Buoyhead69

@RichardDoane great advice on this thread thank you and I definitely understand where you’re coming from. However, for @pregom, I too was always confused when I’d hear really good skiers say stuff like -28 is easier than -22. As a guy who just started running my 34.2mph -28 pass late this summer/fall, I can say it’s not easier than -22 LOL! I’ve gotten a few balls at -32 and same thing. Harder! Things happen so much faster at shorter lines!! It’s really like anything else in life, repetition and more importantly repetition of good habits. Skiing with better skiers than myself has also been huge for me, taking their advice. Obviously staying stacked is the biggest challenge and physics dictate that shorter lines make this more challenging. Plus, like @gregy I became a big believer in proper fin set up, just shocked at the difference it makes. I’ve been told “don’t think in the course!” Instead rely on muscle memory etc. However, for me if I have 1 thought it’s “back arm pressure.” I met Nate in FL & heard him say this & didn’t understand it because at that time I was skiing much slower speeds. Now I find it really helpful, it kills 3-4 birds with 1 stone. If I have good back arm pressure I’m more likely to pull through the wakes, keep slack out of the rope, keep my elbows on vest & handle in a strong position, and my hips up & chest stacked on hips. So that works for me but a guy in our lake who skies nationals said “I hate that one, I’ve heard guys say that but it never worked for me.” So obviously many different ways to look at things. Any other “course thoughts” out there?

Just posted this on another thread but probably more pertinent here- But I’m blown away by this wing adjustment. Especially in light of the recent thread asking if -38 skiers notice fin changes more than -28 skiers. To reiterate, I’m a rookie, 3rd summer in the course, very happy to be skiing 34.2mph and getting my -28 this fall. Still, I thought fin settings were for “guys like you” not me. I skied again today with my new 9 degree wing instead of 8. Both air & water in 40s, and a steady crosswind we don’t see on our lake very often. I ran -22 back to back, multiple passes, felt in control & much easier to remain in a stacked position across both wakes. Never close to an OTF. Plus the ski seems to snap around the buoys quicker. Almost cut it to -28 but in these conditions decided to groove my -22. So I agree obviously that a stacked position is absolutely vital. Just blown away by how much easier I stay stacked by that that one little adjustment. @AdamCord said I’m in the beginning, “put it on 10 and find out” I went to 9 instead but I found out.

Done. And will continue. God bless.

Thanks @RichardDoane good advice and everything @BRY said is true. But I’m blown away by this wing adjustment. Especially in light of the recent thread asking if -38 skiers notice fin changes more than -28 skiers. To reiterate, I’m a rookie, 3rd summer in the course, very happy to be skiing 34.2mph and getting my -28 this fall. Still, I thought fin settings were for “guys like you” not me. I skied again today with my new 9 degree wing instead of 8. Both air & water in 40s, and a steady crosswind we don’t see on our lake very often. I ran -22 back to back, multiple passes, felt in control & much easier to remain in a stacked position across both wakes. Never close to an OTF. Plus the ski seems to snap around the buoys quicker. Almost cut it to -28 but in these conditions decided to groove my -22. So I agree obviously that a stacked position is absolutely vital. Just blown away by how much easier I stay stacked by that that one little adjustment. @AdamCord said I’m in the beginning, “put it on 10 and find out” I went to 9 instead but I found out.

@wilecoyote BTW can’t blame any of those OTFs on my boat, I really love my boat (2012 Malibu Response Txi), no issues with the wake at -22 or -28. It’s a great boat but sounds like you have a beauty too! If I ever get rid of mine it’ll be for a Nautique 200!

Skied today with more wing; 9 degree instead of 8. It made a profound difference. Very cold today (air & water in 40s). Not even a sniff of going OTF even with cold/wetsuit & hands a little numb. Ran my -22 & it seems I found my setting. .Fast enough to be early to the ball but never felt like i was screaming across the wakes. Definitely focused on good body position but I’m now a believer in the importance of fin set up. Even felt like the ski “snapped” around the buoy & my turns were quicker/easier. Could this have.anything to to with more wing?

Thank you. I’m in West Bloomfield. Lyon Ski club has a couple tournaments close by. I almost entered one last summer but I wasn’t running passes at 34.2mph consistently & for me to commit to a tournament I want to at least be running -22 basically every time, I’m sure I’ll be nervous! But thanks again, I see you’re from the West Side of the state?

