Ski Test '09

[lkb]

Anybody know when the results are coming out?

[Old MS Accout]

What is left for you to try? I think you tried every ski out there. Between you, JD, Skidawg, SJ, teammalibu and Horton, we should just write our own. Its like year round ski testing.

[trs1]

LKB,

I was lucky enough to work with Horton this year and conduct the ski tests.

We did it at Oz, home of the H2Oz Training Center in Charleston, SC.

I think it was very successful, but I will really only know once the article comes out.

Obviously, the article needs to fit the specs (word count) etc. of the mag, but I will have an extended version of the tests, etc. online.

I have the site functional and I am getting some basic info up on it now, but I am not ready for a full release of the site.

We will be working hand in hand with BOS on this and I encourage any feedback from all of you.

If you appreciate the tests, let me know, if not, let me know.  I stand behind everything we did and I believe we are on the right track to provide everyone with gret info on each ski tested, and how to use each ski appropriately to get the best results out of it.

 The test has stayed pretty true to its origins with some adaptations.   For instance, it is no longer known as a SKI TEST, rather an Independent Ski Review (ISR)

The group of testers rode each ski multiple times, and we looked for how/why the ski works the way it works and how to make the ski work best and for which "type" of skier each ski will work best for.

I have probably said too much as it is, but here in the next few days, I will give out the web address so you can see the philosophy behind the ISR.

 Anyway, looking forward to the entire release as soon as the WS Mag Spring issue comes out.

Let me know your thoughts,

LAter
TS

tadd at h2osmosis dot com

H2Osmosis Sports 

 

Just to let you know, some of you guys may be surprised with some of the findings we had.  Not all the "myths" about each ski are absolute! 

[Old MS Accout]

As a 2 time tester, I realize what all went into the planning and delivering of the reviews. From what Horton and JD went through, I know that more money was spent out of pocket than was gained. From my experience, it was to each his own on how you felt about each ski and the info that is put out should help you narrow down skis that you may try. I look forward to seeing the new format. In 06, I saw testers tearing it up on the new white Nomad. I could not wait to ride it as I was a former D3 guy. No matter what I did, I could not ski on the Nomad.

It is not a waste of time and it is a helpful outlet for many skiers that dont have cash and time to try 6 new skis per year like Horton, JD and the La. testers.

I look forward to seeing it Tadd, thanks for the effort.

[Director Darwin]

6 skis a year?  Me?  Not anymore!  I'm sold on the RCX but I think they'll be an Elite showing up around these parts in the near future - hearing GREAT things about that ski.  We'll see.

[lkb]

Tadd, thanks for the info and efforts.

MS, maybe I will trade the warp for a Nomad, an RS-1, an A-1, and a Prophecy then I will be content for a while.

[Old MS Accout]

That would be an even trade. You could probably add the new OB to that and still have change for a few South Paws.

[lkb]

Really I wish I could find a stick that works for me and then just stay on it. I spent most of '04, all of '05 and '06, and most of 07 on the same monza. During then I can see my progress. When I got off it, progress has been tougher to define. It's been up and down. Mostly down. I think speed control has something to do with it too.

The bottom line is I need to get on a good ski and stick with it so that part of the equation won't be buggin me.

[Old MS Accout]

You are on the same path as me. 04/05/06 and 7 on the Monza. I sold my 07 before I had my 08 and I will never do that again. Tried a few other 07s, but none were like mine. You are correct, get/find a stick and stick on it. Tynan wont give up that X5 and look how long Ben F was on the 9100. Did you try the new RS1?

[lkb]

na...thinking about it though. Found a lightly used one for 450, but the guy says he ordered it on the soft side. That may be fine but it made me wonder. I asked him for flex numbers but he didn't know them. Any thoughts?

In general, do you'll think that for a certain skier there is one flex pattern that's best for that skier from ski to ski?

[Old MS Accout]

I dont know if it flex patterns or build, but you see guys try 3 of the same skis and pick one. The older Monzas were all across the board, but towards 07 the started to come out more consistant. The 08s were all very close.

If you can get the Serial number off the ski, Call Eddie R and he can dig it up. Eddie is on here from time to time and I am sure he will help. They helped me out lots last summer with my RS1.

