How should we use the Rule Book?

[Horton]

Story # 1)This summer a friend of mime went out of state to a tournament and returned with the following story. I was not there so what follows is approximately true – it makes my point.  She was standing under a slalom tower and watching the skiing. She could hear the judge calling in the scores. She clearly saw a number of skiers get scores that did not reflect their performance. An example would be a skier runs 2.5 and gets credit for 3. She spoke up and in the end became branded the “enemy of fun”  (again my interpretation).

 Story #2) I skied a tournament this year where I squeaked around 4 at 38 and did my signature Zig Zag to get the whole ball. After the boat passed the 4 ball guides and the driver knew that I was about to take a hit so he pulled back in the throttle.  Since the boat speed changed before I got back to the wakes, I thought that my score should be only 3.5. Oddly, I complained and was told the driver was just trying to keep me from dislocating my arms. I feel that this is not in the spirit if the rules. Everyone else on site thought I was trying to be the "Enemy of Fun".

Here in SoCal I think we are pretty strict “by the rule book” skiers.  On the other hand there is a lot of talk about the decline in tournament participation.  Me, personally, I am wired to ski by the book. I do not want a slow time or a funny path. I am actually annoyed that I have a score in the book that is incorrect (I only ran a 4 @ 38 once last weekend – not twice).  

The question is, should USAWS lighten up? Is it just SoCal that is too anal? Would a different tone attract more skiers? INT has a totally different culture than USAWS and generally I think they may have a better approach to fun. I freak’n hate that INT skiers often think USAWS water skiers are elitists or humorless. Maybe we deserve it.

 Please do not use any names or point fingers in your replies.  This is not about specifics – it is about culture.  As always please keep this friendly – I know this subject can get you guys excited.  

[Than_Bogan]

Argh!  So many awesome topics today!  How am I supposed to work!??

Personally, I scale my strictness based on the level of the skier.  We had a kid skiing in her first class C a few weeks ago.  She's fairly good for a 10 year old girl whose parents grew up in the desert, but on this occasion she missed her opening pass.  We immediately invented a reason to give her a re-ride.  We intentionally broke the letter of the rules, and I would do it again.

If a skier is maxing out at -22 and misses the opening gate by a couple of feet, I may choose to look the other way.

But for you or me, if the score is not achieved strictly within the rules, then it doesn't count.  That's what it means to have organized competition -- otherwise we can all just phone in our practice scores.

The one that bugs me is people at class C tournaments who have somehow gotten the idea that they are not supposed to "use" quarter balls -- i.e. round that off to a half.  I am amazed how many time somehow has asked "are we using quarter balls?"  Um, we ALWAYS use them.  Those are the rules of the sport!

Off topic: You've also brought up the one rule that I most strongly disagree with.  When they changed the rules so that you have to beat the snot out of yourself to get a full ball on a slack rope, I think that was a huge mistake.  I can't see anything gained by that except increased chance of injury.  [[Well, actually I have some way-outside-the-box ideas about "full" balls, but that's WAY off topic.  Maybe some time in the winter I'll start a flame war with that proposal!]]

[Dirt]

I have to agree with Than. As much as you ask for it by not attempting to get to 5 (at 34mph), I do not want the driver allowing you to get hurt. I think he/she did it for safety reasons. If I were skiing after you, I would not want to wait with my ski on while they locate your missing body parts amongst the yard sale. I would not care if you beat me by a half buoy. I ski against my PB anyway. I want everyone to do their best.

If it is a record tournament, regionals, nationals, etc.. then it is ok to spend time locating your arms.

I don't want anyone to be too strict, especially with kids and novice skiers. When I used to drive, it was always my fault if someone missed a deep water start. On the other hand, I never get upset when someone takes my gates, gives me a quarter when I thought I got a half, etc. They are judging and it is their call.

[bmiller3536]

Alot of class C tournaments do not have towers set up in the proper position to actually see the gates. And if they do only one judge has a really good look at it. So even if you cut the gate, it will still get scored as 6. So I always agree and call it 6, why not

I do not have a problem with the "Enemy of Fun" but I try to make sure I know when they are going to be on the towers and what towers they are going to be in.

The thing that bothers me more is the person that gives the call or a friendly boat path to his friend but will cut another persons gates or not pull back on the throttle for someone he does not know.

[Horton]

Miller,

Funny. I would take my own score down if it is by the book. You do not want me judging if you are going to fudge. I am the "E.O.F"

[skidawg]

Bourbon in the blood makes u the intergalactic enemy of fun.

