Baller Winston Posted July 27, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 27, 2014 OK, so I always skied on a kidder ski, then i went with 9800 Goode. I had great progress with the regular Goode slalom ski. I thought I would try the new nano with the velcro style power shell bindings. I have had major problems with it. i KNOW this ski is amazing, but I can not keep the binding velcro from coming appart. I have been on the phone with Goode and they have helped me tweek the ski. I have completely replaced all of the velcro like they wanted me to. after it comes appart 8 times they want you to replace it with about $100.00 worth of tape. I have done this and cleaned it and reprimed it and replaced it. It will come appart 8 times in one day. I spoke with Goode on the phone again and they sent me some new black velcro. I got about 6 good passes out of it and then it blew appart again. When it comes appart, I have hit pretty hard. Wondering what others experiances have been with this? the ski was over $2,000 and for three years I have struggled with this. I am ready to throw it away. Any hope for this ski? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck_Dickey Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 @winston Are you saying the glue isn't holding the Dual Lock to the ski surface or is it the Dual Lock is disconnecting? If it's disconnecting, where in the course is it coming apart ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller BraceMaker Posted July 28, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 28, 2014 My guess would be you aren't getting the two sides locked together when you install the binding plate. It definitely requires taking the boots off setting the ski on a firm dock and knocking them together not just standing on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporting Member Than_Bogan Posted July 28, 2014 Supporting Member Share Posted July 28, 2014 Something is very wrong and it has nothing to do with the ski. Please provide a lot more details about what dual lock products you are using and how you are installing the duallock and the bindings. If I were you I'd provide a ridiculous overkill of information and pictures because something is going horribly wrong and somebody here will spot what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporting Member Than_Bogan Posted July 28, 2014 Supporting Member Share Posted July 28, 2014 In advance of that, my first guess would be the same as @bracemaker. You must use a hammer and dowl to mate dual lock. Pressing is not enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Chef23 Posted July 28, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 28, 2014 Hammer and dowel to get the dual lock together and flip the ski on the side and look at the dual lock you can see if it is really pressed together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted July 28, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted July 28, 2014 OK, where do i begin....I have been sking for 40 years. I can make all six balls at 32 off. I ski with a bunch of friends who feel inferior when I show up. I did WAY better on my Goode 9800. The ski came from Goode with tape on it. I was told to add a little more if it releases too easy. I slowly added enough tape to cover the entire plate. I have replaced it with fresh tape ( sent to me by Goode), and i covered the entire plate from brand new. came off the first run. The dual lock does not stay locked the tape stays on. YES I certainly do make sure it is completely locked. Every time it comes appart, I drive back to the house, set everything up on a hard work bench and use a mallot to bang it together. I have a tool that i set inside the boots to hammer them together. I hear it click and it is all together when i look at the sides. I MAKE darn sure it is locked together. Goode sent me some of the black tape. They said it would never come appart. 400 times better lock. they sent me two 4 inch pieces! I thought I was getting enough to do the whole plate. They said to put the two strips in the front corners. i did this. It came appart on me yesterday. I was coming out of turn ball # 1 .I try to ski early morning on glass water. Water that is anything but glass, will tear that plate right off. I mean even a tiny bit of chop to the water. very frusterating. I want to make this ski work. I love the feel of it and i know it has potential. I am not just a cry baby about this. I ski a lot and was in competition 30 years ago. I try to buy the best stuff so I can kick butt out there. I have dedicated 3 seasons to this ski. I need help. i want to make it work. I have lots of video of myself skiing, so i can review and check my form, etc. I have a 2012 malibu txi with zero off. I ski at 34 mph. I am 49 years old and about 178 lbs. I have special orthodics that I use in my bindings to make sure my feet are at ease inside the boots and well supported. I am ready to fly to ski with the Goode folks so they can figure this out. Help me people. I have tried everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporting Member Than_Bogan Posted July 28, 2014 Supporting Member Share Posted July 28, 2014 That is completely effin' bizarre. The setup you are describing should never release at all (and therefore be wicked dangerous! ). Video and pictures might let somebody figure it out, but maybe a better question is where are you? If somebody familiar with dual lock can work with you in person I bet we'd get to the bottom of this. There is no way what you're describing should be happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller jayski Posted July 28, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 28, 2014 @Winston Do you have the T nuts covered with dual lock on the plate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Chef23 Posted July 28, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 28, 2014 @Winston I don't know what to tell you then sounds very bizarre particularly given that you had experience with Dual Lock on the 9800. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted July 28, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted July 28, 2014 I appreciate everyone's input on this. I just ordered two rolls of the black 3m 250 tape. Going to replace it all.......again. still looking for sugestions and any help possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller GOODESkier Posted July 28, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 28, 2014 Check T-Nuts to make sure they are not bent/curved creating leverage for the plate to pop. If you think the dual lock on the ski is hanging up on the T-Nuts, cut those little sections out so the T-Nuts can't make contact with the dual lock on the ski. A little section added under the front boot is OK for a heavier skier or if you "move" around a bit much. Also just make sure all dual lock is laying nice beside each other with no edge knocked up. AGAIN, WHERE ARE YOU FROM. Someone with good dual lock experience can help....... Also, you can do 3-4 skis (I think with a 2 roll box we buy for $100.