At what point does motor hours give you concern in a used boat purchase?

[Wish]

With recent boat pricing and sales talk, I wondered where that possible deal breaker point would be for most on a motor. Speaking of mult-port fuel injected here. Example; GT40 and newer. Let's say the boat was obviously well maintained, you had the records and you had a machanic give it two thumbs up. But it had more hours then you'd like to see. What's that cut off that says the motor does not have enough life left in it for me to own it. For cars it used to be 100,000-150,000 miles. Especially with our parents generation.

[oldjeep]

I'm saying 1000, but it really depends on how it was used.

[GOODESkier]

I voted 750, but the way I look at it, the normal Joe that is going to look at my boat (you know after I bought a boat with 750 hours on it, used it for 5 years and now it has 1300 plus on it....) is going to look elsewhere over 500 hours in my opinion. Too many options for boats with lower hours. Regardless of how particular I am with maintenance and upkeep. I plan on trying to send my boat to a new home before 1000 hours. Currently have 520 on a boat I have owned for 5 years.

[Zman]

I'm with @oldjeep‌ But - a really tough question because it depends a lot on what a buyer is looking for. If looking for an older, nice boat at high teens or low 20's $, if it looks well kept a 1000 hours is nothing. Especially if you check the engine closely, and it looks well kept too. If I am looking at a newer model, I might not want a ski school boat with a 1000 hours.

[thager]

Compression, compression, compression, compression, compression, compression, compression, and compression. My last three cars have all gone over 300K. Routine and preventative maintenance is key! Same for boats.

[oldjeep]

For me not so much about the look, but my experience with a very well cared for boat that i ski behind is the motor feels whipped. 1000 hours of 0 to 34 to idle/off is a bit hard on the engine. Even worse if someone has been pegging it out for barefooting. A family boat that was used for cruising around at 20 and skiing will likely last for more hours.

[TallSkinnyGuy]

There are a lot of boats out there that get 25 hours or less a year on them, so it was pretty easy for me to find a boat from the mid 90s last year with under 500 hours. Under 800 hours was really really easy with that era boat. So I figured why even look at boats with over 800 hours unless a truly significant discount came with it. I now know more about boats and am not as fearful of 1000+ hours, but I think I would still be searching for a well maintained boat with under 800 hours if I were buying now because I know there are plenty out there.

[MISkier]

For me, I would be cautious buying over 750 hours. It would really depend on what type of water the boat was in. Clear, clean, fresh water is better. Too much muddy water can have buildup in the cooling system and get a few hot spots that might give you cylinder problems. The big maintenance items, like manifolds and risers, would have to check out as well or be new.

 

Having said that I would be cautious buying over 750 hours, I don't think I would worry about owning a boat and putting most of those hours on myself. If I put, say, 1000 of the hours on a 1200 hour boat, I would probably feel OK about keeping and putting on additional hours. I would know where it was used, how it was used and how it was cared for.

 

My current boat is a 2009 with about 370 hours on it and I bought it when it was a year old and put most of those hours on it. I knew the owner, knew how it was used, and knew how it was cared for. I sold my previous boat with 300 hours and it was 10 years old. I bought that one when it had 33 hours on it and was 4 years old.

 

Cars are another story. I buy new and drive them until I no longer can. Still driving my 1996 Tahoe with 260,000 on it.

[rawly]

Recently bought an 09 196 with 950 hours. Well maintained and set up nicely. With the 80 hours I put on per year , the boat will last another 20 years before it will need a motor. The higher hours saved me 10 K. That's a lot of gas money.

[RichardDoane]

it's all about the price discount that comes with hours, and a well maintained engine should go 5000 hours

[rockdog]

I notice Dave Millers 07 with 1770 hrs hasn't been picked up yet for$20k and I'm presuming it has been reasonably well looked after. It will be interesting to see how long it takes. 1770 hrs is way too many for me..

[thager]

Figure that for 1770 hours @17 seconds a pass in the course is preseded and followed by 30 seconds of run in and run out @ 34mph followed by one minute of idle or engine off so for every six pass set you're looking at 1.5 minutes running 34mph followed by 2 minutes of running at idle worst case. So 3 minutes per pass. Boat roughly only runs 20 minutes for each hour of use, 1770 hours really is only about 590 hours of running time. In a car at 70mph that's 41,300 miles.

[Spuddy]

I would be more cautious of a boat that is over 10 years old that has very low hours, means it has sat for far to long which is not great for the engines.

[LeonL]

Kinda like @rawly said, it depends to some extent on how many hours you put on a boat once you get it. It's somewhat foolish, granted, but my ski partner and I each have a boat. By alternating boats we put only 30 hours each on them this season. We skied 83 days. You may be able to take a relatively high hour boat and get many years of service, or if you put 200 hours a year on it, not so many left in it. Kind of a "mister obvious" comment but worth mentioning.

