How to get to 3k Points in tricks

[kfennell]

OK, so I would like to try to get to 3k points in tricks withing the next year. Right now I can do the following. S, R, B, F, R, R, WB, WF, R, R, bb, R, WBB, R, TB, TF, TS.

 

WB reverse is not in a wrap yet but I am getting close. I am also getting close to TWB but not close to TWF.

 

Where do I go from here in a pursuit of 3000 points. Bear in mind that I am 31 and 195 lbs so it seems unlikely that I will be able to do flips. I am slowing down my speed and I am down to 18.6/18.3 now. Makes it easier to link tricks together.

 

Thanks for any advice!

 

Edit: That is 1450 points if I could do it all in a row, which I have never done. :( Im pretty sure i can get to 1900 points with TWB, TWF, WO in not too long, but then what? I generally practice hands more then toes just for lack of a 3rd person.

 

[Chef23]

I find TS much harder than TWB/TWF. On the TWF it helps me if I reach for the handle coming back around to the front position. I have most of the same tricks as you except I can do TWB/TWF and WO. I generally don't get credit for TS and I usually fall on RWBB. I generally will do WO, B, F, R, R, WB, WF, R, R, O, R, SS, R I may run out of time for the slides. Second pass TB, TF, TWB, TWF, TS (NC) WBB, R. I generally don't stand everything up but I have once or twice.

 

I need to learn the reverse back wrap because I do those tricks into full backs which slows everything down.

 

@eleeski can tell you what you need to learn to get to 3K. I think it is tough without flips though.

[Jody_Seal]

learn back flip and reverse! from what every one say's they are the easiest tricks to learn!

1000 points! BANG!!

[kfennell]

@Chef23 I have had a little pro coaching, for the toe slide keep your ripe knee up and your knee square then keeo your foot as close to your other knee as possible and just point your knee to the side. Do it for non credit till you get comfortable then step it up. For the back wrap you have to really throw it and get your shoulders involved till you learn the feeling then learn it more smoothly. Hands very wide on the handle, a wakeboard handle can help, and put your front foot hand in your asscrack. Do it outside the wake on the side that your front foot is.

[skidawg]

TO, TB, TF, TS REV, TWB REV, LB, LF; WLB, WLF

[andjules]

I'd start working on TO, and WO.

TWF: feel some weight on your heel as you edge, but imagine landing on the ball of your foot, with your rope-knee up/bent.

Reverse half-wrap is important. However, being able to land an inside-out reverse WB in reverse half-wrap and holding it so that you can do a RWF is pretty tough - much tougher than doing a surface RB to set up for an inside-out WBB.

 

In the old days you'd also be working on line/stepover tricks, but I suppose it's smarter these days to work on flips.

 

[Horton]

Practice

[andjules]

@kfennell I sure hope being 31 and 195lbs doesn't mean you're ineligible for flips! I remember Horton saying he landed one last season; I'm 44, 175-180 on a 5'7" frame, and hoping to re-learn them this summer! You do need to be solid on your ski, both edging and landing.

[kfennell]

You can do them, but you probably have to have learned them earlier in life.

[Horton]

Flips. Freak'n easy in 1993. Nearly impossible in 2014. Should have 2 wake 5s and a SLB plus maybe WL5F in my run in a month or so.

[eleeski]

I was trying to figure how to get you 3000 points. Silly of me. Just ski and have fun. The new tricks and increased points will follow.

 

TWB and TWF are critical and fun. Spend lots of your release person time on those. TO is another straightforward toe trick. RTB is weird and takes a huge amount of time but leads to lots of tricks (and points).

 

WO is a critical hand trick. Not just for points but for the wow factor. Every hotdogger needs a helicopter. It leads to 5s and lots of big points eventually. Learning a wrapped WO was so much fun that I got hooked on trick skiing.

 

Flips, it depends. If you have a gymnastics or diving background absolutely! Flips are very technical requiring spectacular edge control. Plus they hurt when you miss. But the wow factor of a flip is over the top. Aside from a two ski front flip as a kid and one BFLF from before that was a trick, I learned flips in my 40s. While the points are good, it costs me points to put the flip in my run (now I put it at 25 seconds).

 

Too much time is spent on reverse backwrap. Yeah, you need it so learn it. But don't spend hours perfecting it. It's OK to play with it (one footed reverse backwrap teaches you RTB and double wake WBBs are fun). Just don't drill it.

 

I love stepovers but don't learn them. They are dead end tricks in a run and massively underrated. Ski lines instead.

 

Most important is to have enough raw fun out there that you take long runs. Even if that is a lot of wake jumps or dizzying yourself with surface Os. Smile!

 

Eric

[elr]

The 3000 pt no flip runs that I've seen (look at videos of B1, G1, B2, G2 and W3+, M4/5+ nationals) all seem to have WLB LF LB WLF and TO RTB and TBB RTBB. The line tricks and RTB and progeny seem be the key.

[Chef23]

Is there instruction somewhere on how to learn ski line tricks. I would love to get my son working on those.