@wilecoyote, this fall was warm & I was running-22 regularly, finally got my -28 & ran it a bunch & even got a few balls at -32 so I was extremely happy about that. Things changed when I went to a new ski with new set up (less wing). Suddenly I had a few OTFs at -22. Really aggravating! But lots of great advice on BOS forum. I like the idea that cold, wetsuit, less wing whatever, I have to stay committed to good body position. @BRY makes good points. And I’m happy that after my last OTF I ran the very next pass with the same ski/setup. I want to try my 1st tournament next year & tournament skiers on our lake (nationals qualifiers) tournaments are a total game changer- no familiar boat, lake, friends etc. I gotta be able to run that -22 pass in my sleep to get it in a tournament. But it’ll be fun to add some wing, I hope to get out tomorrow.

@BRY you make good points. Plus it fits that, when I do go OTF, it’s from 4 to 5 ball. I’m in a heavy cold wetsuit & I get lazy/unfocused going to 5. I gotta be able to make that -22 pass in my sleep, even if I’m cold.

@Horton you look damn good on that video.

I’m in a wetsuit over a heater shirt. That’s a good point, probably does add 10lbs. A lot of variables to cold water skiing.

@Horton I’m skiing less wing now. I was set up on my previous ski at 10 degrees, a whole lot of wing. It was all I knew, I bought it that way, I was new to the course & skiing 29mph so I just skied. I’ve worked really hard to improve & now I’m skiing 34.2 and shorter lines & figure I should think a little about fin settings so I set my new ARC more toward stock. So now I’m at 8 degrees. I was wondering if this may be why I’m having these ridiculous over the top crashes right as I’m crossing the 2nd wake. I usually fall at the buoy as I’m trying to set edge/angle & body position, I can live with those falls I’m going slow! But over the top across the 2nd wake? Not fun, especially in cold water. @AdamCord no offense was taken, that’s good advice. I will change it today. Why should I try to get more toward stock? I thought having less wing more toward stock would make me more of “real skier.” Dumb of me. Really looking forward to seeing how more wing feels.

Still skiing here in MI. I got a D3 ARC to replace my worn Quest 45. I checked the settings on my Quest and it was almost dead on stock. EXCEPT, 10 degree of wing. I had skied that Quest for years and really improved a lot on it so that’s all I knew. So I set up my ARC to stock but put the wing at 8 degrees because 10 is a lot of wing and I wanted to try it more toward a stock setting. I have gone over the top across the second wake about 4 times in the last few weeks skiing that ski which is more than the whole summer for me. It seems to always going from 4-5 ball, I’m LFF, and it’s always during a good set where I feel good & early to the balls but I just scream across the wake and go boom. Not fun. I do like the ski, I am getting to the ball much faster, seems like in a nanosecond I’m across the wakes & at the ball (although this may be due to less wing?) and I’ve had some great passes on it. It’s cold & windy here so I’m skiing 34.2, usually-22 or a half loop which amounts to -25, sometimes-28 if the water is good. I’ve given up on -32 for this year, it’s cold & I don’t want to get hurt- hence the disdain for going over the top! So, is the ARC faster than my Quest? Is this because of the wing? Is it just me getting lazy going to 5 ball? Should I just put the wing back to 10 degrees? Advice please.

I was in a similar situation last year Skiing 32mph 22’ off with a goal of skiing 34mph, I’m 48. Bottom line IMO; get a tournament Ski. D3 Quest 45 worked awesome for me, extremely stable I’d recommend 100%. It replaced my Radar Senate, the Senate is not a true course Ski. A guy I ski with is your size and he skis a 65” I believe 67” is much too big for you. I ski a 67” and I’m 6’1”, 175lbs. BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, work on technique. I ran a few last year at 34mph & saw one on video & I looked terrible. 2 guys I ski with are tournament skiers & skied nationals many times & they told me I looked terrible. They said slow it down & learn how to ski properly. It was hard to hear but they were right. They told me how to get my hips & handle in proper position, finish my turns & pull through both wakes properly. I also took a couple lessons at Eden in Ft Myers. And I’m basically addicted to this ridiculously addictive sport & have learned so much & realize Still I know very little. But now I start the boat at 34.2mph, run -22 as my opening pass, I have a half loop (from Brenda at IN TOW, awesome lady) and run that a few times before going to -28 and now into -32 but I haven’t run it yet. 34.2mph is dramatically different than 32, and short line only gets harder so, as said above; Coaching. I’d never be doing this if I didn’t get body position corrected & I’m still light years away from elite skiers.

