Fair price to charge and/or pay for a run?

[kld11053]

Just wondering what the current going rate is.

[Horton]

1 bottle Kilo Kai

[Horton]

Really...$20

[kld11053]

@scotchipman - if all you didn't own boats, do you think a non-boat owner should pay more?

[A_B]

Depends if you trade time on each others boats. I would say $10 for boat owners and $15 for non boat owner, at least.

[jdarwin]

If someone would purchase, maintain and leave a current boat at my lake and let me ski behind it whenever I wanted, I would GLADLY pay $15 per set.

[6balls]

I bring 5 gallons in gas which is between $15 and $20 bucks when skiing w/buddies. They usually do the same when they come ski with me. Truth be told, I wouldn't really care if they didn't bring any gas...I need a driver to get my fix and if they were not there...I may just be staring at the glass feeling all bummed out.

[Moskier3ev]

I would rather have 5 Gallons of gas or bring a 12pack. Usually a little left over for my next outing.

 

Jeff Lindsey

[MattP]

@moskier3ev yes.

[Horton]

In truth I never bring cash. I always travel with a gas can.

[thager]

I pay what the boat owner wants. If they want cash I do cash. If they want gas I bring gas. Some won't take a dime no matter what you bring. I'm one of those. I just need a driver but always at least offer.

[ral]

@Horton, you travel like that because of some Bonzo inner thoughts???

[Horton]

Best for boat owner I think. I also bring beer and test skis sometimes.

[wski1831]

Typical for us is $15. If it's reciprocal $10.

[John Brooks]

@Horton Do you check or carry on your gas can?

[ral]

Or drink it fast at the TSA checkpoint?

[Razorskier1]

I bring gas usually because its easier for the boat owner. On our private site we have gone to an approach of charging $1 for each pass for gas costs only. Now, keep in mind that we also pay annual boat fees. This charge is designed only to cover gas, not boat costs. If I'm somewhere else I figure about $10 a set is pretty fair, unless I take 15 passes!

[One_Ski]

I like these prices - all seem fair and reasonable. I travel a lot. Recently, every time I've looked for somebody to pull me, they ask for $40 bucks for 6 passes. At that price, I leave my ski at home.

[6balls]

at one_ski prob depends on whether or not it's a business. Skiing with buds bring 5 gallons gas. If I'm traveling and need a pull at a business/ski school, I know I'll have to pay more.

[Waternut]

I personally don't charge people to come ski behind my boat but I do appreciate getting money occasionally. You have to be a really fun person to be around for me to keep inviting you over and over without ever receiving some kind of money, gas, food, etc. in exchange though. Having at least one person who likes to bring 5 gallons of gas cuts down on my trips to the gas station which is really nice. All in all, I'd say I don't even come close to breaking even but I'd rather be down a couple hundred bucks at the end of the season than wish I could've skied more.

 

At my local slalom lake, the guy officially charges $12 a set but I consider that the friendly rate since he hasn't really changed it in many years.

[danbirch]

Every situation is different, (and personal relationships are all different) but because water skiing is different from (say) snow skiing, where you would HAVE to purchase an expensive lift ticket or wouldn't be able to ski, there are a few things to consider......

 

1. Who "called" the ski date? This is probably the biggest "luxury" that the Boat Owner gets, and it is often an expensive adventure (typically you must OWN or control the boat) to call the ski date.

 

2. What other direct expenses does the boat owner have, in order to "go ski with you". i.e. trailering the boat to the location, driving out to the lake, etc.

 

3. The cost of the boat "gas" is only a small percentage of the ski ride. Any boat owner quickly learns about the other expenses (maintenance, licenses, registrations, insurances, trailer, trailering gas costs, the lake, parking and boat permits to use the lake, the cost of a vehicle maintained just so he can pull his boat, etc...) Those costs often serve only one purpose...so we can ski!

