Take that, Backwash!

[Than_Bogan]

Another mini-milestone tonight, the first time I ever ran a -38 in backwash. Pretty pumped.

 

To be fair, this wasn't the oceanic blatantly dangerous backwash we had on Tuesday, but it was still pretty rolly out there.

 

And for @OB's benefit, I should clarify that this was on Perfect Pass...

[klindy]

Of course that was in practice so it doesn't count...Unless of course you were testing @eleeski's gate rule proposal....and I assume Chuck Norris was driving....and please tell me you don't have green timing buoys at three ball..... :)

 

Kidding of course. It's always cool when you're able to have "challenges" and still run the pass!

[alex38]

Just be careful, knew a guy that ripped it in whitecaps ...then couldn't do %&$# when it was nice!!! Also be careful not to get hurt of course.

[GOODESkier]

@Than_Bogan 16.95 is 16.95 in my book. GREAT JOB!

 

I am running around 4 and looking at 5 and 6 as shadows through the gates @ 38' OFF. My times are never more than 16.96 either.

 

[Than_Bogan]

16.94. But nevertheless PP is a touch different.

 

Thanks guys! Figuring some things out but -39 still gets a hearty laugh at my pitiful attempts...

[Razorskier1]

Nice skiing @Than_Bogan. I agree with @OB that PP lets you get away with things you can't on ZO, but -38 is still man-sized skiing in my book!

[Than_Bogan]

Come on, you guys know I can't pull a boat down! :)

[GOODESkier]

Set up as firm as you can in the settings, I ski the same number of balls BACK TO BACK behind my Stargazer w/ZBox as I do behind a friends Nautique 200 w/ZO. Same course, same driver, same conditions. Maybe if you are 315 pounds and ski like a barbarian you can pull it down.

 

@OB maybe you can come by and run a 41' OFF for me on my Stargazer and show me that advantage you have over it...........

 

Back to the purpose of this post.......

[Than_Bogan]

Wait, this thread has a purpose??

[GOODESkier]

@Than_Bogan YES, to congratulate you on kicking BACKWASH BUTT!

[Chef23]

Nice skiing Than I won't make fun of you because it was behind your boat with PP.

[GOODESkier]

@OB I thought this was a public forum where we could all play nice in the sandbox, guess not....... too bag people have to read such unprofessional words on your post. Guess that is the Middle School teacher coming out in me........ I just figured if I should be running my 38's you ought to be able to get a few balls more on Stargazer too.

 

On a side note, I am guessing you took the year off to figure out "your setting" on ZO. I figured mine out with the help of a good buddy @TeamWally , and yes, it took the best part of a YEAR! I then took my boat and dialed it in to ski as much as possible EXACTLY like my ZO C1 setting of the Nautique 200. I actually skied my hardest pass on ZO and then grabbed the handle of Stargazer and said "Not hard enough" lets set it harder. Lets make it as unforgiving in every aspect as possible. 2 boats in the water, pass me the handle, lets see how I can make mine ski like a ZO boat. I didn't just ski and look at the 16.95........

 

Just saying, I think you might be as wrong as you think I am........... but then again we may have to agree to disagree, but maybe you can edit your post so my students reading this on my computer at school won't have to read those derogatory terms???? Be a man, take back your words and act like a true gentleman.

[Than_Bogan]

Heh I love it when I start a flamewar via my self-congratulation!

 

Good entertainment.

 

For my part, I initially found ZO to be VERY hard. But once I found my setting (B1) and dialed my technique to it a little, I have been able to switch back and forth with little change in feel. That said I happen to have skied a lot more PP this year, which I truly believe is the reason all 5 of my complete 38s were behind PP. I've seen ball 5 quite a few times on ZO and it doesn't feel any harder. So for me it's at most 1 buoy, and I think less.

[tbrenchley]

All I know is going through the gates is way harder with ZO than with PP.

 

Who cares which one is easier or harder to ski behind the fact is you did something you've never done before and that's what this sport is all about, beating YOUR personal best. Doesn't change the rankings, doesn't change your place on the podium. All I can say is NICE JOB!!! Keep up the good work, because I'm not comparing my passes in practice on my lake behind a Malibu and ZO to your practice pass behind your boat, PP and backwash. Stay thirsty my friends!

[Horton]

I am starting to think that there is a lot less of a difference between PP and ZO than a few years ago. When I make my hardest pass (38) behind PP it means a bit less to me than if I had done it behind ZO but I think the delta is not as big as everyone thinks. I try to ski behind ZO most of the time but when I go PP I do not suddenly gain a bunch of balls or freak out when I move back to ZO.

 

I suspect that the ZO programming has evolved a lot. Back when ZO first came out the delta was HUGE. If you practiced PP and had to ski tournaments ZO it sucked bad.

 

I skied PP Tuesday and will again tonight. If I stink it up at the tournament tomorrow it will not be the fault of the cruise.

 

@OB I love how it is my fault that your shorelines are not perfect.