I never take out my liners. I should point out, I ski a lot. So when I get 3-4 months on my 2016 Vapor that's over 150 sets. I've never thought of return/warranty because I ski so much I'd feel like I'm stealing. As said above, things wear out. A couple guys I ski with use hardshells and recommend them but, truthfully, I'm used to the Vapor and I'm so happy with my progress I'd rather stick with what I know and just replace than switch to something that might screw me up. Just last year my goal was running 32mph -22. Now, I'm chasing the -32 pass at 34mph and that boot is all I've skied so I'm hesitant to change because I'm having so much fun, never thought I'd ever be on the -32 loop! So I just keep buying my Vapors... add it to the list, just ordered a new pair of Pro Locks too. But I should try a hardshell for durability... just a little nervous about making a change.

@rayn OK thanks so much for that. Has he had any issues with rips? Anybody out there care to share their experience with the durability of the 2017 or 2018 Vapor boot?

@OldboyII thanks for the link. After looking at the pictures and still having some doubt I decided to call Radar directly. The woman was very nice on the phone but she didn't know. She'd be happy to get me to the director of boot design/production, but unfortunately... he's in China! LOL see thread below "which skis made in USA." She said he'll send me an email

@cragginshred Thank you for info, I checked the Radar website, it appears Carbitex & Vapor Carbitex are, in fact, the same boot. Really glad Radar got rid of that rubber piece, the new one looks like a good design. I guess it better be for $320, yikes! I'll buy it next spring when my 2016 rips again... FYI I've never had any issues releasing from my Vapors.

Hey @spicoli does the 2017 Vapor carbitex have that rubber thing in the back by the Achilles/calf area like the 2016??? I hate that thing, I just posted on it today. I've ripped that several times & had to had a back up 2016 new in box (found a sweet deal online this winter so I bought 2). I assumed the 2017 carbitex eliminated that rubber piece? Am I wrong on that?? Otherwise Love the boot & really don't want to change...

I personally use a 2016 Radar Vapor boot (pre-carbitex), I found a great deal online last winter & bought 2 of them beacaue I've found the rubber at rear Achilles/calf area rips (probably why they switched to carbitex for 2017) & when it rips it affects my ability to finish my turn & create speed across the wakes big time. I replaced my boot last week and, to be honest, I believe it played a pretty big role in finally running my 34mph -28 and getting into -32. I use a RTP, no double boot. I've been told to try hard shell for durability & support but I'm used to the Vapor & I like it. Next year I'll buy the carbitex. Fin is stock, this winter I plan to read the Fin Whisperer. I never thought I was a good enough skier to worry about fin set up, but at this point I want to look into it, you guys have made a big impression on me!

@GMC Hi I thought you might see this lol, I really do appreciate your honesty, really good of you & much appreciated. I'd still love to try that ski but my Quest 45 got me running 34mph -28 and now into -32 so I'm really happy with it. I want to be clear I'm not trying to buy a ski to get me to my next pass, I know that's all me not the ski but with the chips & dings Is it indicative of further issues within the ski (at least 500 sets on it). Obviously can't be too bad I'm getting my -28 & now into -32. But how do you guys determine when to buy a new ski? Or new rope & handle for that matter? I don't have any experience with this stuff, only my third full summer on the course...

Oops that got cut off. He said its dramatically different than anything he's ever skied before & he's a very experienced tournament skier. Basically said the second you release the handle it slows down dramatically, no "glide" & despite tweaking the fin etc he couldn't get used to it. This makes sense given Adam Cord's GUT theory, the idea of a ski that makes the skier keep tension & pull to get high on the boat then slows down quick to get around the buoy. I'm extremely intrigued by it but I should probably stay with something more predictable im still a rookie!

LOL he's a heck of a nice guy & honest guy but a sub-par salesman

Thanks @Than_Bogan I always appreciate your comments on any topic you always have good stuff & a sense of humor. Actually, a guy who skis with a bunch of guys on my lake is selling his almost new Denali c65... hmmm... do I have that kind of $ burning a hole in my pocket???

Thanks everyone for the feedback, after all the good advice I did... nothing. But ski more & work on my position & gate & width. So... I'm now running my 34mph -28 which I'm unbelievably happy about. Now trying to get around 3 ball at -32 (why is this so addictive, I though -28 would be the holy grail! Now I want -32!) I'm still on my 2015 Quest 45, getting used to -32 & the load, gate, wake, etc. I looked at my Quest; 3 small cracks at tip and 2 digs in the ski, 1 at rocker block & one near my RTP, both on my offside edge. I love this ski I'll never sell it, but are these signs that the ski is breaking down? Obviously it's not bad, I got my -28. As @PurdueSkier said it would be fun to have a new toy but at this point is that all a new ski would really be?