Howa1500 Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 http://cd8ba0b44a15c10065fd-24461f391e20b7336331d5789078af53.r23.cf1. Definately was ahead of its time, does anyone know the stock settings for the wake plate or how far down its supposed to be set. There is no way the wake should be that big right? No stringer rot and no soaked foam in the bottom. I guess I'm confused why the wake is so big, can anyone help me out. Thanks ballers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted October 17, 2015 Baller_ Share Posted October 17, 2015 Dead flat with hull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 Really? I thought with the plate down it flattens the wake, could be wrong @Wish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller rodltg2 Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 No matter what position that plate is in , the wake should not be that big at ski speeds. You have something going on there. But yes slightly down typically lifts the rear and would flatten the wake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Dacon62 Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 What speed is that? Looks like mid/upper 20's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Zman Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 What prop are you running? What RPMs at 34 MPH? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 @Dacon62 30-32 @Zman just the standard stock three blade prop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller aupatking Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 I ran a Tige SLM 2000 for a couple years and the best wake was with the plate dead flat. I'm with @Wish on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller aupatking Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 http://rochester.craigslist.org/boa/5224390344.html Brother, I just solved your problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 The plate on the boat is dead flat and the wake is surprisingly large @aupatking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller aupatking Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 I agree that something is wrong. That looks like a mid 20's wake. It's been a lot of years since I've skied behind a TS6M but I remembered it fondly. I don't think that would be the case with that wake in your picture. I'd go incrementally down and up and see what you get (obvious) but you aren't getting any worse than what you've got (obvious again) and I don't see any guidance online. Take a sharpie to the threads to monitor the changes. Props do make considerable differences, as @Zman was asking. Have you paid attention to what your RPM at 34, Or other speeds are? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Dacon62 Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 Good point...what rpm are you at for the various speeds? You should be at 3400 rpm or less at 32 mph. If not maybe your speedo is messed up and reading a higher speed then you are actually traveling at. Have you calibrated your speedo through a slalom course? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 Don't know what my RPMs are but I don't have a problem with my two speedos reading differently @Dacon62 @aupatking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Dacon62 Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 Report back with speed and rpm data...something smells here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller aupatking Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 get a GPS app for your phone or assume your speedos are correct, RPM is still a more important gauge of whats wrong, so see what its turning at 30, 32, and 34, versus what it should. I'm at the end of my knowledge here as it pertains to a Supra though, and their owners forum says about what we've all said here. The owners manuals do say a 1/4 inch plate adjustment is drastic. I will say, an old prop, turning too many rpms is not giving the proper upward or forward thrust. I'd be very surprised to find the prop 100% at fault though.That is, if the plate itself cannot rectify Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Zman Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 It also appears you have some imbalance in the boat side-to-side. Can you get the wake to level out by getting the boat balanced? Verify speed with GPS app as suggested, along with RPMs at several ski speeds. You say the plate is dead flat. Is that your calibrated eye, or using a good straight edge like a level? With boat and wakes balanced, then try plate adjustments in small increments starting with slightly upward on trailing edge and record your results with pics of the wakes. Curious, how many people (and other weight) in the boat when pics were taken? May want to consider removing rear seat to take some rearward weight out (wood frame seats are kind of heavy). I loved my old Comps in the day, except the "22 off bump". The 22 bump seemed like a right of passage back then. If you could edge your ski well enough to make it not seem quite so bad, your skiing was improving. The ts6m Comp had an interesting hull design. On one hand, driving the front V-hull down (plate downward as @Wish noted) made a smoother ride, and improved the wakes for slalom - up to a point. The more you drive the bow downward the more drag you created. More drag required more throttle and prop RPMs, which then began to hurt wakes and performance. So, this is not "more is better". There is a sweet spot for setting the plate. Somewhere near flat, but could vary some from boat to boat. Good luck! Keep ue posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 Speedo could very well be the problem, I mistyped on the other comment. My speedos do read two different speeds at times. When I was skiing on our other boat 36 seemed pretty fast, but on the new(old) supra I feel like I could go 40 and it still doesn't feel as fast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Dacon62 Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 As a very general rule most boats of that era turned x100 rpm of the speed they were going. 