[oldjeep]

@thager I don't think you can really make a car analogy, but if there was one it would be like taking a 3000lb car, putting it in 2nd or 3rd gear, and dumping the throttle until you got to 75% of its top speed in that gear. Run it there for 17 seconds, idle for 30 seconds and then repeat.

[ALPJr]

For me it's all about who owned and how they used and maintained it. A really, really well maintained boat with up to 2000 hours would not concern me, would just need to be priced right.

[Skoot1123]

A well maintained engine should last a LONG time - > 3000 hours. If you put that many hours on a boat, more than likely you aren't thinking about resale. But if you are thinking about resale as @wish stated, then you really ought to look at the rest of the boat and consider the condition it is in. But for an overall idea of how well a boat is taken care of - look at the engine. Just my two cents.

[ntx]

@skoot1123 has a point. Cosmetic things are easy and cheap to fix. We have club boats that get a ton of hours. The motor maintence is done on a regular basis. Unfortunatly, several members are not the best drivers around the dock. We get gel coat damage that looks bad but the motor is good. We do end up selling our boats cheap every two years or so.

 

Think about a farmer with a tractor. They might never wash the tractor, but you can bet that they take care of the motor. The boat is a tool. The most important part of the tool is the motor. I would rather have one that gets oil changes over one that gets waxed each week. My guess is that @eleeski thinks the same way.

[Jody_Seal]

Ford and Chevy longevity Like comparing apples to oranges!

 

When purchasing a newer boat Chevy powered EFI a printed diacom Report should be in hand as it has a break down of hour usage 0-1000 RPM, 1001-2000 Rpm 2001-3000 RPM, 3001-4000 RPM, 4001-5000 RPM and on up to above 5000 RPM.

 

The ECM logs this information. Now a boat with a total of 2000 hrs may only have 300 above 3000 RPM and the bulk of the rest of the hours were below 1000 RPM at Idle that is a boat that was utilized by a slalom skier. A 2000 hr boat that has the bulk of its hours above 3000 RPM and minimal idle time is usually a boat utilized for wake boarding. A good inspection of the diacom report tells all how hard the engine has been run.

 

Boats with Older Ford engines... Well you need to know your Fords to deduct condition and engine health. A compression check is alway's useful. a Leak down test. Looking at an 80's Ford engine more than likely has a two piece seal and low performance timing chain and at 2000 hrs is flat worn out! A GT-40 that has been meticulously maintained with 2000 hrs might give another 1000 hrs before it needs attention.

 

Again find out how a previous owner used the boat, Where the boat was utilized. inquire about service records.

 

Service longevity of other of the boats components should be considered also in relation to how the boat was utilized in its service hours.

 

This could go on and on!!

 

When making a purchase decision of a used boat a quick interior tear down is always in order, the fuel tank area hides a lot of information as to how wet, oily and general condition of how it was taken care of. Pull the back seats and see how much yard debris is lurking......

 

[Wish]

I vote @Jody_Seal‌ should be labeled as "industry professional" vs "crazy baller" We all know he's crazy (wink) but he put's out some very useful posts when it comes to boats and other items. Thanks @Jody_Seal‌ great advice.

[BrennanKMN]

This is a hard one, because you didn't say a year.

A 2000 model year with 1500 hours would be just fine. A 2010 with 1500 hours and I might keep looking.

I don't have a dead set number for when I walk away, it is all relative. A boat could be trash at 500 hours just as easily as it could be at 2500 hours. It is all dependent.

 

[Wish]

@BrennanKMN‌ Agreed but a variable just to hard to include. My thought is a motor is a motor is a motor. Hours are hours. The yr may change the price based on age of the boat as a whole but the motors are not clocked by time in earth not running.

[thager]

Don't forget... Click... and the ECM could be changed. Can't prove it but I do think it is going on.

[Wish]

I could be wrong but the ECM can only be set back to 0. That may be where a super low hour boat could be a potential problem. Also if I had to do this over I would have put how many hours per yr is to many 100, 150, 200, and so on.

[Jody_Seal]

"Click"

No It does not work that way. Actually pretty close guarded programming and lock out.

have seen ECM's go to 1999.9 hours and stop counting !

[oldjeep]

@Wish not sure why hours per year really matters. Unless they parked the thing for 10 years without fogging it I wouldn't have any issues with boats that sit. I just fired up a 460 last week that I haven't run in 7 years, works just as well as the day I put it away.

[thager]

I was talking about installing a new ECM, not messing with an old one. My ZO conversion does not show previous time. My engine log does and will be passed on to the buyer if I ever sell it.

