Roger

One thing (among many) I really like about Chet is that he teaches what works for "YOU." I had my first (of 4 so far) lessons with Chet last year and I certainly thought he was going to recommend the 1 handed gate since I'm left foot forward. I started by not saying anything at all and neither did he. I just skied my usual opening 28 and let him absorb without pre-thought. He chose to work on my transition across the wakes on my on-side lean. After the set, I asked him about the gate and said I thought he might start with that. He replied that I had one of the better two handed gates he had seen and didn't think I should mess with it at all. I was pleasantly surprised by this. I had altered my gate considerably about a year earlier at the suggestion of Harold Hintringer who I ski with from time to time. He had me pull quite a bit further up on the boat and then stand directly over the front binding and initiate the turn-in from there. He used Chris Parrish as the example to strive for. Harald also uses the one handed gate but thinks I'm doing fine with this change. For the two handed gate skiers here, one thing I notice all the time at our tournaments is the difference between the top skiers and the "club" skiers in terms of the pull out and glide. The top guys/gals pull very far up on the boat. When sitting as rope handler (safety) in the boat, they are well up past the rear bimini strap. Most of the club skiers are well behind it. This is what I have changed in my own skiing and it has really helped me. It allows for a free turn in and maximum angle (which is what I think the properly executed 1 hand gates gets you). Most skiers I try to talk into pulling well up on the boat are afraid they will get extra speed into the one ball. What they actually get is more angle and a better cast-out or out bound direction and an easier seemingly slower one ball. Everyone who who tries it is amazed at the difference. I was in the boat as safety when Andy Mapple tied the then current world record of 1 @ 43 in 2000 at Okeeheelee. At 39, 41, and 43 off, he was as close to 90 degrees from the pylon as you could get. At 43, he actually went in front of the pylon a bit before turning in about equal to it. He was inches from rounding 2 ball...

LKB, As skibug said, yes... the slalom program was sometimes running the final cut jump program when the skier was coming off one ball. P101 is supposed to eliminate that. I'm sure glad all this was fully tested and we all got to play with ZO in our own boats before it was allowed in tournaments /vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-frown.gif

MS, We have a driver here at Okeeheelee who really stays on top of this stuff. They arrived at the lake with P101 this weekend. When I asked what the difference was, here is what I was told: "the new version is to solve the surge problem happening with O and P where the jump program was kicking in off 1 ball and giving very fast splits." This was happening occasionally with O and P, not every pass. I know one of the boats with ZO used in last weekends Miami tournament exhibited this problem. I'd get P101 if I had ZO. Alas, I have a 2002 Nautique and have no wish to get a new boat at this time...

The primary reason for the one handed gate is to carry the skis speed through the turn in, if you're gliding, you’re not doing that. Perhaps you feel you can turn better and maybe you can with one hand on in the glide, didn't seem to make any difference for me. For Karina, you may notice that just before turn-in, she swings her free arm out and helps rotate in with it (not that much I admit). That may be what you're doing that makes it feel better than 2 hands for you. The primary downside of the one handed gate (IMO) is one more opportunity to miss the handle. One other thing is the timing. If I screw up a bit on my initiation point for my pullout, I have plenty of time to either increase the pullout time or decrease (depending on if I started early or late). With the true one handed gate, there seems to be little room for error. At our tournaments at Okeeheelee we get a wide variety of skiers and gates. I have seen enough different 39off skiers with enough different gates that my advice would be to use the one that works the best for you.

DW, I think your first two paragraphs are in response to Scoke rather than me...

DW, No argument from me. My last comment was "I" as in personal choice. I am all for safety devices that prevent injury, but I will need to see it in use and decide for myself about it's merits vs. possible new issues it might bring. My last major motion sport was skydiving and I saw more than one new safety device take lives before being perfected. They were all introduced in response to fatalities and were to correct the issue leading to the death, but sometimes they brought about an unforseen issue no one thought of until it caused another fatality. I applaud those that are trying to create a solution to this problem, but reserve the right to inspect it and see it in use for a while before I promote or use it...

I think Eric said it very well (especially the last paragraph). Personally, I never let go of the handle until the boat takes it from me. When I know I'm going down, I hold it away. I believe this reduces the danger of through the handle injuries. However, it does little for in the rope injuries. Last year when Jeff Smith (from Michigan) got the rope around his arm, the first thing I asked him when I saw him was if he let the handle go in the fall. He said he always holds onto the handle for the same reason I do, but he fell into the slack rope and it got looped around his arm. He was fortunate that it was his arm and not his neck; also it was standard rope and not spectra (I will not use spectra on a slalom handle without a full vinyl covering). This is a motion sport. In any motion sport there is risk. I believe the risks to be acceptable if you consider the millions of slalom sets every year and the relatively low number of serious injuries.