32 mph = 3200 rpm, 36 mph = 3600 rpm. If your rpm gauge is functional just set your speedos that way for now until you have the tools to fine tune it. Any early Supra ts6m owners please chime in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller GOODESkier Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 @aupatking when ever you find a boat with "PV" on the bow........ I would likely walk away. In NY State that stands for public vessel. Basically kids camps, schools, and stuff like that. I worked for a camp for a while...... NEVER would have bought a boat from them! Buyer Be Ware! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller foxriverat Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 Heres the manual for an 89 comp. Page 22 says cavitation plate flat for slalom. http://www.supraboats.com/sites/default/files/downloads/manuals/89_comp-conbrio_owner_manual.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted October 17, 2015 Baller_ Share Posted October 17, 2015 Yeeup.... Flat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller foxriverat Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 If you know where theres a truck scale I would weigh the boat. Dry weight without trailer should be 2185 lbs according to NADA Check the seals around those supertrapp mufflers. They are prone to leak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted October 17, 2015 Baller_ Share Posted October 17, 2015 They put foam between the stringers. If you're floor is even a little soft you can bank on taking the wood floor out in handfuls after the carpet is pealed back. The foam supports the floor enough to walk on but it's really the foam you're standing on. Foam will hold water but the wood holds a ton. I replaced my floor with a composite one. But still think you need to do 2 things suggested. Use GPS on phone to determine actual speed and put that plate flat with hull. Then report back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 The plate is flat with the hull though, that's the problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller aupatking Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 @GOODESkier that's good info. That thing has a 302 in it as well. Good candidate for a repower, but the price may be high for that. I just love those bubble butt tsc's. Sorry for taking us off topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 The plate is flat with the hull though, that's the problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Zman Posted October 17, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 17, 2015 Like @Wish and @foxriverat are noting, verify for sure that the floor has not soaked up water, and yes those old SupraTrap mufflers almost always leaked eventually. If boat has taken on water and soaked the flooring or dead space under it, making it heavier, wake will suffer a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck_Dickey Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Those old speedo's are adjustable so you can calibrate them using a hand held gps. I had an '87 and the wake was pretty great. I ran the plate ⅛" down from dead flat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 A lot of people say how nice these old supras are.......I just can't figure out why the wake is so big. Can the plate being too far down make the wake bigger?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Dano Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 I would take @wish advice and get a GPS app for your phone to make sure your speedo is correct. The size and shape of the wake in your pic looks similar to my wake ('89 centurion falcon) at 24-26 mph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller GregHind Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 @Howa1500 yes if it is too far down it will make a rooster tail like the one in your photo. Is it level with the bottom of the hull, as measured with a straight edge or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Waternut Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 Boat and trailer together should weigh in around 3300-3500 lbs together. You could always try this method and calculate the weight at your house to see if you're even close to that weight. Don't forget the front trailer jack but it might be easier to just put a bathroom scale under it with a block of wood to protect the scale. http://exploratorium.edu/snacks/tired_weight/index.html As for the wakeplate being slightly down affecting the wake negatively.... I call BS. Granted I didn't own this same boat but I did install a hydraulic wakeplate on my old 86 Dixie Super Skier. The wakeplate always made the wake smaller when it was down. Didn't matter if we were doing 20mph with 5 people and 700lbs of ballast, 30 mph, or 36mph. It was always smaller and always shaped smoother whenever the wakeplate was even a hair lower than level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller GregHind Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 I've installed plates too. They can make a rooster tail. Watch behind your slalom ski, the tail will be well under water, pushing down. Look at the wash it creates. Different ski shapes make a different wash (eg try a square tail flat bottom wood ski) but you'll get the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 My boat on the top seems considerably lower as far as wake plate goes compared to the same boat I found on YouTube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller