Trickski backflip attempt: feedback needed

[Sanderwouters]

Would be appreciated if I could get some feedback on my backflip attempt.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHAQbzKyPgE

[Bruce_Butterfield]

You are going flat and starting the flip at the bottom of the wakes. Drive all the way through the crest of the wake before starting the flip. I think that’s all you need.

[eleeski]

@Bruce_Butterfield is spot on.

 

Some items I think about to make that happen:

Keep the hands pressed a little low with the arms a little straighter to keep from leaning back or away (no slalom pulls).

I press the tip of the ski smoothly and with smoothly increasing load the closer I get to the wake.

I imagine carving the ski all the way to back even when the ski is in the air.

Ride the ski all the way up before starting to flip.

Spot the landing so you can land on edge carving back into the wake.

 

Also shorten your rope so you don't case the second wake.

 

Have fun, you're close!

 

Eric

 

[dchristman]

This is NOT something to emulate (other than the tenacity part). As I said when you asked last fall... be sure to hold on to the handle, you'd be surprised at what you might ride away from.

 

[skispray]

Some great advice above. Just so you’re hearing the same thing a few different ways, I’ll give you my take.

 

It looks like your turn could be more progressive. Right now, your ski looks like it is pointing 90 degrees to the boat’s direction of travel before you even get to the trough, whereas you probably don’t want to be at that intensity until you’re actually starting to rise up the wake. Don’t change anything aside from your intensity in the middle part of your cut and I think you’ll have it.

[mlusa]

Start is just slightly hard, but very good. From 09-10 secs you are in perfect shape. From 10-11 you "plant" your shoulders and your feet accelerate ahead of your shoulders which have stopped moving toward the wake. If you can keep your shoulders moving with your feet, you will be able to stay over the front foot. At the completion of the turn, you are on your front foot and your shoulders are driving to the wake which is perfect. Maybe you have loaded everything just a little early. Your main attention should be on just keeping right shoulder going with your front foot longer. Concentrate on this and you will stick it very soon. If you can take the turn just a little easier, your legs won't collapse as much as you are cutting to the wake. The taller you are the more lift you will get off the top of the wake. Your handle position is perfect throughout the trick. I like how your elbows stay down and the handle doesn't go over your head. Despite your choice of ski, you should land this trick very soon (lol). Just concentrate on keeping your should moving with your front foot to the wake.

[Sanderwouters]

Got some coaching yesterday and today I landed my first flip, thanks everyone for the feedback!

[klindy]

Needs more cowbell!

 

@Sanderwouters so what was the key to landing it for you?

 

[lhoover]

Forgive the interruption of this thread, but it is you trickers whose opinion I seek. A middle aged woman wants to learn to trick, never having done so. Should she learn on 1 or 2 ?

[Chef23]

@lhoover how good a slalom skier is she? There are benefits to both but I taught my son and the other kids on our lake to trick on 1 ski. If she is going to trick in tournaments it takes quite a while to get two runs worth of tricks. It took toes to get him to close to 2 full passes.

 

It is probably a little easier to initially learn the surface stuff on a pair.

[BraceMaker]

I tried two originally and found it to be miserable once up. Years of not riding 2 skis have made that acqward

[gsm_peter]

Start on one ski.

With two the risk for splits are common and painfull.

See my trick thread with beginer trick ski instruction videos.

 

Best luck and have fun.

[fu_man]

I agree with @Chef23. I am a middle aged guy still adding tricks to my repertoire . I didn't start tricking until I was about 40 and am 1 reverse away from 1000 points. I would start with two. It opens the door for more tricks to learn. That way she can have a two ski pass and a one ski pass which means she can build point more quickly into her runs. Splits have never been an issue for me and are way less of an issue then catching an edge on one ski and slamming into the water. Besides, two ski passes are retro and cool.

[andjules]

Radical (and unproven) idea: assuming she's a comfortable slalom skier & you've got the equipment handy, I'd recommend training half the set on two, half a set on one. As others have hinted, it takes a while to build much of a repertoire on one, and progress goes faster on two. That being said, the skills/body position to ride solidly and comfortably on one is what you're ultimately after.

[Chef23]

Similar to @BraceMaker my kids never liked riding on two. I learned on two but in the 70s everyone learned on two.

[eleeski]

I started on two. Lots of fun playing around on two. Maybe not the best for advancing a tournament trick run but great for building time on trick skis.

 

Stan focused on one. Maybe he got an advantage but we ended up pretty even.

 

Kirk started on a wakeboard with no fins. Very fast learning curve. Other kids learned really fast on the wakeboard - I think the college rules against wakeboards hurts trick learning. However, wakeboard falls are hard. It might not be optimal for older skiers but I know quite a few older wakeboard trickers.

 

@andjules idea of mixing up sets is really good. Throw some kneeboarding in the mix as well as the wakeboard time, two ski time and one ski work and you can meet the one hour time for a set that you need to really get good. Yes, ski hour sets!

 

Eric

[Bruce_Butterfield]

“Middle aged” is a pretty wide range and means something very different depending on our own “age”:). Can you provide a smaller range without getting in trouble?

 

For kids, it’s absolutely 1 ski, but it’s much less clear for chronologically gifted folks.

 

The recommendation between 1 or 2 will be influenced by many factors:

1. Age?

2. How athletic, coordinated, and balanced is she?

3. How comfortable/good is she on a slalom

4. What size single trick does she have and does it have a hard shell?

5. Is there a boom available?

6. Is there another tricker who can provide instruction on the basics?

 

[andjules]

@Chef23 I sometimes wonder if putting a 60lb kid on a 40" trick-ski is very different than teaching a 160lb adult on whatever single 42" ski is lying around. On that note, maybe @eleeski is on to something re: clocking some time getting comfortable on a big ol' wakeboard.

[Chef23]

@andjules you are right bigger is definitely better for beginning tricks. I moved my son to a 43” trick when he was about 120 pounds and it definitely helped his progression. He is still using that same ski ar 180 pounds today.

[dchristman]

If you think it'll be fun, try 2, but I think your time is better spent on 1 if you want to be competitive in the 21st century. It does look retro and cool, though! Here's some inspiration:

 

 

 

[BraceMaker]

@Chef23 I think also they were old Obrien and just not as much control, I bought a 43" d3 and slapped a FM revo on it and way more fun.

[Sanderwouters]

@klindy Being used to backflips on trampoline i was throwing my weight too much back. Also had to edge more progressive and calm. I used to go outside the spray, turn the ski around and go full power to the wake. Now i try to keep more rythm going out and into the wakes and instead of full power, i focus on a progressive edge!

[klindy]

@Sanderwouters Thanks. Sounds like exactly what @mlusa said.

[lhoover]

Bruce, she is 44, trying to run the course for the first time. I have a boom. She does not own any trick skis now and was asking me to buy 1 or 2. Leaning toward 2, don't you think? I can give her a few basics, not much.

[Chef23]

@lhoover unless she has been free skiing her whole life and is just getting into the course based on what you said above I would recommend two.

[lhoover]

Thanks to all for your input. I'm going to recommend 2.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

In this case, yes I think 2 skis is the best starting point. Use the boom for initial start and side slides. Move to a 5' handle for backs and Os, then behind the boat. Tricks can be really fun if approached right. Check back in a a few months and let us know the progress.