John's miss (he posted above) falls into that category, however most of the misses would have been misses with the old rules as well. You can't slow the entry speed down .5 mph after more then 2 decades of skiing the faster entry and not expect some effect...

Yeah, and you might notice that Chris Rossi's position in photo 2 of his pull out looks almost exactly like Scoke's, his outside shoulder is dropped away from the boat. To me Scoke's position looks ok, his shoulders are square to the pull and the handle is loaded evenly from both arms. Not saying Bruce doesn't have a point, the level shoulders does work for some people. Drew Ross and Jamie Beauchesne to name a couple of notables. But others like Chris Rossi and Chris Parrish have just as much success with Scoke's style of pull out. How do you decide which is right or even best??? Seems to me it comes down to what works best for YOU.

Kyle, 1st, re-mount your animals, put them on, and have someone mark your ski (tape will do) where the center of your ankle bone is (the part that sticks out). 2nd, mount the Radar boots so that when you're in them, your ankle measurements match the animal measurements. This may require moving the back binding closer or farther from the front than you have it now (I had to move my rear Radar binding back one hole). 3rd, if you had your rear animal rotated at all, do the same with the Radar rear. 4th, check the front Radar binding to make sure it is exactly straight on the plate. There is a little mark if you look directly at the front of the binding to line it up. Give any transition to hard shells from rubber boots at least three full weeks or 24 sets. It takes time to adjust to the fact that your movements are transmitted to the ski in a more positive mannor than the rubber bindings did. My experience: I was afraid to do too much, so I just rotated the rear about 1/8 inch and left the front straight (I thought). I had difficulty running any of my normal passes, though I could get through them. At the suggestion of a friend on hard shells, I measured where my ankles were with my rubber bindings and had to move the plate back one hole and the rear binding back one hole from the front binding to match up. I skied better immediately, but still not up to my norm. Then, at the Okeeheelee tournament two weekends ago, I talked with Chris Rossi about what I was feeling. I had my front binding medium tight and my rear just barely snug. If I wore the rear tight, I could not run a pass. He said he prefers both bindings medium tight and asked me if I rotated my rubber bindings. He suggested rotating the rear as much as the rubber binding and wearing both bindings at the same medium tightness. While rotating the rear, I checked the front and found it was actually toed in slightly rather than straight. At the suggesting of the same friend as before, I rotated the front binding 1/8 inch toward the toe. Wow! I am skiing easily as good or better than I was on my rubber bindings. Bottom line: Start with the steps to get the initial setup as close to what you had on rubber as possible. Then ski a lot and don't be afraid to try some different settings (minimum of 3 sets on each setting change with someone who knows what they're doing watching you). I'll never go back...

Starting in 2009, ALL tournaments will be pulled with ZO. I would not think twice if I were in your shoes... I'd install ZO. Can't think of why you need a speedo once ZO is installed. It displays the speed digitally and even if it didn't, you can bet your pretty close to 34.2 (or whatever speed you ski at).

Yes, the gate judging has been made uniform for all classes. Look at page 83 of the new rules book:  2008 AWSA Rules Roger

Yes, we had a Nautique for the 1st and 3rd round with ZO only and a Mastercraft for round 2 with a choice of ZO or SG. I think for many it was their first time with ZO. I know as boat judge in the Mastercraft for one of the groups, only two skiers chose ZO. From the shore or in the main tower it was quite apparent when someone chose ZO in the Mastercraft since the boat was quite loud and the difference in how the throttle is used between ZO and SG is no small thing... I think as skiers get more pulls with ZO, they will adapt, but right now it's a bit of a different feel than PP or SG. Roger

Nothing, they are Team colors on the liners and only two pair were made. They also have designer plates (color pattern on the plates), but they are the same boots and liners you buy from them. I talked with Chris Rossi at our tournament this weekend about this.

I rotated the rear fully (same as I had my rear wiley), rotated the front the other way 1/8th" and put both on with the same level of tightness (about 1" past snug). I skied great last night. Have to thank Chris for taking the time to answer questions on the system!

We had 14 gates pulled at our 3rd Record at Okeeheelee this weekend, more than any tournament I've ever officiated at. All 14 were ZO. My theory: PP and SG come into the gates about .5mph hot. ZO comes in at actual speed. I know when I pulled out for the gates in the first round, I was surprised how slow the glide seemed. I almost thought they put in 52k instead of 55k. I think this slight difference in speed (slower) is causing peoples timing to be ever so slightly off. The skiers missing the gates was across the board from g1 to MM and even OM. Thoughts?