EFW Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 Fwiw - 97 SN -The Meloon's had a direct connection to that school.Besides it being a Christian based college one of the last guys I delivered to there was married to a Meloon. My guess would be if that boat needed something CC would've helped out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Zman Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 @Howa1500 is on the right track. That second pic is much closer to what the adjustment knobs on the turnbuckle should be set. And, yes you can def hurt the wake adjusting plate down too far (not if slightly too far down). With the Supra, more is not better. There is a sweet spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Waternut Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 Interesting. You guys owned the boat so I'll concede. However, on my boat, it didn't matter if the plate was a hair down or a 3 inches down. The wake was always better than when the wakeplate was flat. Even if you skied over the rooster tail, it was still better than when the plate was flat... When the plate was fully down, it did make the wake look mean but there was so much air in it, that it felt like nothing at certain line lengths. Felt firmer but small at others but even firm and small felt better than firm and big which is what it normally was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 I guess I just gotta find the sweet spot. And I'll report back with the rpm's at different speeds but we put the boat away last weekend so I'll have to do it next year. Thanks everyone for there comments! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Dacon62 Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 Not going to see the end of this movie till next spring...well that's a let down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 Disappointed but something to look forward to next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller GregHind Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 How about a photo from side on looking slightly upwards at the bottom of the boat. Hold a straight edge(spirit level or good straight bit of timber Etc) that is say 4ft long along the hull and plate. That will show in the photo how far below level the plate is. Does that make sense? If the plate is below level, the straight edge will touch the plate at the end and you'll see a gap along the straight edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Ed_Obermeier Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 @Waternut your Dixie SS had more of a runabout hull shape, correct? Most OB's and IO's I've skied behind back in the day did way better with the trim all the way down, which would be about the same thing as running the wake plate down on yours. IMO likely the reason you got the results you got with a wake plate on that hull. Entirely different hull designs from the Supra's. The wake difference at different speeds was also noticeable. Slower speeds = larger wakes on that hull. I owned a 2000 Supra Legacy for 8 years, had the hydraulic adjustable wake plate so it was very easy to play with the plate settings. Always went back to running it completely flat (on plane) with the bottom of the hull for best results. Yeah it was a newer boat than being discussed but the Supra slalom boat hull designs were basically pretty consistent through the years. IMO the suggestions that you have wet foam under the floor adding a lot of weight are likely pretty spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller socalskier Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 I owned an 89' and ran the plate flat. The girls always loved to ski behind it at lower slalom speeds. The wake was minimal for the era at least. There was a bump at 22 but that was probably mostly us because that's about where the most of us were topping out at then. I did love that boat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Waternut Posted October 18, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 18, 2015 @Ed_Obermeier Very good point. The Dixie boat wasn't quite a runabout hull but it did have a deeper V shape than most direct drive boats I've seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 I'll post a picture in a few minutes. One thing I don't understand is that, how would the foam be wet and the floor not soft. Don't they coincide? There should be a correlation between the two, if the floors soft the foam is wet, If the foam is wet the floor is soft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted October 18, 2015 Baller_ Share Posted October 18, 2015 The foam holds water but does not deteriorate or get soft like a sponge. It just gets heavy. The wood however gets heavy and wet like a sponge and through the process of rot gets so soft under the carpet that you can feel it. If the foam was not there, your foot would go through the floor and into the bilge. Make sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Share Posted October 19, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howa1500 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Share Posted October 19, 2015 It's impossible to have it flat with the hull and touching the edge of the plate, the second photo gives you a broad idea of how far down it is. The first photo, the hockey stick isn't flush with the hull Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Zman Posted October 19, 2015 Baller Share Posted October 19, 2015 That just proves the trailing edge of the plate is way too far down, as several of us have been suspecting. As I mentioned in PM, adjust to where you have about a 1/4 inch between adjusting knobs, then start testing from there next spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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