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted July 29, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted July 29, 2014 So you all understand my frustrations! You mention T clips....Do you mean the metal squares on the plate? I dont have dual lock on those small squares. But the entire plate is covered other than that. You read my story. I know I need a mallot to hammer it down. I make sure it is together. I have certainly made some good passes with the ski, but it comes appart often. Of course when I shorten the ski rope, it tends to break free easier. If this ski did not release at all, I could see it being dangerous, but with it coming appart often, with a pretty short rope it gets pretty dangerous as well. Like i said...I ordered the black tape and I will replace the dual lock and give it another go! Ill keep you posted, but any other ideas would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck_Dickey Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Make sure there is not tape on square nuts and there is non on the ski where the nuts position on the ski. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted July 30, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 Here is a youtube link my son made. You can see the guy on the nano. he skis first. It was my first time out on the nano when I got it. See if you notice anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck_Dickey Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 @Winston Looks to me in the video that you are way on the back and lifting your front foot in a motion that may pry the two halves apart. I had a buddy that use to rear up to stop at the end of the lake, like an extreme wheelie and it was causing his dual lock to release from the front towards the back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporting Member Than_Bogan Posted July 30, 2014 Supporting Member Share Posted July 30, 2014 This might be the dumbest question I've ever asked, but: You wanted it to release in that crash, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Chef23 Posted July 30, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 I am with @Than_Bogan unless you are implying that the ski pre-released which caused you to fall I feel like you should have released there. It certainly looked like you were going out the front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted July 30, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 That crash was due to the dual lock peeling apart in the back and sent me flipping forward in a faceplant as the ski takes a nosedive. You can clearly see that it began peeling off from the back first as my body does a complete forward roll. Before I got this power shell system, I am lucky if I fall down a few times per season. i rarely fall. Now I fall all the time as the dual lock comes apart. yes, I agree I am way back on the ski. I just threw this video on here as it has been on youtube for a few years now and it was easy to access. I have plenty of skiing footage since then and after making some major adjustments to the ski. I just cant find the chip that it is on. Remember I did say that was like one of my first runs on the new ski with power shell. @ Bogan, yes we all want it to release in a crash, but this was in the reverse. It began to release so I did crash. This is an everyday norm for me now with the power shell and dual lock. Thanks for the comments...keep them coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Chef23 Posted July 30, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 Have you only been having this problem since you got the Power Shells? If so I would say go to a different binding system. What bindings were you running when you were on the 9800? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted July 30, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 OK I found this one from right before I got the nano. I am skiing on my Goode 9200 with boot bindings. Notice anything about my form in this one that could be pulling the power shell off of my new ski? This looks like a long rope and just a freestyle relaxed ski, but..... Just looking for opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted July 30, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller robscholl-OF Posted July 30, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 I have inserts in my Nano 1. Run a Reflex front Wiley rear. All the good from the Goode with no dual lock issues.....OF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck_Dickey Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 @robscholl-OF Reflex front and R-style rear for me. Lovin this setup! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members musclefixer Posted July 30, 2014 Members Share Posted July 30, 2014 have you tried running the inter loc not only down the sides of the plate/ski , but cross ways under the boots. I was always told multi directional is best? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller PatM Posted July 30, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 I am the same weight as you and ran 9 years on dual lock. No prerelease issues. I am wondering what is the configuration of the dual lock is. If you can post pictures of the bottom of the plate and the top of the ski that might give us a clue. I agree with @musclefixer - you need it to go multi directional. I also agree with @OB about being to far back on your ski - that's a lot of pressure on the front connection of dual lock and I'm surprised it's not releasing cross course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller gginco Posted July 30, 2014 Baller Share Posted July 30, 2014 Go back to the gear that worked is my first suggestion but if not....do not pound the interloc together with a mallot! You will smash the heads of the dual loc and ruin them causing them not to hold. Pressure press the plate down all over the place until you hear the snap. Be sure to have the correct binding placement for the ski too! If you end up replacing the interloc then stick it to the binding plate first then press the ski side interloc to the interloc on the plate before sticking anything to the ski. Getting a perfectly aligned pair of interloc is key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporting Member Than_Bogan Posted July 30, 2014 Supporting Member Share Posted July 30, 2014 @gginco You could be right for 250-250, which is the typical release mechanism, but all I know from personal experience is that when doing 250-400 (for a semi-permanent mount), I must hit it with a dowl (which is struck by a hammer of course) or it simply will not interlock. Directly pounding with the hammer doesn't work either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members acmx Posted July 31, 2014 Members Share Posted July 31, 2014 Make sure your not putting 400 to 400 Dual Lock, as it is not recommended and comes apart easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted August 4, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted August 4, 2014 OK, after 8 hours of glue removal