Perfect Pass StarGazer with Z-Box Owners Discussion

[larrynipon]

I'm running a 2006 DBW Malibu Response LX. I had Perfect Pass Digital Pro from the beginning. Last summer the control head needed to be replaced. My son is a coach and competitor, and was skiing exclusively Zero Off. I upgraded to Stargazer with the ZBox option. I calibrated the speed-rpm, mapped the course, plugged in a crew weight of 160, and haven't touched it since. It is timing PERFECT every time. Engages quickly without much throttle finesse. I am pulling skiers weighing from 120 to 210 without any setting changes.

My son said he actually likes our Response better than the Nautique 200's since the wake seems a bit "softer". He felt no difference in the pull at C2 behind either boats.

[Razorskier1]

I have found SG with zbox to be great on my 2005 197TT with DBW. However, it is more difficult at slower speeds. We slalom 34mph and 36mph, and at those speeds it comes up, locks in and is terrific. At 28mph and lower, you have to be really careful about how you bring it up or you will have surge issues.

 

My son and daughter also started trick skiing. I have found SG unusable in trick mode. It surges 4-5mph over, under, over under until it finally settles in after you have used up most of the lake. That is disappointing, as trick driving by hand is a full time occupation.

[Dirt]

Ours is servo and works great for trick. I have not tried it slower than 16mph

[larrynipon]

'06 Malibu LX DBW w/ Zbox. It was running PERFECTLY until yesterday. Now, inexplicably, at only 36mph the boat surges as soon as SG engages. I've done a system reset, remapped, recalibrated...nothing is correcting the problem. Anyone else running into this problem?

[Phil2360]

Have to agree that driving setup is still important at our lake, particularly as it's relatively short in setup.

After the turn you need to be careful how you come up to speed on the way to the gate.

 

So now that it has GPS mapped courses, maybe it would make sense to also map the pre-gates, so the system has a bit of an idea how long it's got before it gets there & can be a bit predictive.

 

Now that I've typed that last paragraph, I realise it's ridiculous, as GPS info could provide that feedback anyway.

 

 

[Churchy]

Razorskier1. We have that problem aswell when tricking but have found that if you punch it a bit harder on the pull out and accelerate well above the set speed it will settle down alot quicker. Hope this helps

[musclefixer]

Just upgraded to Z box. I had been running the 8.0.2 software for a while, but it was not as good on my '00 MC prostar 190 with 5.7 power slot /4 blade prop as the previous timed magnet versions. 7.0.6. Times with the new software were slightly fast at 1 ball and slow at 3 ball but still managed 16.97 out the gates regardless of skier and skier weight. Now running Z box, I had to upgrade to a new module ( I had one of the original stargazer modules that wouldn't handle the z box voltage). Times straight out of the box with my old RPMs were 1.76, 7.12, 9.82, 16.96/95's I also noticed that the z box pre factory setting is now down to 8 vs 11, and version 8.0.4 R includes a + to add to the A B C settings . So overall very happy thus far with Z box first trials . Also noticed entry speeds are 34.3-34.7 vs 35 mph at the gates. Keep the forum going , looking to simulate that zero off pull as close as possible

[GAJ0004]

I have the 2008 version of PPSG on my boat, a '94 Ski Nautique. I have the 240 HP engine with the 1:1 tranny. It has always worked perfect for me except when I pull a bigger skier(150 lbs) at 30-32 MPH. It would be fine from the start gate to ball 3 gates, then it would accelerate until the end of the course. I calibrated it in multimagnet mode, but run it in single magnet mode and still utilize the paddlewheel sensor. I was able to correct the problem by adding 50 lbs to the actual crew weight setting, and set the Kx to + or ++. Once I figured that out it works perfect..

No plans to get the Zbox. I have no problems skiing on the B2 setting in ZeroOff.

[Ed_Obermeier]

Same here, no intensions of getting a ZBox. Love my PPSG pull, don't ski many tournaments, I ski just fine on B2 behind ZO boats. It works so no intensions of trying to fix it.

[usaski1]

I have been using z-box pretty much from when it came out. Last week jumped behind a 196 that had PP. not even SG... and whoa was it different.. and not in a good way. ZO is the best, but z-box ain't bad.