[Dirt]

I was in a recent tournament where Horton took my entrance gates from the far tower.

[skidawg]

He's just jealous that u have the ability to taze him at will!!!

[Horton]

I guess I should be happy that this thread stayed serious for a few hrs

[bmiller3536]

That is it, next time smart is around we have a tazer round, person with the lowest score gets tazed...that should add some excitement

[Horton]

I am down with that! MS will miss his opener for sure.

[JacStocks]

Second try posting...

You're not the enemy of fun, you're the champion of justice!

This is a conversation we frequently have in our office. We have to balance consistency and rules versus fun. In all sports there are rules to provide a level of expectation for success, but we do it for fun. At the end of the day we don't want anyone to walk away mad or feeling cheated. Most event organizers emphases consistency and education to drivers and judges so that we can provide the best pull possible. But we also advise them to give the skiers the benefit of the doubt if there is any question. Human error is always a possibility.

In INT events we emphasis fun, but maintain a strong set of rules or expectations. We do this in a few ways. INT offer's novice divisions so that skiers can miss their gates or a few bouy's and still get a score with a clear path to progress. In the other divisions we offer a mulligan so that if a skier misses their gates, a buoy or falls they can have a second chance on their second pass. This year we even had a few events with a floating mulligan. Skiers could take their mulligan at anytime in there set. The goal was to push the level of performance and shake things up a bit. No matter what, the skiers should have a fair chance get their best score.

The INT format is just one option for providing a "fun" environment for skiers trying to improve and have a great tournament performance. 

My soap box for the day: I would like to see collegiate skiing reformed. There are a handful of collegiate teams who have very high caliber skiers, but the majority of teams have many skiers who can only go out to the one ball and come back to the wake. Yet the NCWSA only offers women's and men's divisions. I would love to see them offer a novice division or a mulligan to give new skiers more course experience. Collegiate skiing is the best grassroots program that USA Waterski has going. College students are doing a great job getting new skiers into the sport, primarily because of the fun environment. They get to be a part of a team, travel together, hang out at the lake, and participant in other after sundown extra-curricular activities. I wish that USA Waterski would put more time and money into collegiate skiing and embrace the fun culture that these students have created. My perspective is based on my experience as a collegiate skier in the Western Region, and I realize that in some other regions there are high level skiers who take collegiate events very seriously, which makes this idea impossible at the National level.  But I think there is a time and a place for "serious rule following" and it is record capable USAWS events.

In conclusion, we all want to have a good time. However our humanity provides us with a need for justice. Many of us are invested, we have spent time and money to ski at the level we do and when we go to a tournament we want to get a fair score. I do believe that people are generally good, judges and drivers do there very best with the information they have. I think we need to give each other a break and know that we all have good intentions. I learned this the hard way with a set of pulled gates and a really bad sun glare.

It might not always go our way on the water. But we can always have a good time on the shore! Swerve on my friends!

[Horton]

My real point is should we lighten up? Or is that a bad slippery slope? Do we scare off new skiers?

[ForrestGump]

Typically, I won't cut the power in an attempt to save someone unless it's out the gates. Mainly cause I know they probably came in at about 197mph to 6. I probably wouldn't do it in a tournament either. In practice, sure. 

I had an issue with the letter of the law being applied by a senior judge about 6 weeks ago. I was driving. We had an 8 year old kid who was making his 15mph opener. He cut his gate! Are you freaking kidding me? the kid damn near started crying at the far end of the lake. Had I missed my gate, it'd be one thing. But a kid we're trying to encourage to ski? I wanted to toss the idiot out of the boat and make him walk back.

[bmiller3536]

We could be driving away skiers,

I was talking to a friend I ski with and he has been skiing pretty well so I asked him if he was going to come to an upcoming tournament and his reponse was "no I am not consistent enough with my gates"

 

[ral]

I think that you can lighten up rules before a "fun tournament" starts, and the "lightening" should be known by everyone. We do that, we have friendly tournaments where you can miss one (or more) buoys in your opener and continue, but not fall. If you fall, you are out. Lightening is even for everyone, and not subject to interpretation.

 If rules are twisted on a discretional basis, then there is a huge space for unfairness.

[Than_Bogan]

(I remove this sentence, because ral made the same point but about 1000 times better.)

