I want reflex!

[KcSwerver]

I have been skiing on double powershells for a year now, I made the change due to an injury with a one foot In, one foot out situation. And I don't want to leave hard shells anytime soon

 

Although the powershells are good, it seems that everyone is now on reflex and man do I want to at least try them! I would love to change to reflex but wow they are just so expensive. 300+ bucks for a binding/plate/release system is crazy to me (I bought the powershells used for 175 complete) what are your thoughts? Is it something to think about? I also want to get a camaro wetsuit for fall so the skiing fund is low, but what are your opinions on it. Should I at least think about shelling the money out for it? (I am sixteen and I mow lawns.. So I'm for sure not loaded)

 

Thanks

-KcSwerver

[terryg]

The double power shells are great. Not worth the money to switch to Reflex unless there is some problem with powershells. I've had both, and there is no difference in performance, unless you are a RTP then the Reflex is better. Sit tight until you need to replace. Save the cash for the camaro!

[ForrestGump]

I was on Powershells for 2 years and switched to reflex over winter. The reflex is a repeatable release. I know it's going to release the same every time. I could never get that confidence in the Powershells due to the 3M dual lock.

[ral]

I need to ask for an appointment with my shrink, as I am agreeing way too much with @ShaneH....

 

To talk about Powershells and isolating them from a velcro-like product that was designed to hold washing machine panels used as release system is just not possible in my books.

[JohnCox]

I was on double power shells for over 2 seasons, and loved them. Tried Reflex front with R-style rear a month ago, and made the switch. I feel more connected with the reflex... I never had issues with the power shells releasing, but maybe that was because I just had so much dual lock. I always felt like a full plate that covered both bindings fully connected to the ski with dual lock had to have some impact on the flex of the ski. 2 separate plates attached with screws just makes more sense to me. Also, it is incredible how much lighter my rig is with the change.

[KcSwerver]

I am currently on a goode 9900 (can't screw into it) would you guys suggest using dual loc all on the bottom?

 

Is the reflex really a superior system?

[Waternut]

This might be a cheaper way for you to get into it.

http://www.ski-it-again.com/php/skiitagain.php?topic=Search&category=Bindings&postid=22953

 

@jdarwin hooked me up with the new Quantum boot system which are the exact same thing but made in the US so they're a bit cheaper than Reflex.

 

I thought long and hard about Reflex vs Powershell. Never used powershell so I can't compare. Ultimately, I didn't like the idea of paying money every few falls for new tape. I knew it would make me ski conservatively and I'd be a tight wad about letting new skiers use my stuff for fear of them messing up my tape. If I lose my ski with the Reflex/Quantum, I can have it back on my foot before the boat gets to me.

[bhs]

I've never used Powershells but I have been on Reflex with Rstyle for about 4 years. My set up is on their single carbon plate. When I switched to a Goode mid last year I taped the plate with 4 strips of 400, i was told it wouldnt release, stuck it to the ski. Rounded 1 ball and it the wake felt the front of the plate release and then slap back down. Scared the crap out of me! My next move was to cover the entire plate with 400 and 250 on the ski. I know there are those who get it to work for release but personally I would want to use it. I like the Reflex release and I can't see any need to change.

[eleeski]

@KCSwerver Reflex may be the best system for a single boot hardshell. But your injury was a one foot in one out? Reflex will allow this situation if you are using double boots. Double Powershells should not.

 

Reflex is dominant on trick skis. For good reason. I recommend it to anyone setting up a trick ski. But I personally got frustrated by the inconsistent and pre release characteristics and developed my Gatorade lid system replacement. Reflex boots will change flex with heat. While the skiing performance may not be affected, the release is - as the boot flex is part of the release pressure. Perhaps the problem is exacerbated in my case since my water is markedly warmer than most other ski sites around. Regardless, the release system is not magic. Kind of like velcro? Even my Gatorade lids change with temperature.

 

@JohnCox Powershells are bolted then firmly velcroed to the ski. Something was wrong with your setup if you are more attached with Reflex. I always felt more movement with the Reflex than with with my Gatorade setup - bolts are more secure. Of course, if you don't trust the velcro then the mental aspect is real. Or your new setup may suit you better than double hardshells.

