest for me to resort to the drop ski until hip strength improves a bit.

33-34 mph. All open water skiing.

Let's compare notes later in the season. I've got 40+ yrs in double boots and am switching to a Radar HRT rear plate (picking it up tomorrow) to play with this summer so I can kick in. I'm 8 months into a new hip.

Awesome -- thx! Is there anything similar out there for boot position?