But I do think we need to understand the situation.  New skiers should be treated very differently, and even more so if they are very young.  Even a "letter of the law" person should realize they can at least give an unscored pass to a kid who missed an opener in a class C.  The kid doesn't care if it's "in the book" anyhow -- just wants to ski.  Discourage somebody like that and over time we'll have no sport at all.

But when I'm out there on my ski, I want NO sympathy.  I don't want ANYTHING that calls a score into question.  In fact, it really bothers me if someone gives me a ball I know I didn't get, because then I find myself thinking that other scores could be tainted by incorrect judgment.  I fully recognize that a difficult call goes to the skier, and that is how it should be.  But I firmly believe a call should never be fudged for any veteran buoy-chaser.

Similarly, I might back off the power for a little kid about to go out the front, but if Horton is back there then I will trust him to make his own decision, and I won't do anything that possibly could call into question his result.  (Well, not intentionally at least!)

I think Jac hits the key point: We must balance the fun with the integrity.  Without integrity, there is nothing to strive for, and ultimately fun is lost.

Finally, there is no reason not to have a fun attitude at the same time as taking the rules seriously.  Waterskiing is freaking fun!  Despite rumors to the contrary, rules are NOT the enemy of fun.  Often, rules create the environment in which fun is possible.  A game with no rules isn't a game at all -- it's simply chaos.  And games are more fun than chaos any day!

In fact, it seems particularly comical to label Horton the enemy of fun.  While I must admit we've never met in person, it seems to me that anyone who insists on having a bad time with Horton there -- has issues.

[skimom]

OK my passion! 

To clarify the rule about holding on for a whole buoy.  No driver should be pulling back the throttle because no skier should be holding on to "beat the snot out of yourself".  If you have slack behind the boat and still ride away, that score should still be a half.  That rule was implemented for the safety of the boat crew.  If Horton did a zigzag, which is what he should do for a whole buoy score then he should have been able to ride away without the driver trying to help.

Also when calling gates and feeling generous just think about what you did to all of the other skiers in the event.

Happy skiing and thanks Than for that last paragraph about "rules creating the environment in which fun is possible.

The Hot Girlfriend

[skidawg]

Serious skiers not takin ourselves to seriously?

[bmiller3536]

"If you have slack behind the boat and still ride away, that score should still be a half."

What?? now you are going to score based on style points?

 

[Dirt]

Hot Girlfriend=Senior/Pan Am Judge=National & Regional Champion

[eleeski]

The rules need to be applied consistently and by the book.

Often, what the judge sees is not clear. In that case, the judge should never rule against the skier. The skier must convince the judge that the ball/gates/trick is missed before the judge rules against the skier. Some strict judges require that the skier prove that they have made the ball/gates/trick. Not only is that unfair, it is killing the sport.

If a judge doesn't know the rules, education is called for. The 1/2 full buoy rule has changed a bit recently (the rules do not automatically cut every full buoy to a half!) . Learn the rule and apply it consistently - to the best of your ability and view.

1/4 buoys are in the rule book - but they are quite rare. Skiers do go past the buoy and ski to their friends on shore or zoom past the buoy and crash tumbling out to score 1/4. But if a skier makes almost any kind of a turn, the plane of the buoys is broken and the full 1/2 is earned. When I am mentoring an aspiring judge I tell them that they will probably never see a 1/4 buoy - and sure enough someone skis 1/4 buoy - but it is very obvious. If it is not clearly 1/4 then it has to be 1/2.

Horton's driver should not have slowed. The 4 stands with a good time. I would have given Horton a mandatory reride if the slowing ran the time out of tolerance. In C he can improve, in R he cannot score more than 4.

I will never take a skier's gates from the far tower. My view cannot be good enough to make that call if it is remotely close.

I will also never cut a trick for preturn as this is impossible to execute and an artifact of super slow motion video.

I interpret the rule book strictly and consistently and always in the skier's favor when there is any ambiguity. Since everybody gets the same judging from me, I am comfortable with this philosophy. And it should maximize the integrity and the fun.

Eric

[ForrestGump]

"That rule was implemented for the safety of the boat crew. " I've always felt this rule would have unintended consequences. I've watched high end skiers come VERY close(like close enough to climb into the boat or onto the platform) to the boat on three occasions this year. 

[disland]

AWSA has a Novice class.You have all kinds of leeway with it. If the skier is a novice pull them in Novice class. We give skiers a mulligan ride in Novice class as every one of our tournaments. They arent worried about qualifying for nationals so dont sweat it. This way you can follow the rules in C/E/L and serve beginers in class F.

