2014 Big Dawg Finals Prelim Scores

[Ghibli]

Go Andy,,,

[TylerR]

This is why we need to change the governing body.... Any rule needs to run on the jeopardy clock. If you can't solve it in under 2 minutes you've lost the audience.... Btw for those of us in the south there is a pretty good baseball game on basic cable

[Ghibli]

Would have really been a mess if Rogers won. Miller deserves to be a little miffed i would think...

[disland]

Sad

[liquid d]

all's well that ends well...

[Ghibli]

What mental toughness from both skiers though...wow.

[Bulldog]

This thread is like a soap opera....

[mwetskier]

anyone who has ever spent 5 minutes with jeff rogers knows he wouldnt complain lightly about anything. maybe he should be given the benefit of the doubt here a little considering highly ranked experienced judges pondered the question and ultimately made the re ride ruling. all ski passes live or die by the judges rulings so why should this be any different?

[Horton]

Not pointing the finger at Rogers. He is a solid dude.

 

I hear there is a bit of a story. It will come out.

[lakeaustinskier]

I agree. As someone that was on site blame the system not the skiers. There seemed to be sentiment among a lot of the audience that the first ruling had boxed everyone into a corner and maybe they were trying to figure their way out.

[T-fromTO]

A lot of drama went down tonight. The Big Dawg skiers on shore banded together and vehemently protested this call and it was like a mutiny. The talking heads at Nautique did not know how to deal with the situation and that is why it took so long.

[ALPJr]

The Little League World Series is on. Lots of true spirits there.

[JC McCavit]

There shouldn't be do overs.

[A_B]

My opinion is that they should be skiing in daylight in the first place. Probably not a popular one, but that is just me. As a spectator, I would get more out of it, and flashlights/headlights/ baseball lighting, etc., aren't a part of the conversation.

[LeonL]

@T-fromTO‌ , how the heck did anyone from Nautique have any say as to "deal with the situation". They're just sponsors and have no call.

[Phil]

We should not be blaming the skiers and sponsors, any skier can ask for a re ride and it is up to the Chief Judge and the appointed officials to make the call and that call should be final !!

[kstateskier]

Who was the chief judge?

[T-fromTO]

@LeonL -Approximately 12 very tall, very angry skiers (and other interested parties) descended upon anyone with any possible authority to overturn the re-ride.

 

Not sure if everyone knows, but Greg Davis is no longer in charge of the Big Dawg events. He is now labeled "Founder and Consultant". Nautique boats now owns the Big Dawg series and as such, they are more than just a sponsor now.

 

Obviously no one can override the judges decision. I believe Rogers knew that and stood cool as a cucumber at the starting dock for over an hour while mayhem took place all around him and the announcer talked himself silly. All so that he could get a second place finish instead of 3rd.

[Texas6]

These are some downright Type A competitive dudes - every one of them believes they can win and on a good day, most any one of them can. Judges gave a re-ride and my experience says they just won't if they don't agree with the request. Give the judges and Jeff the benefit of the doubt. Having said that, given the blowback, I don't think Jeff would make that same request if he had it to do over again - all were caught up in the competition

[LeonL]

You're right @Phil. As I posted last night, re rides aren't granted lightly by any competent judge. Once the event judges rule, the ruling stands. No pressure from other competitors, spectators, sponsors, organizers, or anyone else should sway that. Eventually the re ride That was granted apparently stood. Obviously with a delay of about an hour the judges were listening to some noise from someone. That should have never happened. If you're accepting the responsibility of judging, make your decision and man or woman up and refuse to listen to complaints about that decision. Having said all that, I really don't know what transpired. Just taking assumptions based on the evidence available. A bad situation, and bad exposure for one of our sports biggest events.

[Zman]

Agree with the sentiment that once the reride was granted and taken, move on. For me the hour delay was not so bad cause I was spending time with good friends - many I had not seen in years. But it was bad. Over a third of the crowd left before the final round.

I also wish that all rounds were under the lights or at least not started until the sun was down. But, the day started with tricks at 7:30 am - so its long day for officials and volunteers.

For me it was tough seeing that glass calm water for an hour and wishing I could take a set under the light (and not so many people watching).

I am anxious to hear "the story" and exactly what caused the hour delay.

 

[bishop8950]

As with many of these situations, key facts are critical.