[DW]

Tadd,

I very much appreciate the tests.  I had the opportunity to participate in 2007 and found it very worthwhile to learn a lot about several different ski options and really appreciated that opportunity.  In addition, in the years of not being a participant, the information certainly helped in a ski purchase decision.  I certainly look forward to reading about the test, particularly on the web site.  Not only that, but for the manufacturers gain, I felt the test itself made me think about buying a ski or upgrading my equipment, thus at least putting a potential ROI on the expenses of the test itself.

Roughly a decade ago I felt the same about the annual boat review in WSM.  When factual data and real comparisons were done and reported on, I felt the test offered enourmous value in assisting on a boat purchase.  The data directly influenced a boat purchase and I never regretted the decision I made.  Unfortunately the currrent version of the review does nothing to assist me in making a purchase of a new boat.  I only reference that in light of ski testing, a sales pitch for each ski offers no information but a comprehensive review can be of significant value.

Thanks for taking on the ski test, and of course thanks to JTH for starting the process and pulling off the first wave of the tests.  I hope the event keeps on going, particularly as new and different ski options keep coming from the manufacturers.  Great job to all.

[trs1]

DW,

Thanks for the words and input.

I agree with the point of your post for sure, and I hope I did a good job with the review and it is helpful to skiers like you in future purchases, as that was the main goal I had.  I actually used the old boat review as a guide for the format.  I wanted to describe how each ski should be used for peak performance.  I used the feedback from each skier for this.  Good and bad.  

Actually, I just got an advance copy of the test from WS Mag, and I am very happy with the layout, etc. of the article.

I am hard at work getting info on the site, and hope to have it full steam early next week.

With the blessing of Mr. Horton, I hope to have the BOS forum provide your feedback for the tests, as well, the Ski Test website is in a Blog format, similar to fifteenoff.com or the CRB, so you will be able to post your comments directly on the site as well.  Some think that this is not the best idea as they believe it will open the door to negative nancies who just want to badmouth everything because it is the way they work.  I am fine with that.  If you do not like what we produced, let me know, I am fine with it.   But, in the end, I truly believe this format is the way to go.  I liken it to "Cliffs Notes" (Which all of you read back in HIgh School).  It doesn't have all the answers, but it gives you a great starting point on the skis that are out there, and which one might be the one for you.  In the end, testing the ski out yourself is the key.  As far as a little self promotion, H2Oz offers the Ride Before You Buy program.  It is the original "demo" program out there.  So after reading the test, if you are ready to try something, give me a buzz.

 

A few Ski Review teasers:  We did have a "Favorite Ski" for each skier, and surprisingly enough, each ski tested got at least 1 vote, most got at least 2.  Very even across the board.

As well, Fischer, Warp 8, and Reflex were not a part of the test.

Thanks

Tadd

tadd at h2osmosis dot com

 

[Director Darwin]

"Cliff Notes"?  High School?  I hear they use them as text books at 'Bama!

http://www.harvestmkt.com/images/cliffsmakesshort_small_m9rt.jpg

[trs1]

Touche Darwin,

At least at Bama, we can read the Cliffs Notes!

Not sure about them Bayou Bengals.

I heard all you need there is to wear your hat real high up off your head cause if not, then your head wont be able to hold all the information you learn from that there teacher they gots in the classrooms.

Sincerely,

Les Miles 

[kc]

I had the pleasure of being a 2009 tester.  Tadd did a great job running the tests.  I know JH was a great help to him, and Seth was a gracious host.  Everyone enjoyed each other's company, and we had a fun week, except for the "monsoon" on Friday!  Regarding Warp,  they canceled at the last minute, much to the disappointment of all of us.  Looking farward to viewing the website and the WS article!

[Horton]

http://www.waterskireview.h2osmosis.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/home-450x288.jpg

[Horton]

It is an Elite and no Kim does not know about my secret love

[DW]

Hmm, those Cali morals!!

[Roger]

I know we supplied two women for the test. Trish is in the shot, but Laurie is missing... did she take the shot or sleep in /vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-wink.gif

[SM]

Any solid date on when the results will be posted?

[kc]

Laurie had "the day off" the day photo was taken, so like any dedicated skier, she was over taking sets at Trophy!  She had her pic taken later with a ski, and hopefully will be photo-shopped in!

[trs1]

Yes, Laurie was gone at the time of the pic, but I promise I will post a pic of her up on the Ski Review Website.

Speaking of, I am just about done with the site.  Still need to get some more photos on there, and I am sure I will keep trying to update it more and more with other thoughts, ideas, ski/fin set ups, etc.  I have some video that I would like to put on the site, but I am not quite the editor I thought I was, but I am still working on it.