 

If you are lucky enough to NOT own a boat, yet go skiing with a buddy who has one, you are in an excellent situation, especially if you get to call the ski day/time. To only pay "gas" is to not respect the many costs associated with your skiing, and unless your boat owner friend has lots of $$, and just loves entertaining you, you may soon find yourself not getting invited out to ski.

 

With many things to consider (all relationships are obviously different), I believe a respectful amount to offer is at least $20/set. While it is not appropriate for the boat owner to add up all of the costs associated with the boat, then divide that amount by the amount of sets skied in a year, and charge THAT amount, at least the guest has showed some consideration by "chipping" in for MORE than just his gas costs. I think that this is what @jdarwin meant by his post, of gladly letting someone have $15, and pull him all day long, as he understands the costs of boat ownership.

 

At the end of the day, are you invited back? Is that important to you? Do you like to "call" the ski date? Is your training something you take seriously? Are you taking advantage of, or are you respecting your "boat owning buddy" and saying "thank you" to him, not only with words, but some green as well? It's a great sport (but yes, expensive)! And as Schnitz once said..."To offer a $5 or $10 bill for a ski ride, is actually an insult" (though I add to that, often not even realized).

[ForrestGump]

When I ski at the ski lake subdivision near my house, I take 5 gallons of gas. I would rarely do 2 sets. But I take 5 gallons every time, which means I'm usually paying for the boat owners ski set that day too. That's always seemed to work and makes everyone happy.

 

At our ski lake, we charge each other 2 gallons of gas per set when we would ski behind each other's boats. I would expect that if I went to ski somewhere not "normal" for me that I'd be willing to pay $20 a set. I wouldn't have an issue one paying someone $20 a set.

[bigtex2011]

i am embarrassed to say one lake i ski at charges 25 per set plus a fuel charge. i think that is a bit excessive. the other lake i ski at seem to be more in line with the 5 gallon gas can rule.

[bigtex2011]

as an after thought, it is not my boat and i am only a member. i would say though, i believe it discourages new people from trying the ski site out and therefore our membership hasn't grown in years. the other site i am a property owner. so it is a bit more laid back.

[ForrestGump]

Also, more often than not when I've gone to "foreign" sites and have offered $20/set the people there have said it's too much and have given me money back. Now, that's typically in the SCR. I've skied in another region which shall be nameless and was always made to feel as if my $20 was far too little. I don't have a problem with paying whatever someone wants, but if what I offer isn't to your liking, tell me what is and don't look down upon me.

[jdarwin]

@ShaneH - perhaps it's not you but the unstable female companions you bring along for the ride!!

[slalom frog]

I have never charged anything when someone skis at my lake. I do have some friends that we switch weekends/lakes with, so in the end it tends to all even out.

[SkiJay]

For me personally, $10 to $20 or a 5 gal gas can seems fair and friendly. But if there is an accountant in the rotation, even $20 a ride can be proven a bit light, as worked out for us by Steve Schnitz on his website as follows:

 

"THE TRUE COST OF A SKI SET (revised April 2012)

~Steve Schnitz

 

A new ski boat can cost $70,000.00. A 10% loan on that amount would end up costing the owner roughly $700.00 a month or $8,400.00 per year. The depreciation on this boat will run about $17,500.00 the first year (25%). The insurance on this boat costs about $800.00 per year. Storage can run $1,500.00 per year. Add to this oil changes $275.00, cleaning materials $110.00, maintenance $1,100.00, ropes and handles $275.00, permits and registrations $220.00, additional auto insurance $220.00 (you cannot pull a boat with a high gas mileage economy car), additional auto expenses $2,640.00, AWSA membership $60.00, miscellaneous expenses $550.00 and you have $32,930.00 per year cost to ski not including gas and the cost of new skis and equipment! If some-one skis 2 sets a day (a lot of days I don't even ski), 5 days a week, March through August and an average of 4 sets a week thereafter, they will have a total of 364 sets. Add in a spouse that skis the same amount and you now have 728 total sets. Let’s use $4.00 per gallon of gas times 1.5 gallons per set ($6.00) times 728 sets and we get $4,368.00. Now let’s divide the cost of owning the boat for the year ($32,930.00) by the 728 sets and you have $45.23 per set. Add the fuel costs to this and you get $51.23 per set. THIS IS THE COST! If we take a look at the folks up north who ski 4-6 months per year, this figure doubles or triples! So the next time you head for the lake with your ski buddy’s boat, keep these figures in mind. Handing your host $5.00 or $10.00 for a ski set is an insult!"