Something doesn't sound right about this. I don't think there is a lot of water hitting the front of the binding if everything is set up correctly. Look at the video of Remi skiing on the binding (camera on the front of his ski). The front of the binding barely gets any water through the whole pass... (scroll down to the shot of Remi skiing with the arrow pointing to the camera and click on the "See the video" link.  Remi`s what`s new page

Chris Rossi skied in our Record this weekend at Okeeheelee Park. He was on the RS-1's of course and ran 3@41 the first two rounds and a few @39 the third round. I spoke with him about how he wears his. He snugs them down medium tight, both front and rear where I have been medium tight on the front and just enough to take the slake our on the rear. His reasoning had to do with ejection and wanting either both out or both in. I will be experimenting with both at medium tight and probably a bit more rotation in the rear than I have now.

Randy, Everyone knows who I am, so just ask. I have a 2002 White hull, red stripe, red top Nautique. If you mean where are the docks... Enter the Park and go to the Southwest corner where the East West lake and the North South lake meet and just walk over the hill. I get there around 5:00pm on Tuesday and Thursday nights though there is pretty much someone there the whole day.

Brent, It's both. We have a lot more people spending time here than I've ever seen before. However, tonight was not very crowded for some reason. We only had one usable lake though as they were surveying the North South lake for this weekend's record tournament and it was quite breezy from the East. The weekend was a mix, with some spans of time with maybe 6 boats and others with 16 (13 can park). The north lakes were also busy with the 5th lake slalom course in pretty constant use. We always have more skiers when we're hosting Nationals, but this year just seems a bit more than 2004/5 was. Still, with all the locals skiing here, Randy and his friends might be able to squeeze in a set. It really depends on how busy it is that particular day and what time they show. As I said, I'd be willing to offer a set.

How many are in your "group?" I will be there from 5:00pm to dark on the 8th (baring unforseen injury or work or...) and can pull one of you. The issue right now is that it's a Nationals year for us and it's crowded every night (and day from what I hear), so getting my two sets in is getting more difficult. I would be happy to ask some of my friends if they could also fit one of your guys/gals in for a set. I do not know who skies on Friday, my weekday skiing is Tue and Thu nights. I'm sure if you can come out earlier, there would be a number of skiers there that might offer you a pull. It's amazing how many people have come out of the woodwork to ski here since we announced Nationals would be here...

JTH, "The HO shape is the same shape and is really the same." This sounds a little like "almost the same but not quite." I ordered the 88 and will try that first anyway. So, the question is, are the HO and Goode 106 blades actually identical or are they "nearly" identical? I have no problem waiting for the Goode blade if the latter.

countymountie: I would think they would work for any speed/line length. It's all relative anyway, my issues at 35 are one of my friends issues at 39 and another friends issues at 15. We all strive to move our issues up to the next speed/line length. So, keep at it and it won't be long before your issues are at 28, 32, 35 or beyond /vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-cool.gif

RS-1 update: After the changes I made last weekend described above, I skied two more sets Thursday night running 2 and 3.5 @ 35 respectively. This was another change as I sanded out the slot in my Fischer so I could mount a standard goode 5 hole fin and fin block. I wasn't having any particular problems with the Fish fin block/fin setup, but through converstation with one of my friends who had the Fish before, he thinks the Fish fin flexes too much in the turn and then snaps back at the finish tending to send the tip towards the boat. Besides that, I want to try the Carbon Fins and the slot wouldn't take them either. Anyway, the ski felt better right away and I'm happy with the change. I ordered an 88 Carbon Fin and will also get a 106 at some point. I skied two more sets today and I'm beginning to settle down with the binding setup now. First set, 2 28's, 2 32's and 2@35 twice. Second set, 28, 32, 2@35, 3.5@35, and 4.5@35. I expect to run it any set now and to begin running it consistantly within a few weeks if not sooner. I have a lesson with Chet next Saturday and his eyes see all, so that should help. Two more sets showed up at the lake. A French Canadian skier and another guy down from Michigan with Jeff Smith today. I expect these will be everywhere as time goes on because everyone who sees them seems impressed by the setup and simplicity. For me, I can now say that rubber bindings are finally history after two previous tries at hardshells.

That's what happens when I type too fast, sorry /vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-embarassed.gif Thanks for responding for that other guy though!