Anyway, the site is ready with all the info so here goes.

The mag should be at your door any day now as well, as I have already got one. Had to previ

Check out the Independent Ski Review: waterskireview.h2osmosis.com

Thoughts, comments, are welcome. 

Thanks

Tadd

H2Osmosis Sports

tadd at h2osmosis dot com 

[trs1]

This link should work:

 

Independent Ski Review

 

Thanks

TS 

[SM]

Great site, thanks for the hard work.

[Old MS Accout]

As a former tester, I am disipointed in a few of the comments. I have the comments below.

 "I needed to find a team of skiers who I could count on for a true understanding of skiing. I wanted to make sure that whoever rode the skis in this test, really understood the “feeling†of each ski."

Butterfield, Jones, Greenwood, Skidawg, Stange and ERB the tool shop man have tested, tweaked, rode, watch others ride, set up and throw off docks more skis then any people I know. In my 2 years, I learned tons abots fins, bindings, placement and the effect of each move then in all the years leading up to the tests. I thought the results were well thought out and published.

 "I was able to gather very detailed information and thoughts from each rider, which is exactly what was needed to do the Review the right way".

Here are some of the testers comments on skis. Does it sound more detailed then last year?

“Once you find your spot, it feels real comfyâ€Â, PJ McMillan. “The ski never stops moving,†said tester PJ McMillan.
The “Spot†is in the middle of the ski. “The passes seemed to go slower than they actually were†John Horton

"you are able to scrap very well, as you can “SLAM†a turn if need be and the 9900WSL keeps right on moving to the next buoy ready for everything you can throw at it."

There is more, but I think you all get my drift.

 

 

[Old MS Accout]

They never let me ride the Monza, it was my home ski. It was the Radar that rocked. The WS mag takes the info and puts it out, so not much control of final content. I like the test, the effort put into it and all the poeople involved. I just was not fond of the rip on the former test teams.

[trs1]

MS,

 

I am somewhat confused by your comments, as I do not understand where you are going with them.  I guess you are disappointed, not sure why as you really do not add any reasoning to your post.

But I will reply as I think I need to to try to get across my point.

 

As a former tester, I am disipointed in a few of the comments. I have the comments below.

"I needed to find a team of skiers who I could count on for a trueunderstanding of skiing. I wanted to make sure that whoever rode theskis in this test, really understood the “feeling†of each ski."

Butterfield, Jones, Greenwood, Skidawg, Stange and ERB the tool shopman have tested, tweaked, rode, watch others ride, set up and throw offdocks more skis then any people I know. In my 2 years, I learned tonsabots fins, bindings, placement and the effect of each move then in allthe years leading up to the tests. I thought the results were wellthought out and published.

I am assuming you took my quote as a direct competition to past years reviewers, testers, etc.  Well, to my knowledge there was no competition between this years review and past years.  I am sorry if you are upset that you were not asked to join in. But I wanted to try to get a bit of a different flavor this year with some new guys.  As well, I did speak to a few of the past years testers, to try to get some consistency in the review, Jones, Skidawg, and asked them to come and help me out like Horton did, but they were unable to make it.  My statement above had nothing to do with past years testers in any way shape or form.  I think you read into a bit too much.  I would hope that each and every year we can add in some new riders and give more people the opportunity to join in on this.  Not try to make it a "Members Only" type of deal.

"I was able to gather very detailed information and thoughts from eachrider, which is exactly what was needed to do the Review the rightway".

Here are some of the testers comments on skis. Does it sound more detailed then last year?

“Once you find your spot, it feels real comfyâ€Â, PJ McMillan. “The ski never stops moving,†said tester PJ McMillan.
The “Spot†is in the middle of the ski. “The passes seemed to go slower than they actually were†John Horton

"you are able to scrap very well, as you can “SLAM†a turn if need beand the 9900WSL keeps right on moving to the next buoy ready foreverything you can throw at it."

 Again I am not trying to compete with past years tests.  I am not sure how any of what happened at this years review could be taken as a dig against past years tests.  Plus you are pulling out a few quotes here and there.  Quotes are not what the ISR is all about.  They are just "flash/hype", the real meat is in the actual review.  

There is more, but I think you all get my drift.

No really, no I do not at all. 
 

MS, I apologize if you took any of the ISR as a dig toward you and past ski tests, but in no way shape or form was that my objective.  In fact, up until reading your post, that thought had never even crossed my mind.  If you can point out anywhere whereI have intentionally compared this review to past tests, by all means, please let me know.