 Some of the rule violations being described above wont be found anywhere near our lake. I complely agree when its a close call always benefit the skier. Extra bouys, free gates and bogus rerides dont help anybody.

 If you dont want any rules wakeboard.

[LeonL]

As someone aptly stated earlier, rules are established to eliminate chaos.  Here in KY we go by the rules.  Some we don't like, but we adhere regardless.  I have a problem with the 1/2 buoy - slack rule, but it is what it is and I judge accordingly.  With regard to the little kid who got his gate pulled, I have mixed emotions, but the integrity of the sport and especially rankings and regional/national qualifications are skewed by improperly scoring slalom.   If you look at the AWSA rankings you will find that in B1 the COA for Level 6 is less than a full pass and for Level 7 it is only a full pass at 31kph (19.3 mph).  Shane was PO'd at the senior judge in the boat for pulling his gate, but another judge did as well or he would have kept on skiing.  That's why another rule works -- 3 judges minimum with majority ruling. A note on personal integrity (some would say I'm an idiot) if I miss a gate or buoy I'm through, I quit, regardless of the official score.

[Horton]

Hot Girlfriend = skimom = Senior/Pan Am Judge=National & Regional Champion = Member USAWS Rules Committee = Richelle Matli

[Horton]

Just want to make a point that the driver in the story I tell at the beginning of this thread, was looking out for the skier. As a matter of the rules I disagree what he did but it was not a matter of honestly or integrity. I think that his desire to help me represents a friendlier attitude and maybe a better culture.As I said before, I totally disagree with the practice but I am left wondering if a less ridged USAWS culture would be a USAWS with more participation. I am conflicted. For my whole skiing life I have been a strict by the book kind of guy. I do not want to lower standards but as I see more and more skiers shying away from USAWS tournaments. I wonder if the culture has gone in the wrong direction.  Clearly I have more questions than answers.

[tsixam]

In my opinion…By the book. But when things are unclear or when in doubt if it is a missed gate or a quarter or a half ball the judgement should be in favour of the skier.  Tsixam

[skidawg]

The rules have always seemed to b set up for

trying to make the skier fail, this is a hard sport that always ends in failure, most judges make it worse, baseball rule, tie goes to the runner, rules should be for the skier, close or iffy, skier, huge miss cut em, my two cents?

[Steven]

I think skidawg said it, "The rules have always seemed to b set up for trying to make the skier fail" I know a lot of guys that don't compete because of the pressure of the "Do or Die" opening pass. I've always thought that was kinda wierd that you only get one chance to succeed. Jump gets 3 tries, Trick gets a few tries (not a tricker) why not slalom?  Maybe that's where the Turn and Burn would help to relieve the pressure? Personally I could care less about the tourney, I'm just there for the fun of it all and to see if I can better my past scores. 

[Drago]

There are rules and the spirit of the rules. Is icing a handle within the rules or the spirit of the rules? Should someone who allegedly set a record, but had a long handle not get the record but still have his score in the ranking list?

My feeling  is that if you don't like a rule or disagree with a rule, then follow it until you successfully change it. I hate giving zeroes on misssed gates, or a half because of a little slack, or when a new tourney skier misses an opening pass, but unless I put in the effort to rally for a rule change, I call what I see and stay within the rules.

[kdeupser]

I agree with tsixam.  By the book, but when in doubt the skier get's the benefit of the doubt. 

I'll never forget having my opening pass pulled on me for displaycing the buoy to the outside.  I simply just couldn't stay out there any more, I was so silly early, I was sinking.  I could not believe it, my opening pass.....obviously I was ill at the time, but now it's kinda funny.  This is a competitive sport, and as long as the rules are the same for everybody I'm all for it.

 my .02, Thanks,

Ken D.

[HO 410]

If you monkey too much with rules, without an official rule change, you begin to change the identity of the sport. Part of the appeal of slalom is that my 4 at 34 -15' could beat a Big Dawg if he looses his lunch on an opener.

Novice skiers do need/deserve different rules in certain places. If that needs to treated as a second tournament under a different sanction, so be it. Probably just gates optional and mandatory re-ride on a missed opener for a skier below a certain buoy count.