 

1) what was the nature of the request? I still have second hand information but was told credibly that it was for a car flashing head lights right up the centerline of the course. The BigDawg contingent were originally told it was for camera flashes. The car sounds more significant than camera flashes. Worth a re-ride? Judges call.

 

2) Jeff was signaling the problem before he got the the entrance gate not after his pass.

 

Whichever way this was supposed to go I don't understand why it took so long to get there. But again, I have incomplete information.

[LeonL]

I didn't want use as strong a wording as @OB, seeing as how I don't have all the facts as Kevin said. But @OB's use of the term "little girls" seems appropriate.

[disland]

The Chief Judge should have immediately stated that the decision was final, ordered the boat crew to pull the next skier and if that skier was not in the water ready to go they are scratched. The time for debate was before the re-ride was given.

 

Easier said than done I am afraid

[webbdawg99]

Let's just hope that the entire situation is a learning experience and we don't see such a train wreck ever happen again in the Big Dawg.....or any other event for that matter!

[webbdawg99]

@OB based on what FACTS are you able to make that statement? Easy to armchair quarterback the whole situation. Whether or not they should've allowed the reride isn't what caused the mess. It's how they handled it after someone complained about the decision.

[eleeski]

Ridiculous crap!

That was worse than any trick unfairness, whining or politics.

 

On the good side, for a while the party vibe was great. Thanks to the wonderful person who was walking around sharing a platter of fine steak bites. Very cool.

 

Maybe this effort should be aimed at the kids - at least they have good eyes.

 

Eric

[klindy]

Reride, no reride, protests, angry mobs whatever. Frankly to the crowd on the show (who largely left before anyone got wet again) is that matters. It's far less of a tournament and far more of a show.

 

A potential "snap solution" would have been to have a 3-way finals. Grab another Nautique from the dock and pull all three. Best score wins.

 

The show must go on.

 

Plenty of time in the future to decide whether reride requests, etc are part of the show.

 

Just my uninvolved $0.02. Probably worth much less......

[disland]

What @klindy said

[Ed_Johnson]

WOW, all this outrage towards the Judges...Why is no one outraged towards the Idiot that is at the end of the course "Flashing their headlights." The hour should have been spent with some Texas Justice, Hanging that SOB from the tallest tree.

 

Congrats to Andy, Jeff, and Dave, really great skiing !!!

 

 

[T-fromTO]

It was very difficult for the chief judge and the Nautique reps to make a strong stance in the face of such a large angry group of protesters. These were people who had nothing to gain personally but just wanted to see the right thing done.

 

I think all would have been okay with a 3 way finals if that had been proposed. As it was, there was an extremely embarrassing time delay where spectators went home, people shut off their computers

[RazorRoss3]

The night ski works fine with good lighting but you could barely see the skiers from the boat so I'm not sure the site was lit as well as others have been. In the case of the re-ride I think if there was a legitimate distraction faced by Rodgers that miller DID NOT have (most important part there) then you could argue a re-ride. For other skiers whose complaint was glare on the 1,3,5 for example, both skiers had the same problem.

 

I have to agree that for the sake of seeing the best skiers ski at their best that running the event in daylight would be better, no one had to ski a buoy at 39 in any elite 8 match up and I have to think the light conditions played a part since they were averaging buoys at 41 in the prelims.

[JohnCox]

Good grief. If Jeff mentioned something, it must have been worth mentioning. The judges deemed it worthy of a re-ride and a decision was made. That should have been the end of it. Dave Miller was the only one that I think could have anything to say, and I'm sure he did at that moment. When the judges started listening to all the egos and personalities, they lost. They lost spectators, viewers, and credibility. Hats off to Jeff and Andy for just stepping out of the fray and letting the judges deal with the garbage (and any other skiers that did).

 

Yes, Jeff skis on a Mapple, but I'd say the same thing if he was still on the "mystery" ski.