If you have any other thoughts, please, I welcome all thoughts and opinions, but please try to add something substantial to them to let me know where you are coming from, rather than assumptions that have no backing to them.  

My main goal is and always has been, from the beginning to educate about the product and take what I learn from this review to bring into future reviews if I am lucky enough to conduct them again.   

Thanks

Tadd

tadd at h2osmosis dot com 

waterskireview.h2osmosis.com 

 

 

[kpickett]

Tadd, 

Reading the skier bios, I see that all of the testers are really expert skiers.  I imagine that anyone who is consistently into 38 and 39 can probably ski pretty darn well on anything.  As someone who is working to get consistent at 32 and grab a few at 35, I think it would be helpful for us lesser mortals to have some skiers like us test the skis, as well.  I don't discount the comments from high level skiers (it can be really helpful), but their technique is so strong it can adapt more easily than mine, for instance.

Just a suggestion.

KWP

[Old MS Accout]

I am not up set about joining in, I had my days of testing and know what its all about. Its the comments. "A true understanding of skiing" It makes it sound like Horton put together a bunch of no minds.

I understand everything else that goes into it all.

 

"I was able to gather very detailed information and thoughts from each rider, which is exactly what was needed to do the Review the right way". I thought that the former tests were done the right way (if there is a right or wrong way)

and that there was plenty of detailed info from each rider. If you think Butterfield is long winded in his posts on BOS, you should read his reviews. I dont want to throw darts at the test, I just want to make sure that past efforts do not get trashed. Guys like JD and Skidawg put lots of lost time and money into those tests and there efforts should not be trashed.

[trs1]

KPickett,

 

Good comments, and that was an issue I discussed with a few people before the ISR.

The main reasoning behind getting skiers who are relatively "good" skiers, is because they tend to understand the feeling that the ski gives them and can explain it in a better way due to more experience on the water.

Now, please do not take this as a dig at you, because by no means is it.

I was just advised by a few people who had done tests like this before, that you tend to get better feedback from skiers at a higher ability level and that in itself outweighs the fact that these skiers can adjust for each ski.

But, in that same respect, I feel you would want someone who could adjust for each ski, and then be able to explain that adustment/adaptation to their style, so that it could be related, and explained in the review so that you, or any skier who reads it, can understand what they will need to do to hop on that ski and make it work correct.

I think this makes sense, let me know if I did not explain it so it is understandable.

Thanks again for the comment, good one.

Tadd

 waterskireview.h2osmosis.com 

[trs1]

MS,

 

In no way shape or form did any thought of past tests come into mind when I wrote that.

 I was trying to get across the point that I wanted to make sure the tests I did were in the same vein as prior tests.
Get the best info I could from the best team I could assemble. 

Should I have stated in the review, that this review will not be as good as prior reviews as to not "trash" those you mentioned?

I truly do not know how you could  make that as a trashing of JD, Dawg, etc.

I really think you may have too much time on your hands to come up with something that asinine.

In no where throughout the review is there a comparison with prior tests.  You have put this all together in your mind, and frankly it is pretty ridiculous as well, It seems to me that you are the only one who thinks that this review is a trashing of prior tests.

For anyone else who does think this, I did not compare in any way this review to prior reviews.

I realize how much JD, Horton, Dawg, and all the past test teams have put into it and appreciate each and every one of them for all their efforts.

Thanks MS for your comments.

Tadd

waterskireview.h2osmosis.com

 

[Old MS Accout]

"I really think you may have too much time on your hands to come up with something that asinine".

 

 

"You have put this all together in your mind"

 

I read what I read and my mind computes that info. If you think I am alone, I am not, I am just the only one who will type and not care what everyone else thinks.

You were asking for comments and I gave them to you. You can do what you want with the info.

[kpickett]

Hey Tadd,

Thanks for the response.  I'm sure that the most advanced skiers are best able to review the different skis - so no gripe with that at all.  I think it would add a demension to the test to have some skilled, but not as advanced, skiers test, as well. 

For instance, there are several guys at my club who all ski at the same level as I do, although we ski with pretty different styles.  We have demoed a few skis, and it's interesting to see that a couple of the skis (F1, D3) work really well for some skiers, but not at all for others.  More interesting is that a ski like the A1 seems to work for all of us, regardless of style or what ski we came from.  I think we all know that trying a ski before you buy it is the ideal way to do things, but I would be interested to know that any 32 off guy can jump on a particular ski and run up to a PB pretty quickly, but half the people who jump on another ski get dumped at 1 ball.