My understanding is that the full buoy rules was changed to agree with the IWSF rules. I'm not 100% clear why IWSF went with the change, but I thought skier safety was a fairly large part of the reasoning. In part, I agree with that rule change because taking the handle, and a mountain of slack, to the center-line is not nearly the same thing as missing the next 1/4 buoy by a whisker. In practice, however, pitching the handle is probably the better option. That rule falls under, "It sounded a lot better in my head."

[boarditup]

Events must be run by the rules.  However, the current rules are archaic and should be changed to match both technology and the culture.  For example, how long does it take to become a regular judge?  I can get an MBA sooner.  The gates - why does the left gate matter at all?  Fractional buoys - clarify.  Simplicity, please! How many judges and officials are really needed?  Why do I have to remeasure my course every 90-days?  It has not moved in over 3-years.  If you read line-by-line through the rules, like I did, you end up shaking your head in wonder.  I am sure that there are historical examples behind each and every rule, but we have to, like golf, depend on the honesty of the skiers and officials.

 We are tripping over ourselves in absurdity.  It is time to grow up and mature as a sport.

 

[skidawg]

Nicely put boarditup

[Bulldog]

Amen to boarditup, the sport is confusing enough to outsiders with speeds/line length/re rides you name it let alone the actual rule book. It almost makes cricket easy to understand...........

[Chef23]

I am fine with skiing by the rules for me and my son.  My little guy got his pass pulled at regionals where 2/3 judges said he turned inside of one ball on his opening pass.  He was no threat to win his division but was obviously very disappointed to score 0.  He insisted he got around 1 ball but I explained to him that nobody was trying to take a pass away from an 11 year old.  In the same event the favorite in his division missed the entrance gates on his opener and tied my son.

I was at the tournament Than was talking about above and thought it was great that they gave the girl a reride.  It was her first AWSA tournament and it was good for her to get a reride.  My 11 year old asked if he would get a reride if he MOPed and I said no you have skied in a bunch of tournaments.

I have been a tower judge in a bunch of tournaments and I haven't called too many 1/4 bouys.  To me it seems like a call when the skier gets around the bouy and blows out or doesn't get back to the handle.  If the skier gets around the ball and back to the handle I generally score it a 1/2.  I totally agree on calling the gates from the far tower.  It can be very hard to see the gates from the tower.

[RichardDoane]

As a Tower Judge, I can be the "enemy of fun".  I never "take" someone's gates, they missed them.

"Know the rules, follow the rules, and when in doubt give the advantage to the skier"

 

[jdarwin]

Good conversations!  Personally, I don't know why the driver gave a rat's ass about you, Hortonhttp://www.ballofspray.com/vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-cool.gif.  But I've been curious about this for some time.  Let's move the conversation to 6-ball.  As a driver, I've had to make aggressive moves to keep the skier from coming in the boat.  This happened once when I was pulling Parrish at a tournament and again last year when I was pulling Ward.  The skier is at 39-off.  They are incredibly late for 6 ball and their turn puts them in a direct path to hit the side of the boat.  In boat cases, I turned the boat to the right immediately outside the exit gates.  Was that legal?  The skier was technically still "inside the course".  Another example:  I was pulling Dave Goode this June at a record tournament.  He was very late coming out of 6 ball.  The boat had cleared the exit gates and ZO had recorded the full course time (16.95).  I backed off the throttle in order to preserve his back.  He did go out the gates (barely).  He complemented me as a driver but I'm not sure my reaction was appropriate - it was not deliberate but more of an instinctive reaction.  We batted this around over dinner that night.  Where does the course begin and end?  With the boat or with the skier?  If the answer is "the skier", then it doesn't matter what speed the boat is going at the entrance gates - only what speed it's traveling when the "skier" goes thru the entrance gates.  Right?  I'm not a huge fan of the AWSA rule book but as a Senior Driver, my responsibility is to adhere to it or work to change it.  I've championed the Turn and Burn concept in this vein.  Just curious what others think about this.

[Horton]

OK Joe,

Let me reframe your story:  The skier was endangering himself and the driver acted in the name of safety.  The driver (you in this case) is clearly in the right for looking out for skier safety. My question is, if the skier does something that forces the driver to deviate speed or path at the end gates, should the skier be granted continuation?

In the case of Ward, were you protecting him or the gel coat on your boat? :-)

[Dirt]

Don't worry about Dawg. He won't let a little gel coat get between him and a full pass. He does not do that funny s turn thingy.

[Jody_Seal]

In the IWSF rule 12.01. (Record)

The entrance of the course for each event are defined.

Slalom: The start gates of the slalom course on the first pass.