[Chef23]

I think there are a lot of variables in the equation. If someone is running a for profit business and trying to make a living I think it would be hard to survive with less than $50 a set.

 

Being a guest at someone else's site is different and again depends n the situation. I have some friends that we will go ski at each others site behind their boat and when we do no money changes hands. I go to their place and they come to mine and it is all even.

 

I also go to a friends site for my son to jump as we don't have a jump. I always bring 5 gallons of gas and frequently give him money as well. I don't have access to a jump at my site and we try to go every week if possible. The site owner is very generous with their site, time and coaching and I never want them to think oh no here comes Chef23 again. I am grateful for the access to a jump and a nice private site.

 

In summary I think it depends. If I am a guest I would always ere on the high side particularly if i am not reciprocating. It is expensive to own a boat and maintain a site and it is important to recognize that

[scuppers]

Everyone seemed to skip over the obvious - bringing a gas can with 5 gallons of gas is way short if you end up taking 3 sets. And everyone I ever skied with usually ends up with 8 trys per set. They used more than 5 gallons.

[MattP]

@skijay a lot of those numbers look really inflated to me. While I would never offer anyone less than $20 or 5gal for a pull.

If you are buying a boat for 70k you have the money to withstand friends bringing only $20/5gal to ski.

[SkiJay]

@MattP That's how I see it too. A lot of this is about spreading and sharing the joy.

[Chef23]

@scuppers when I am a guest I don't ski 8 pass sets or generally ski 3 sets. But I get your point if you ski 3 sets 5 gallons isn't enough.

 

How many 6 pass sets can you get out of 5 gallons?

[ForrestGump]

Even with a 200, we're getting 1.5gal per set on average. I would never advocate taking 3 sets at someone else's site and only bring 5 gallons.

[ForrestGump]

@jdarwin The question was brought up on our ski trip to Breckenridge this last week whether said women were unstable before meeting me or after. I'm not sure I know how to answer that. ;)

 

[scuppers]

@Chef23 - I don't know the answer and I guess it would depend on 34 vs 36 and how many falls which adds at least one more acceleration to each pass etc. I do know - a full tank, (really full) add a day of ski fun with two guys and the boat owner. A fill back up at the end of the day usually takes 15 gallons. This means the boat owner is in for a 20. I guess it's like @SkiJay says; "Sharing the Joy"

[wilecoyote]

Where I ski (McClintocks in Ontario) the club member( 280.00 year) rate is 2.75 minute, so what would that work out to per set? We only pay for ski time, so bobbing around at the end of the course doesn't count. I'm too new to be able to work out how many minutes would be in a set, but 50 bucks does seem a bit steep.

 

In my case, I just bought a boat, and as of yet I don't have a course, so it's only free skiing. If you ask to ski behind my boat, then I would expect that you offer up gas for the privilege, but if you're invited, then you are my guest, and I would expect nothing.

 

When I was making the decision on whether to buy a boat or not, I called up my buddy and said, "if I buy a boat will you come out and ski and drive?" That was my only consideration, to have someone to ski with. Now if everyone on the lake was dropping by and asking to go for a set, then I'd have to change my MO I guess.

[Chef23]

@rico I agree when I have a guest I am not looking for them to cover all my expenses if I invite a guest out I don't expect them to pay. It is different if you ski regularly behind someone else's boat and don't have a way to reciprocate. I think if that is the case you should be a little more generous.