Just keep it in mind for future tests.  Thanks,

Kyle

[trs1]

MS,

 

I have spoken to JD and of course spoke with Horton and neither of them told me they thought I was bashing prior tests. 

Let me reiterate, in no way am I bashing prior test.

That was never my intention, and in fact, NEVER EVER went through my head until I read your posts.

If you took it that way, I am sorry your head computes information in that way.  All I wanted to do was to try to make the review the best that I could.

If I offended any past testers, organizers, etc.  That was never ever the intention nor do I believe it was written in a way that does bash prior tests.

I love the feedback, there is just no facts standing behind yours whatsoever.  It is a completely phantom accusation.

Thanks MS for your comments.

I will keep it in mind when doing future writings. 

 Thanks

TS

waterskireview.h2osmosis.com

[trs1]

Kyle,

Thanks for the thoughts, and I will do that, as you have some good  suggestions.

I will keep it for future reviews as well, maybe I will try to elaborate more with more raw notes on the site in the next few days/week as to more detailed data on each ski and each skier, and what ski they are coming off of too.

Maybe with more info like that, you can see why one ski works for a bigger audience, and another ski works better for a smaller audience, etc.

Good idea.

Thanks
TS

waterskireview.h2osmosis.com

[Old MS Accout]

TRS,

I am sorry for my Factless feed back and my completely phantom accusation. I guess I dreamed it all up.

[trs1]

MS,

Sorry if you are upset.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

I just am standing behind what I did.

TS

waterskireview.h2osmosis.com

[trs1]

MS,

 

Sorry if my comments came across as a personal attack.

That was not my intention.

I was just trying to stand behind what I did and explain my process and concept.

I re read some of my comments and they came out the wrong way, not as I intended.  I am pretty passionate about everything I do and sometimes it gets the best of me.

Thanks for your opinions.
Tadd

http://waterskireview.h2osmosis.com

 

[MrJones]

Tadd,

Thanks for the effort on the tests. I am looking forward to as much more info as you can legally add to the site. I know it is a thin line you have to walk between manufacturers, the magazine, and the results of the test. Everyone has to be mostly happy for us to continue and benefit from this.

 

I will say that when I first read it my thought was "is this all there is?" After that first frenzied read through I went back over some the skis I was more interested in. In slowing down and thinking a bit more I believed I was able to "read between the lines" a bit and infer a few things about the skis. Doing this I believe I have decided on which one of the two skis I was interested in will get the actual demo shot.

sj

[scoke]

 

Interesting reviews and ski test. It was like christmas. 

 

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/4572834/2/istockphoto_4572834-empty-gift-box.jpg

[trs1]

Scot,

 

I am glad you could "read between the lines".  I was hoping that people would pick that up.

I will be posting more on the site in the coming days/week or so.

More info, raw notes, etc.

Thanks

Tadd

waterskireview.h2osmosis.com

[lkb]

trs1,

It was mentioned earlier in this thread that Warp cancelled at the last minute. Why did they do that?

[SM]

Tadd,

 

Something that would interest me would be knowing how each of the skiers skied "off the dock" with each skis stock settings and then how well they did once they tweaked the ski with the help of the ski's representatives. It would also be interesting to see how far people moved from stock (if at all). Thanks.

[trs1]

LKB,

 

I wish I had more info on why Warp cancelled, but it was a last minute cancel.

The Thurs or Friday before the review they called and said they were not coming.

Don't really have anymore info than that.

I will say, Reflex did not have the skis ready at the time of the review, and at the time of the review, I am not sure I was aware they were about to build skis.  I think I found out right after the review that they were going to have a ski.

Fisher did not participate either.  They were asked, but they declined.  I do not have anymore info than that.

 

SM,

I will get some "raw" notes on the site that will hopefully help show just what you asked.  First set thoughts and fin movements, etc.

It will be a few days before I have it all up, but I will do my best to get it up.

 Thanks guys,
TS

 Independent Ski Review

 

[MrJones]

Just read the skier bio/favorites bit. Surprised that the Prophecy was listed by several (didn't count for sure, but maybe the most?) as their favorite of the test. Also that the 9900 fat boy was chosen by only one.

sj

[Horton]

A little history...  After the third year of ski tests I was SO DONE. Totally over it.  I called Tadd and told him that I thought he should take it over. One of the first things I told Tadd is that no matter what he does, someone is not going to like it and that it is way harder then anyone thinks. Getting a bunch of skiers together for a few days of skiing is easy but writing it is a no win situation.