So we then we must presume that the exit gates are the end of the course for each completed pass. So if Dave was still between the six and exit gates and the boat backed off then it would have been against the rules to do so. But!!! Being that Joe had the best interest of Dave in mind and saved Dave from possiable injury and provided that the run was not for a championship or $$$$$, As a Senior judge I would have to agree and bring dave in for the next pass.  After all we want our skiers to survive and come back and ski again. I wish some times in the past drivers could have saved me from some of my Nasty jump crashes!!!

Their are times when some sort of on site adjustment and realistic interpatations of these rules must be made as in a lot of instsances they are not black and white

 

A few years ago at the Moomba I was driving a prelim round of slalom and had Steve Cockrum and Jodi Fisher both hit the side of the boat at 39. This is rather un-nerving as a driver because you still have to keep the boat in the middle as the skier could ask for a RR due to boat path. Nothing like hearing the thud and glancing over seeing Steve right on the gunnel showing the judge he had the handle

[skidawg]

JD saved my butt big time on that occassion, we (the boat and I) went thru the exit gates at the same time (with about 15' of slack behind me).  That coulda went really bad.  And I won't make that mistake again.

[jdarwin]

For the record, I was worried about the gel coathttp://www.ballofspray.com/vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-cool.gif - Ward's much cheaper to repair!

[9400]

I asked the question about backing off at the exit gates in the case of severe slack during a judges and drivers clinic. I won't name the judge or the driver but both have judged and driven many pro events and many national and regional events. It was clear to me that they did not have a clearly defined answer as to whether you  (as the driver) could save a skier at the exit gate. I did believe they felt it was implied that you should not back off, but not clearly stated. I took this as a green light to be able to save the skier ( and all in the boat ) in a tournament if I saw the need. It's also a reaction of mine from driving practice. I'm not fond of handles flying by and rope around my neck.

[jdarwin]

9400 / Jody:  I think we all agree that the rules are there for a reason BUT as 9400 pointed out, there really is no definitive ruling on what the driver can/cannot do outside the course.  A few years ago there was talk about timing from the 55's to the entrance/exit gates (Jody, you may be able to verify this for me).  If that were the case, the issue would be moot.  But, there is no timing from the exit gates to the 55's.  In my mind, the boat must slow/stop at some point (you run out of lake!), so does it matter WHERE you begin to slow the boat.  Some sites I drive, you have to begin to slow immediately out of the exit gates.  I know one site that is 1250' long - there are no 55's!  And, several regional records have been set at that site.  The boat has to begin to turn and slow before the skier is completely out of the exit gates.  I'm not defending my actions due to lack of definition in the rule book.  I acted appropriately in the situation I found myself in.  And, would do it again.  Some "purists" may take issue but I would hope a driver would do the same for me.

[RichardDoane]

As a Driver, I will always err on the side of skier/boat crew safety

[9400]

In regards to backing off going out the gate (in the case of severe slack) and with no clear rule in place I think the driver should have the right to save the skier from himself/herself.....every skier I ski with will try to "ride that out" to some degree. I told the judge and driver that I'm glad it's not clear otherwise I would have to try to injure the skier.

 Along a similer line of thinking, this years full buoy rule is more dangerous for the skier and the boat crew and should have been left alone.

....I'm in favor of lots of leeway for very young and first time skiers, for me to pull a gate for someone under 10, they're going to have to miss them bad.

I can't remember who said it on here (maybe a few people) but if there's any question about application of rules, I try to give the skier the benefit of the doubt.

[Than_Bogan]

Along a similer line of thinking, this years full buoy rule is more dangerous for the skier and the boat crew and should have been left alone.

To my surprise -- and great relief -- that is apparently untrue.  See the other thread I started about this topic.

A LOT of us misunderstood -- including Senior Judges here in the Northeast.

[9400]

Than, I stand corrected ....to some degree. The possibility is still there for interpretation, the way I see it "skiing away" and "tight line" have to go together at some point to maintain skiing control. We discussed this rule as well at great lengths. I'm pretty sure I understand the intent of the rule and see it from a different view after reading "the hot girlfriend's" explanation....(thank you ski mom). But let's say as a skier, I'm blazing into the next buoy, have no chance at the next buoy and decide to take the hit just outside the  boat path buoys...and I can't hold it....there goes that handle, into the boat. 

After a view different viewpoints that I had not considered......I can live with it and retract my previous statement, thanks for getting me in line people.