 

[Horton]

By the way an older ZO boat that has not been upgraded may really really suck

[RichardDoane]

IMO, skiing behind PP Classic and SG on an older boat will never be the same as skiing ZO, Classic lets you pull it down, SG had the bad habit of overspeed/underspeed, and I don't know anyone personally who got the Z-box thing set up correctly, although @goodeskier makes a good point about @ob 's choice of words, he has no scores to give his comments any weight, although his congratulations to @than_bogan for killing the purple loop are well said !

[LeonL]

@tbrenchley, have you tried using a + setting? That may change your feeling in the gate appreciably.

[klindy]

I agree with @LeonL If you haven't, give he + setting a try @thbenchley. After skiing B2+ all year there's a noticable difference going back to C2 for me.

[Razorskier1]

@richarddoane -- I run SG with zbox on a DBW boat and it feels very much like ZO. I think the older cable throttle boats are tougher to get right (based on my experience with a friend's boat). I run zbox at home site (2005 197TT) and ZO on the private site (leased TXi). I'd say they feel pretty much the same. PP classic is a different story, as is SG without zbox. I think SG without zbox is the most forgiving system of all (I used it before I got zbox). I haven't skied PP classic at all this year because I haven't been able to get to the swamp.

[ToddF]

@ob I am not sure what being a marine has to do with PP or ZO. If it meant that you can use more incongruous language than the rest of us, then I am certain there are quite a few others that could be competitive in that venue as well.

 

 

 

now back on point:

@than nice skiing

[tbrenchley]

The gate comment was a joke @leonl

[6balls]

The mis-education of 6balls. For some reason this year very little ZO time. Other years have been able to sprinkle enough ZO to focus on running PP like ZO as far as skiing technique. This year has been whacky...and I've skied piles of PP (and SG). Until today maybe 6 sets on ZO?

 

On PP and SG I'm checking the 38 box like crazy even down to 16.81 in a tail. Realizing it's PP but never done THIS behind PP or anything else so figuring on the margin it's progress. Got my vertebrae shrunk and my arms lengthened on ZO the last 2 days. Thru 35 no problem but 38 a booger...decent gates but never "in" the pass with a chance to run..scrambled eggs.

 

Overall I would say the style to be successful behind ZO can work on PP but not vice versa. When skied well ZO may very well provide some advantage (I've got a 2.5@39 on ZO in tourney), but PP and SG will allow more mistakes and certainly harder turns/bigger pulls without penalty...in fact with some gains. I think I can rip ZO, too, with some time to work it. Those ripping ZO may have some issue to come ski PP(but why would they want to?). Bottom line is it's fun to run great passes and post scores tourney or practice...but real street cred is tourney and that's ZO.

 

I decided today screw the PP practice scores...I need to focus on ZO skiing style even when behind PP and make it habit so when ZO time comes I'm there. I was able to do this last year when getting some ZO reps...this year need to be especially attentive with 6 rounds of skiwatch tourney coming soon. Would love another big score there this year (and if I don't get one, hopefully Jim does!)

 

[GOODESkier]

@6balls ........is it your boat set up with Startgazer AND ZBox? or someone elses? Just curious.

[6balls]

@GOODESkier nope, two 196's with standard PP and a Bu response lx with standard stargazer. I only get ZO time if I get a chance to ski with my brother or ski a tourney.

[GOODESkier]

@6balls I do believe it matters if you have the latest version of Stargazer and the ZBox. Also have to have them dialed in. Then I think you could close your eyes and "wonder" which system you were skiing, Might be an option if you can't jump to the ZO full time for practice.

[Razorskier1]

@Than_Bogan -- I typically don't even shoot at -38 on my home course. 750 acre public lake -- deep and somewhat rolly (not too bad), but the most difficult site I ski. Typically I work technique there, and work on -38 at our private site on the weekends. Well, this weekend I won't be getting to the site tomorrow, and while I may get there Sunday, it looks a bit breezy. So this morning was calm and I went out. Zbox, C2 on my 2005 197TT. Decided that if I didn't work on it here, I might not get a chance this weekend. One shot with the sun at my back to figure out the gate timing on this lake (seems like you don't glide at all on this lake), one shot into the sun, where I just got blinded. Third shot with the sun behind me and I ran it. Ya know, it isn't a tournament, but I still went to work with a smile on my face! (sorry @OB ;-).

[6balls]

Yah running 38 @razorskier1's lake IS a big deal...perhaps bigger than a tourney. Never skied more difficult water. It aint' the rolly's etc...it's got some sort of funky water composition that acts like velcro on the ski despite being relatively clear water. It's not mushy like a shallow/murky swamp...firmer than that...but really hard to get any acceleration/swing/width. It has all the worst characteristics of what anyone would consider "fast" or "slow" water all in one place. Chalking up a 38 there is some real skiing.

Yeah, we talkin' 'bout practice! I don't have a 38 there on any of the 4 speed control systems that have been the deal since Jim moved there. I'm pretty sure I have more missed 35's there than anywhere else as well and I don't ski it that often...it's my albatross.

Nice work there, brutha. I'm sure Susan was weaving all over the course for you (not).