 

@ral Bolts and the accompanying stress concentrations on a ski weren't designed specifically for skis either. Velcro is engineered. Stay within the design parameters of the velcro and it will work as designed. Be aware of age, cycle and temperature constraints and it is clear why so many skiers successfully use Powershells. But the high maintenence requirements are why it hasn't taken over the market.

 

For a while Kirk ran rubber boots on a velcroed down plate and a couple screws at the ends. Worked great for him. If you're running hardshells perhaps use Gatorade lids in place of the screws? At your own risk of course...

 

I'm running a Radar boot on my slalom now. They seem to be a bit easier on my aging ankles than my hardshells were. And I prefer a softer boot. My rear toe is a hardshell with no cuff. Buoy count sucks but there are lots of other factors depressing my scores. I have had good scores in the past on a similar setup.

 

Reflex does allow you to put your boot on, walk around the dock and clip in to your ski and go. How cool!

 

Eric

[ral]

@eleeski, "Velcro is engineered", as you say, for holding panels not for releasing. In large doses, good for holding stuff semi-permanently.

 

"Be aware of age, cycle and temperature constraints and it is clear why so many skiers successfully use Powershells. But the high maintenence requirements are why it hasn't taken over the market." Agree

 

 

[bhs]

@eleeski Horton might ban me for spurring you on but, someday I would like to see your Gatorade system. Photos?

[KM]

I am on Fogman shells mounted to a G-10 plate and fixed to the ski with 400/250 Dual Lock. Thinking about trying Reflex. I pivot my Fogman shells. Can the Reflex be pivoted? Anyone know if Reflex or Fogman shells can be retrofitted to a Fluid Motion E-Series? Thinking if a hybrid Reflex front and E-Series rear might be possible.

[Jordan]

The reflex can be pivoted...watch the Andy Mapple video...it shows how to pivot the boot.

 

[Steven_Haines]

@KM, Paul at FM sells his version of the Reflex system. I really like his shells and liners, I think they're a superior product!

[JohnCox]

@eleeski - After all the work I did on my Powershells, I completely understand how they are constructed. There was nothing wrong with my Powershell setup, and while I used it, felt incredibly connected. After riding the Reflex and R-style, though, I realized that my Powershells had a little "play" and would rock a little side to side. Not much, but noticeable to me compared to the Reflex. It may be that I'm able to actually wear my rear tighter using the R-style than I did with my Powershells. Whatever the reason, I like this system better.

[ForrestGump]

I, too, feel more lateral stiffness on my reflex than with my prior Powershell 5s.

[KcSwerver]

Can you mix a silvretta 404 release with the current boots which come with the silvretta 500 release? I have found a good option for buying plate and release. And I can buy a new reflex boot for like 150$

[MattP]

@KCSwerver easy answer no. Complicated answer yes... if you move the block on the heal.

[ral]

@KcSwerver, if it is a used 404 Silvretta, I would recommend not going for it. It has a welded point that might fail over time.

[KM]

Does the rear R-Series boot pivot as well? Coming off Fogman shells, I am not sure I will like no cuff on the rear boot. I like the idea of a Reflex front and a FM E-Series rear if the Reflex rear can be retrofitted somehow.

[ral]

@KM, the R-series can pivot a lot, as it is attached with t-nuts and can be attached to several different holes in the plate (see pic). Note that when the plate is used for the R-system, the silvretta and horseshoe are not present

[Deanoski]

Yes you can use a new boot with a 404. Just have to flip the boot cleat over. Done it a few times. Lots of top end skiers still using the 404 release. I have only seen one break in the 5 in our group of skiers using them And it was a 404 that was used for snow skiing for 5 yrs then water skied for 3yrs.

[ral]

@Deanoski, I saw at least 3 break here (one of them was nasty...) and I made a special deal for everyone to switch to the new 500 unit.

 

One major factor was the usage with the SS squares to attach to the plate (before the new blocks became available) instead of the original stainless steel "U" base. That setup allowed some heel movement that forced the unit unevenly, stressing the inside welded point during the onside turn. This was even amplified when using double boots with a single plate mounted with velcro.