and two bottles of remover, I put dual lock back on according to everyones advice. I used new clear dual lock that i got from Goode and black dual lock that was recomended here. I cleaned it all completely, warmed everything with a heat gun and put a strip of clear mated with a stip of black down both sides, and but some short pieces up front going horizontal. I was barely out of the water and it came appart. I put it back together, went back out and as I went into my first ball, exploded again!!!! From my boat i got on the phone with Goode. Spoke with a tech there. I am really so discusted with this I just want to send the ski and power shell back. They are sending me more tape and want me to do this again???????Please! The adheasive is NOT the problem. The dual lock does not stay locked. The tape stays stuck very well. So, today.....I did not even get into shiing hard, as this thing exploded just as I began the course. Totally fed up. We all know how hard it is to get this tape off completely and replace it. Goode has be replacing tape that I put on yesterday. and it is on good! I am not a quitter, this is why I have not gone back to my old ski . I feel potential in this Nano, and everyone tells me it is NOT the product. Then why did it come apart again??? I dont think my skiing tecnique is causing this. I have been to ski schools and coach others in the course as well. Sure anyone can improve anything, but there has got to be more to this. So frusterated and puzzled. Thought you would find it interesting that it came appart again using the black tape. Thanks for all your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Chef23 Posted August 4, 2014 Baller Share Posted August 4, 2014 @Winston put your old bindings on the new ski. You can have Goode put inserts into the ski for your old bindings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller liquid d Posted August 4, 2014 Baller Share Posted August 4, 2014 and photos of the top of plate with boots on it....I may be seeing things, but it looks like the boot is right on the top edge of the plate...doesn't look like any plate left out in front of the front boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted August 4, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted August 4, 2014 I am in massachusetts. Delta works from hartford BDL. About 40 mins drive to my door from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted August 4, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted August 4, 2014 I will take a look at the plate/ boot set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Chef23 Posted August 4, 2014 Baller Share Posted August 4, 2014 @Winston where do you ski? I live in eastern Mass about 20 minutes from Boston. If you want to head east sometime I am happy to take a look at your ski and pull you for a ski. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted August 4, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted August 4, 2014 @ Liquid.....You may be on to something! This nano is a short ski. When I ordered it, i told them what I was skiing on ( a differant Goode ski), my weight, my skill, etc. They sujested the shorter ski ( 65). I have always felt it was too short, hense my skiing on the tail. I have tried my plate in differant possitions to try to ski better and get more of the ski in the water. Goode took all my measurements and sent me the 65 inch ski with medium double boot power shell. I argued the meduim boot with them, as I wear size 10.5 to 11 shoe. Sure thing...to small. They had me send it back and sent me a large as I wanted from day one. With the large boots on the plate, I have my front boot back as far as it will go on the adjustment inside, and the toe of the boot actually covers the center notch for the spacer piece of plate. There is zero plate in front of my front boot. None at all. Do you folks have a lot of plate in front of your front boot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck_Dickey Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 @winston Short plate or shell too far forward with your "wheelie" and bingo! Should be a couple inches up front and back on the plate or you'll just leverage it apart. As far as the length of the ski is concerned, designs haves hanged so much that my normal 67" ski length in now a Nano One 65.25. Love this ski! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporting Member Than_Bogan Posted August 4, 2014 Supporting Member Share Posted August 4, 2014 MA!? Sweet. Swing by Lake Cochituate for sure. Also I think you are very close to Pat M (Sturbridge) who has used DL for release. But at least 3 of us at Lake Cochituate have experience with DL in general. I bet we could get to the bottom of this fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller aupatking Posted August 5, 2014 Baller Share Posted August 5, 2014 Be happy with pre release and move on. I have 2 titanium screws, 16 stainless staples, 6 months lost, and thousands of dollars in medical bills from failure to release, using Goode's suggested setup. You're lucky to have not injured yourself. The falls look bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted August 5, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted August 5, 2014 Goode set this up for me. Does anyone here have a power shell plate with double large boots? The most plate I could have in front of my front boot if I readjusted everything would be maybe 3/4 inch......maybe. Do any of you have a few inches? I just asumed Goode knew what they were doing. Could my boots possibly be on a medium plate? the plates can not be all the same size for differant size boots can they? I have done tournaments in Avon. But about 20 years ago. 20 mins from Boston may be possible for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller PatM Posted August 5, 2014 Baller Share Posted August 5, 2014 @Winston Where in Mass? I'm further west from Than and Mark. I'm near Sturbridge. Have had many years of experience on your setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller liquid d Posted August 5, 2014 Baller Share Posted August 5, 2014 You need at least a couple inches in front of that boot...3/4 inch ain't enough. That's exactly why it's releasing. Remount to that plate if there is enough...if not, get a longer plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck_Dickey Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 @winston You mentioned they gave you smaller boots that didn't fit? Did they replace just the boots and not the plate? Could be a simple shipping error, not the correct plate for the boots you needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Winston Posted August 7, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted August 7, 2014 Looks like I have a large plate for my large boots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller MattP Posted August 7, 2014 Baller Share Posted August 7, 2014 @Winston how about posting pictures of your setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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