[Ghibli]

Well, as a consumer of water ski products, the extra variables caused by the sun setting and the night skiing is what got me to watch the webcast and their commercials. Anything can happen. If it was a "normal" tournament during the day, one, I wouldn't have been home to watch, two, I wouldn't have bothered if I was. Amazing that the "best" still made it as far as they did even with all the variables. Three of the top four seeds made the semi-finals. Impressive for sure. I've paid attention to the Big Dawg for three years. I don't recall a subjective re-ride. Was this the first time somebody asked for one for something that would be judge's "discretion" as opposed to something concrete such as a speed control issue? I say make it the Nautique Show. No re-ride requests or protests allowed. All determinations will be initiated and made by the judge. So a guy's binding pops off, tough luck, the sun blinds your gate shot, tough luck, rollers knock your ski out around two ball, tough luck, camera flashes cause you to lose focus, though luck, lights flash at the end of the course, try again......

[E_T]

Why are there cars on a lake during a night big money event....let's just blame the ski club. Get over it. Jeff used his competive advantage. AKA KNOWING THE RULE BOOK

[Razorskier1]

Far too much speculation about this. Judges made a call based on firsthand information. I'm sure they wouldn't take a re ride lightly. I'd like to see the finals in daylight. Night has a cool factor, but I want to see skiers skiing their best, and darkness doesn't lend itself to that.

[Ghibli]

Maybe golf's lead should be followed, demand quiet from the crowd.

[skiray]

I'm all for the Big Dawg eliminating all re-rides in the future. It's their tournament and they can make the rules.

 

I was there last night and had a great time. My 2 cents: the judge decides. Not the other 12 skiers, not public opinion. That's the way it works. You don't like it, don't ski or change the rules for next time.

 

@OB you make a good point but I think you missed it slightly. The judge is the Marine.

 

Let it go boys. This bitchin is one more reason the sport is in decline.

 

I half wonder if anyone would have cared if the shoe was on the other foot and David got the re-ride.

[MillerTime38]

@OB unwritten rules? Sounds like baseball. Did anyone else ski with car lights flashing? Why would there be 12 angry skiers, it seems like there should only be one. Maybe if the angry skiers would have not rioted there would not have been such a long delay. Let the judges make their call and move on.

 

@OB comparing slalom skiers to fighter pilots..... Big stretch guys with their lives on the line and guys with their egos on the line

[gregy]

There were portable lights down both sides of the lake. Lots lighting. I guess you'd need stadium type lighting to do it right. I'd rather see it during daylight also.

[Wish]

Not saying it did not happen but with the crowd along the shore, it surprises me that no one other then Jeff at the time has come forward to say "yep, I saw those headlights". Find it interesting that one post said he was signaling before the gates. So not an after thought. All the camera flashes were obvous on line and were going off on just about every skier. Feed went down for me on Jeff's run. Where the headlights noticeable at the various angles shot during that run. Was his signal obvous? I know just unlocking my car via remote will turn headlights on. Long delay worked out for me as I fell asleep and woke up thinking I missed it.

[T-fromTO]

Harald said that the course was lit up nicely. Better than Okeheelee because there were lights on both sides of the lake.

 

Other elite 8 skiers say that flashes and car lights are part and parcel of the night finals and it would never even occur to them to ask for a re ride.

 

Nautique is likely going to make a new rule disallowing re rides for flashes.

[Sherwood]

@eleeski You can thank @Mad11 and his wonderful wife for the steak bites. They are great people and great for the sport.

[Horton]

I have talked to 5 people that were on site so far this morning. I am working on an unbiased summary. Gimmie an hour.

[mwetskier]

i trust whatever info @Horton will come up with but one thing no one has considered so far is there was someone else who saw exactly what rogers was seeing in real time. that would be the boat driver. don know who was driving but i am sure if rogers complained at the far end of the course the driver would be aware of it and would immediately confirm rogers description of headlights flashing -or not. if jeff saw it the driver saw it and i would think thats pretty persuasive real time input for the judges.

[gregy]

I hope this doesn't discourage folks like Jeff from participating in the big dawg. From a spectacular point of view I like seeing Jeff and Andy competing.

[DanE]

I don't get this hostility against rerides, what's next? shootimg paintball at random skiers and tell'em to suck it up?

[ToddL]

@DanE. Ask Jaime B about skiing while paintballs are firing...

[ScarletArrow]

It's happened before...

 

[Marco]

Not to open another can of worms, but from my perspective it appeared that the majority of the delay was caused by trying to appease a significant sponsor... Regardless, the skiing was great but I was dissapointed to have missed the final round. The rumor going around was that there would be no final,so we left after almost an hours wait.