ejj

I worked in the alpine industry for years. I imagine the cost paradigm is similar. The retail margins werenot that great on skis--30-40 depending on the model. The dealers made their real profit on the extra garbage. Softgoods, bindings, etc. The dealer cost on that stuff was 50% or better. The companies offered employee purchase deals. These deals were well below dealer cost. These were typically @35% of MSRP. Last thought, the ski companies biggest cost was marketing... Popping skis out of the press is pretty cheap.

@vtjc if you can leave it in for a few nights, you are better off. Not much growth that time of year, and the water in your boat is kept above freezing by the warmer lake water.

My family has had many sailboats--large and small--over the years. Florida is not a great environment for the boats, as they see salt and lots and lots of sun all year long. We have had the best luck buying from the northern climes and freshwater areas. Shorter season, less sun, no salt. Happy used owner.

@doonez -hopefully the next cup can take the good from this one and ditch the drama. I know people want it to be cheaper with smaller boats, but those 72s were cool to watch. I'd like to see more challengers and another defender or two.

I guess the real win goes to Boeing for the foil management computer that helped Oracle win the last 8 races. Apparently there will be a lawsuit... Is using a computer to stay foiling cool? Yes and no. Particularly not to the Challengers. However, pretty cool to have a little device that can actually do that stuff. And why didn't Team Emirates do the same thing? The measurement committee approved the change... Kiwis sailing? Excellent all-around. But for helm I would take Ainslie or Spithill anyway. Barker did not impress me. Boat building? NZ is a good spot. We had a refit down there and it was nearly half the cost of the US.

America's Cup has never been about nationality. It's always involved super-rich folks earning some bragging rights. The race started as a contest centered on pushing the boats and sailors to the limits. Big wild fast boats. There are several citizenship-level based one-design races. This is not one, nor should it be.

I know people have seen the new lines. Any pics of skis for the other half?

Hmm. I skied the Satori like a wakeboard too. I might get one of those and keep the Theory.

A lot of people here go for the tournament tow-boats, but the reality of those with young kids is not the best. Moving the motor to the back is awesome for the family. I love the pics of kids skiing, but also love the knee boards and wakeboards I see I those pics. The key is to have fun together, and my girls love going for a ride on the hotdog. (Yikes, don't take that out of context.). I hope they will love skiing, but more importantly they love being on the water with me and my wife. (5 and 8 y.o. girls, I/O with horrific wake, public lakes, never in a course.)

@bananaron I just got back from a week at Woman Lake. Skied one morning at 55*. This summer has been ridiculous.

@kona, that is quite a collection of skis! I have an 09 Theory with an HO Level boot. Ski is good. Just tried a Satori, and I like it but it is sooooo different. Slower speed and easy to get air. Edging and cuts were mediocre compared to the Theory. Interested in getting something new--how did you like the senate or free ride in comparison?

I skied the Satori this weekend. I usually ski an 09 (I think) Theory. I never ski the course, public lakes, etc. I love cutting it up, but water conditions can be pretty crappy. I have ever had trouble getting up behind my I/O, but the Satori was ridiculous easy together up--it could replace combo skis if your guest was willing. Super easy to cruise and turn. No tunnel, so it is really fast--very easy to glide up next to the boat. No tunnel also means it doesn't rock a carve quite like the Theory. We slowed to down and trimmed the motor to make a large wake. I was cutting hard into the wake and getting some serious air. Felt like wake boarding on a ski. I'm interested in trying the Freeride, as I'm going to buy something. Any more thoughts on the HO?

I love it. Use your boat. Catch fish. Take the kids out, whatever. I never make fun of people out on the water; they are enjoying the same view I am. That said, I did see a pontoon boat last year with chain-link fence as the rail and resin furniture on the deck. It was a sight.

I grew up skiing behind an aluminum fishing boat with a 150 HP two-stroke outboard. The hole-shot was awesome. The wake was small. No doubt is was not as shaped as a true ski boat, but it was better than any I/O boat I have ever been behind.

It also seems that a few I/O manufacturers are starting to go after the family/ski/play crowd--Bryant is a quality builder that is going after the casual user that used to spend 70K on a V-drive. I think this is the real meat of the boat market. At Horton mentioned above, The money spent on dedicated ski boats each year is actually a pretty small slice of the pie.

@Marco - Colorado is great. Particularly later in the season. The towns are the best. I grew up skiing in Aspen mostly, but I made the rounds. I guess for the money and time from someone coming by plane, it's not the best. Getting up through the tunnel, etc. If a person is looking for lots of good snow, I'd say Utah and Alaska. Both are best for pure skiing though--when I bring my kids, it's Steamboat or Big Sky. For a good place to live and ski, Colorado would be a good choice. Utah would be my last choice.

Most interesting was my 4 year-old 30 pound daughter this summer.

If you are looking for value and ease, it's pretty hard to beat Utah. Easy flights into SLC, 1 hour drive to several good areas. Snow fall is a relative term there. Many good options there, depending on your interests--Snowbird is self-contained with great snow, Park City is more like a Colorado town with the life, Canyons and Brighton and Solitude are more like mellow smaller resorts. California does have fun spots as well. Skip Colorado. As far as the snowboard thing goes, it does exclude you from Alta, but if skis are not an option, I guess you gotta make do. For the record, I have skied nearly everywhere. A lot. ejj

I'd echo Ed too. You might like a smaller ski, but you don't always need a stiffer ski that takes more energy to keep moving. I have raced/sold alpine ski gear for ever. Too many people try to "up-ski" themselves because only old heavy dudes buy the wide ride, right? Sadly, this is often true. Some of the mid-line skis these days are REALLY fun. Easy to turn, fun to cruise open water,etc... The Theory isn't made for speed, as it's not stiff enough. But if you don't mind 32, it's awesome. The Senate is a great ski for going a bit faster with a bit more effort. But for me? Skip it. Either go Theory or Strada/Vice/Senate C. Again, a good skier can smoke it with nearly any ski these days.

Saw this in the new Radar catalog. Can't figure out of this is something fun for screwing around on open water, or if it is simply a big-daddy type ski for people who don't/can't ski. Anyone?

If you like the old style of ski, that is a great one. People will pay decent money for a used one.

Just a minor warning--lookis like the ski from back in the day, but not the same stiff inside.

Get the Theory. Go 28-30 and have fun and less physical effort. The Mach 1 is the same shape as the old ones, but not the same stuff inside. If he is dead set on an old ski, buy an old ski on ebay or call Wiley's. But really--1, Buy Theory. 2, Spec comfy easy-on bindings. 3, Pull at 30 mph. Repeat as necessary.

Was looking at the 2013 catalog that was posted above. Anyone know what the Radar Satori is? Is this just new marketing of a "big-daddy" ski or is this something new/fun for screwing around on the lake?