[Brady]

I took my wife's sister and her husband down to Lake Powell for a week 2 years ago. They didn't ski a ton, but they ran the jet skis non stop, ate our food for a week, slept in a air-conditioned bedroom for the week. And wasn't able to drive me in a straight line--ya know, the curve like a banana driver--and then when all was said and done, flipped me a 20 spot for gas. Hmmmm, let's see, $3,500 dollars in houseboat and toy tank gas fees. $800 in food. $300 to get down and back.....yaah, 20 bucks ought to cover it!!!

 

I told him to keep his money.

[jipster43]

How much to charge someone you DON'T want to ski with?

[MattP]

@jipster43 nothing, resend their invitation.

[6balls]

I don't care if the 5 gallons covers my costs or not...it's a token of appreciation for the pull. I get a benefit, too by getting a pull. IF the weather were beautiful and IF we had the time (almost never happens) and we ski 3 sets each...I'm not salty back at the dock. It's been a great day of skiing...priceless.

[danbirch]

@rico is always invited back, and your generosty is appreciated!

[BraceMaker]

I'm gonna say, I am willing to go 50/set if that's ~8 pulls.

 

But that is assuming I'm just me myself and I, showing up, your boat, you, your spotter, your waterway.

 

Now if I know you well, and I help pull your dock, and you use my truck to pull your trailer, or I dive for your prop nut...

 

Well then I'm more involved, and I think the 5 gallons gas ~20-30 is fair to make sure I'm not a bother, and I'll work off the rest with my helpful mechanicry.

[E_T]

@skijay at some point is it not about enjoyment and love of the sport and being on the water with friends. I know this i have not paid for a set in 4 years? My ski partner pays for everything, all i have to do is show up and drive.a 10% loan is just nuts! any fool with enough money for a 70k boat should have better credit not to get that kind of rate. If not he shouldt be buying a boat.

[MattP]

@OB I pay to ski, and end up adjusting the buoys almost every time im there.... you know there are almost 40 of those damn things in the water.

[MattP]

@OB Just giving you a hard time. No, your right we don't want the ballers to hate me. I know the least I can do is move 40 buoys 3 times a week. Always end up doing it by my self, good work out swimming after the boat...

[jdarwin]

@E_T - think of it this way - I'm tying up my money in a boat instead of real estate investments where I average 11% cap rate returns. So, it's not about a 10% interest rate but rather, an 11% cap rate return that I am forfeiting - either way, there is a "cost of money" component. I agree that Schnitz's example is a bit extreme but the foundation for his argument is solid.

[Waternut]

I don't really know about everyone else's skiing situation. However, the guy who owns the lake and boat where I ski (when I'm not on my own boat) used to only have 1-2 people to ski with every year. He'd probably have to charge like $100+ a set to break even on a 15 year old boat that is paid off. Considering boat, lake, and course upkeep is going to be pretty similar whether you go out for 40 or 400 sets, I would think some money is better than no money. Do you ask people to help cover the cost of your TV when they come to your super bowl party? I assume you hope they bring some refreshing beverages and maybe some food and that's it.

 

This kind of brings me back to my original post. Are you trying to turn a profit or are you trying to help cover your costs to do something you love while enjoying the company of friends? I consider my boat one of my greatest investments despite losing thousands of dollars and hundreds of man hours on ownership and fuel. The friends I've met have meant way more to me than a few more thousand in the bank.

[SkiJay]

I have an 850 bhp Viper that I love to terrorize the brave and willing in. It makes my Nautique 200's gas consumption seem like that of a Fiat 500, and each set of 14" wide rear tires is over $1,000. I don't charge people for these rides. It's all about the smiles.

 

Some things we do FOR money; other things we do WITH money. Water skiing seems pretty clearly to be one of those things we do WITH money. It's nice when a guest contributes to the gas jar, but breaking-even financially isn't why most of us choose to shoulder the cost of having a ski boat to play with.