[DH]

Don't mean to hijack this thread but seems like a good concentration of knowledge/experience here... I have a 99 RLX with the carb Vortec 310 engine running PP classic. Is it worth it to upgrade to SG or SG with ZBox? Will I get anything close to a ZO pull with my carbed, cable throttle engine? Boat runs fine now, course times are generally right on, will I gain anything with the upgrade?

 

Thanks in advance

[musclefixer]

I believe the SG upgrade was well worth it. More accurate segment times, GPS speed., and now no magnet timing. As for Z box just depends how often you want to run a tourney or get a chance to ski behind a ZO boat. The zbox has been a positive upgrade for me, but some would agree that its probably not worth the cost as it didn't effect their skiing. Classic is great, but gone are the days where you have to enter in skier wt, wind adj, etc.

[MISkier]

If you are skiing tournaments and/or a lot of other boats with ZO, I would get the zBox. If you are just skiing your own boat and don't participate in tournaments (or ever plan to), don't change. As mentioned, the new SG/zBox with course mapping, etc. is nice from a convenience and accuracy perspective. I occasionally ski behind a 2001 RLX with zBox and it feels very close to my 2009 RLX with ZO. I wish all the other boats in our ski club had zBox.

[jackski]

It's nice to have just for the convenience. My wife likes it more because there's less settings to keep track of so she can just drive.

[GAJ0004]

I have found after skiing on ZeroOff and Stargazer then skiing on PP Classic I felt like PP Classic was really tugging hard, but then again I was on a lake with really fast water. The owner of the lake tells me everyone loses six on their buoy count when they come to his place. I when trick skied on his lake I had to slow the boat down 1 MPH below what I normally go. My driver said he had to set the RPMs up each pass because I kept pulling harder and harder.

I just don't get enough time behind ZeroOff to try out settings other than B2. When people see me ski they say I have a very neutral textbook and symmetrical skiing style despite being left foot forward. I have considered just getting the new software for Stargazer without the ZBOX so I don't have to use course magnets. PPSG works well on my boat as is and there are some days where it is like skiing on a river since it is a big lake. On less than perfect days the combination of the paddlewheel, GPS and magnetic timing have served me well on my boat.

 

[escmanaze]

Well I'm now going on my second summer with my boat, I bought it in the fall of 2012. It is a 97 SNOB with the Pro-ski engine and (I think) and ACME 422. I am having almost the exact same problem as @DanE, except that my problem mostly only shows up on the short setups, and sometimes it doesn't show up at all. The boat is often going significantly faster between 2 and 4 than it is for all the rest of the course. Sometimes, as I'm skiing on 30 or 32 mph settings, it will reach a max speed right around 3 ball of 2 mph higher than the set speed. It always runs within tolerance from gate to gate, it just has that really fast moment in the middle with slow on each end. If anybody has any suggestions in addition to what has been said here, I would love to here it.

[GOODESkier]

@escmanaze‌ wouldn't hurt to invert the RPM's and try again? I had a 6.0 liter boat that had the RPM standard and needed it inverted. It surged hard and fell off and tried to catch up when it was wrong........

[DanE]

@escmanaze I copied a write up I did in another thread:

 

There might be a less complicated approach to this, have done it successevly with PP Zbox wich basically have the same problem as Stargazer ( Zbox is Stargazer with an accelerometer add on).

The terminology for balancing segment times are Ball1. Ball3 and so on. Ball1 affects the time to buoy #2 Ball3 affects time to buoy #4.

Can be a bit confusing, probably has to do with all buoy timing chart where segment time to first buoy start with 0.

After I discovered this I got our Boat to run Perfect times at every buoy, feels just like a true Zero off Boat now.

Remember, you must look at Times for every buoy, not just buoy 1, 3 and exit.(I actually look at the small digits next to the Times i.e -01, 00 , +01 that tells deviation from actuals)

When the difference start to get significant from buoy to buoy or Even worse between 2 buoys the pull feels like crap.

I run baselines dead on actuals, enter true crew weight and finally got this system to work as intended.

 

To make a long story short: If you have run thrugh the setups and troubleshooting according to manual set your background settings as follows: BALL1 40, BALL3 30, B4 to exit 40.

Start from there and tweak if neccesary and see above text for advice to monitor success/fail.