[dchristman]

@chef23 here's a blog that Russell apparently started a couple years ago and never really got it going. it has one article - ski line back:

 

waterskilife.com/

[Than_Bogan]

Stop it Eric. You're making trick skiing sound FUN!

[elr]

@chef23 if you mean LB LF my son learned by resting his leg on the rope and doing B or F. I have forgotten where I read/heard that. If you are talking about Ski Line tricks you start out by pulling to advance on the boat and then doing a B over the rope as it is lying in the water. It looks like the article cited above disagrees with this as the way to start out. Joel Wing's video may have a section on Ski Lines and there are a couple Youtube videos. Of course its best to get coaching.

[Chef23]

@elr I am talking about ski line tricks. I found this video by Kevin Jack: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Me-NFa5xt0s

 

He has some other videos also. The ski line back looks like it is worth 350 points and it doesn't look as hard as some other tricks. For example the TWLB is only worth 320 and seems like it is much harder.

 

How was your son resting his leg on the rope? I am having a hard time visualizing it. LB, LF are on the list to learn this year. He was out on the trick this year for the second time and was getting WBB landing in the reverse back wrap and holding it long enough for credit. I don't think he can hold the reverse back wrap long enough to edge into the reverse yet.

 

I need to find our release so he can start working on toes again.

[dchristman]

@elr the Joel Wing video advocates the same way of learning the trick as Russell article, albeit in video form. I've watched the Wing SLB section repeatedly, in slow(er) motion before I found the article. I like the textual description. If the line is in the water, it's no credit.

[dchristman]

For those who like to read, Russell also has a nice article on flips and a few on toes here:

 

usawaterski.org/pages/instruction.html

[klindy]

Putting your leg on the rope may work but it forms really bad habits. Advance on the rope with a firm (not hard) pull down toward your thighs. To initiate the turn think about putting your KNEE over the rope. The ski will follow. Envision how a male dog waters a tree...... Putting your leg on the rope encourages the skier to put their FOOT over the rope which will put the skier way too far back on the ski.

 

@kfennell I'd say you're well on the way to 3k. You've also have one of the best trickers and best coaches in the world pretty closeby! @eleeski is right that you need to learn the WO and TWB/TWF and TO. Next in line is the RTB. Learn the TO by controlling your turn (don't just "unwind" by letting the boat pull you). Learning to turn it slowly sets up the T5B. TWB/TWF you need to wait for the wake and make sure you're upright over the ski. Several great tips already above. Without video I'd bet you're turning too early. The wake will 'throw' you in the air, until then, don't turn forward (it'll feel exactly the same as your WBB from the full back position coming in the wake)! The RTB you need to pull the rope in low and firm. Turn backwards and imagine sitting in a chair. Don't attempt to hold it but do make it deliberate and controlled.

 

Learning the TO, TWB, TWF and RTB opens up almost 1500pts. (TO, T5B, TWB, TWF, RTB, RTF, TBB, RTBB). With your other basic tricks you can always start one pass with a TO then move on to surface turns (rope in hand) and the other pass can be T5B, TBB, R, TF, TB, RTF, RTB, TF, TWB, TWF (repeat). By then the TS & R would be there too for another 260pts. So your toe pass is worth 1700 pts +/-.

 

The WO is a foundational trick to higher point wake turns including Ski Line turns. Start wrapped, hips up, wait for the wake and advance using your "free arm" (the one on the rope). As soon as you get the basic turn (same direction as your 'regular' surface back), work on the reverse. I wouldn't get hung up on learning to hold the reverse back position initially - TIP, if you start learning it by holding the handle VERY low (lower thigh) it makes holding it easier. Start there and once you can hold it, "stand up" very slowly. Your body will learn what muscles to use to hold it. Either way, if you can "turn it" (but not hold it) you can add another 110pts by starting at the center of the wake, turn the reverse back as you're moving toward the wake - then do the WF. The do the "regular" back outside the wake and come back in the wake to do the reverse WF. Head back out of the wake and do the WB. Then comes a F. Likewise, going from the 'hard way' back position from inside the wake you can do the WBB to the easy back position. Then do the reverse coming back in with no intention of holding the reverse back landing - just come forward as soon as you land. That's WAY faster than landing fully backwards.

 

I don't agree completely with @eleeski that line turns are not worth learning. He's right that they're underrated but they are a good stepping stone to your 3000k challenge.

 

As stated above, keep it fun!!

[dchristman]

Line tricks aren't dead yet. I saw a few runs beginning with WL5F at the Masters. The juniors are keeping them alive. I think they're worth leaning and fun. Try everything you can! That's what makes it fun.

[elr]

@Chef23‌ - my son put his knee on the rope just past the v of the bridle and did B and F. Learned it as a B1. Yes the knee does go over the rope first. We found that holding RB was easiest learned way out in the flats where the boat doesn't pull you out - not easy. Cory/Joel/Herman/Storm all used rope release when coaching toes. That was one of the YouTube videos I remember watching.