I am pretty sure that I have laid all this out a number of times in the past but here are some of the issues with the Ski Tests. I stand behind what I did but there are some problems with any sporting equipment review.

First of all, you are asking a skier to set up and describe a ski in a few sets. That is practically impossible and leads to some overly positive and/or negative impressions. In the first two years that I did the tests, we actually reported what a skier should expect after 1 to 3 sets on a ski right out of the box. This was not by design but with only a few rides that is what it was.  I tried to jump though every possible hoop to get the skis ridden at exactly stock settings before tweaking so if the stock #s are bad that means extra ride per ski per skier.

That first year Darwin and I thought that having a factory rep on site would skew the report. The third year I did the tests, I tried having the reps on site and it was way better. This meant that the skis were quickly and correctly tweaked to the skiers needs. In the first two years some of the skiers tweaked their skis with great skill but sometimes it was a matter of luck. I have a photo somewhere of Dawg calling Jamie Beauchesne for better F1 numbers. How was that fair? In another case MS had Monza numbers that were way better then the stock numbers. If MS has not been there the HO review would have been totally different. Same story with the Goodes.....

With the reps on site, the skiers could get a better idea of how it would be if they had much more time. If some reps did a great job setting up the skis and others did not there was nothing I could do about that. I believe that of the three years I did the tests, the one with the reps on site allowed the skis to be reviewed more evenly. (For 09 I think all the reps did a very solid job.)

If the goal is to describe what a ski has to offer long term as opposed to what kind of first impression a ski makes, a rep on site makes a substantial difference.

Second, the level of skiers involved. I tried it both ways. The first year the team was very high end. The third year I went pretty far in the other direction. After the first year I got a lot of emails asking for lower level skiers to review the skis. In the end the testers just need to be analytical. Some great high end skiers don’t know the difference but generally skiers with a higher ball count do a better job of describing a ski. Skills = ball count and without skills it is hard to understand the intricacies of a slalom ski.

Third: The darn numbers and rankings. How do you rate ANYTHING on a scale of 1 to 5? The idea of numbers was to make the tests all about the quantitative data and it turned out to be totally qualitative. What 4 means to me is not what 4 means to you. We can agree on paper what we think it means but then to say that one ski is a tiny bit faster then another is just crap. Further more we are talking about a feeling. In the example of speed, it means nothing and or any number of things. If the numbers were used for a gut check and not as a score, I think there is some value but reporting numbers and allowing skis to be compared in that way was a mistake.

Fourth: How to describe the skis? You think it is easy? A few of you can write about a ski you own but try to write about 6 or 8 and explain the differences. Worse try to write about a ski that you personally do not like. A lot of skiers love the Goode 9100 – 9700 but I will be darned it I can ride one. With that said, those skis always got a good review from me because the team liked them. 

In terms of the 09 ISR, did Tadd do exactly what I would have done? No. Tadd wrote what he believed and I stand behind him. I have been involved with 4 skis tests and it has been a learning experience each time. I am proud of starting the process and spearheading it for 3 years but I also see faults in all three of my efforts.  For those of you who are critical of this years tests, get over it.

 

[skibug]

So far I think this was a great effort.  I have enjoyed reading each of the 4 years of testing and I think they all had their strengths and weaknesses.  Until you get skier robots out there, and devise a test with discrete data points, you will always be faced with skier preference and style influence.  Props to Horton and the original test teams for the fathering this beast; and, kudos to Tadd and the H2Osmosis team for keeping the momentum of these efforts going.

As far as the rediculous banter and critisms; I am laughing way too hard to write anymore............comedic relief is just a fringe benefit

[DW]

I think the emotion displayed shows the value of a ski test!  To everybody that puts in the effort, keep it up, the ski test appears to be one of the most valuable and anticipated reports of the year.

Besides, if it were easy, anybody could do it.

[Horton]

One last thing. After a hectic day at work I sat down tonight to work on the web site and catch up on email. In my emails, I found some amazingly rough criticism of some of 08 IST as well as the 09 ISR. Made me Fuming A$$ Mad. This is a hobby. I took the tests seriously but I do this for fun. If I want abuse, I can go to the woods and throw rocks at bears.