[Chef23]

I have had to put two different PP computers in my boat and didn't reset the hours when I made the switch. I am sure you can get the engine hours off the ECM but I have no idea how to.

 

An honest estimate from me for my boat would be 750 hours but I am not sure what I will do when it comes time to sell.

[Jody_Seal]

@‌Chef23

If you have a GT-40 Ford you can not obtain hours off the ECM, no communication capabilities.

GM-MEFI 3,4,5 and E-control have the communication capabilities.

 

 

 

[TEL]

Not just hours matter, how old the boat matters too. I think if your looking for a used boat you will buy one with ZO at lest a 2008 and newer. Thinks begin to fail with age, interior recovering's are expensive to replace, Etc.

[slow]

Wish ford was back in the marine engine business with pcm/cc with a new gt40.

[jhughes]

For me, I'm only afraid of what the potential next owner will think. As such I chose the lowest hours in the survey. I don't want to have to tapdance or sell for wholesale to the next owner on the high-hours conversation.

 

One thing I'm curious about is how are all these cat systems holding up? ETX Cat, Catainium, etc.? Are these manifolds designed to last the life of the engine?

[teammalibu]

The ECM talk reminded me I still have the original ECM from my 2008 Malibu LXI that i replaced when I converted it to Zero Off. If any body wants it I will ship it to them for $150.00

[SkiKolb]

I know it's not a direct comparison, but my Chevy Suburban has 7855 hrs on it and is original, it has towed boats and cars all over this country ands is running strong, mileage is 258K and will be headed to Orlando for thanksgiving and towing a trailer back to Ohio. It runs down to road at about 2000rpm on average. I am ok with a high hr boat.

[rodltg2]

My 99 has close to 1700 , I think my resale is shot

[ozski]

Whats a rebuild cost in the US? Ballpark. For me it all comes down to buy price because you can fix up pretty much everything on the boat. A good hull will remain a good hull.

[GAJ0004]

My 94 Nautique has 1750 hours on it. Only four mechanical repairs over the years. 1 muffler, 2 steering cables, and one alternator. In 20 seasons it only had 3 hours of downtime. It was the day the alternator went out. It took longer to go to the marina to get the part than actually install it. Detailed monthly, and taken in to a marina for service every 400 hours. Oil changed every 50, tranny fluid changed every 100 hours. It is on its third battery. With the condition it is in I would have no problem selling it. I just would not get much money for it. Once I get some of the upholstery redone it will be in near mint condition.

[DW]

Compression test and leak down test data means as much to me as hours on an engine, but don't tell you a lot on valve spring condition. One smoked impeller followed by a inattentive overheat can damage an engine at any point on the hour meter. Better feedback would be from someone like Jody Seal on his experience in seeing a few engine teardowns relative to engine hours and component condition across several examples. My expectation would be a well taken care of engine can last 2k+ hours and still give good reliable service.

[ALPJr]

@GAJ0004‌ that 94 sounds nice. Any pic's ?

[SkiJay]

You're going to hurt your boat's feelings by saying its resale is shot @rodltg2. If your boat is in decent condition, you can still get at least $10k for it. Worst case is that in the last 10 years of loyal service, it only depreciated about $10k to $15k max. You wouldn't say a three year old boat's resale is shot even though it has suffered more depreciation than that. Your tug has probably been holding its value really well since it went past 1,000 hours =)

[ozski]

Here is a 200 with 1500 hours for 30k - http://www.ski-it-again.com/php/skiitagain.php?endless=summer&topic=Search&category=Comp_Boat&postid=30442 For the price I would be all over it if I was after another boat...

[rockdog]

Skip Dunlap seems to sell a lot of boats, anyone know what kind of condition he keeps them?

[GAJ0004]

Attempting to upload a pic..

[GAJ0004]

 

[GAJ0004]

Forgot this site was designed for use on Google Chrome which is why it did not upload before.

[GAJ0004]

 

[A_B]

We just turned over 1k hours at the end of summer on our 07 SN, and if you didn't look at the hour meter, you would never know. I run synthetic oil and it sits in the garage when not in the water. It was purchased with around 700 hours, of which we were told a bunch were at idle as a pickup boat. Compression is great and it pulls strong.

[bbirlew]

@GAJ0004‌,

My ski partner has your boats twin.

 

My '94 is purple with black. (Though I've mucked mine up with a tower!)

 

Looks good!

 

[GAJ0004]

@bbirlew. I have never seen another boat from that vintage with the same colors. So, it is the exact same colors as mine? I would never thought I would see one. I have seen them with the red and blue stripes reversed.

 

[Xpropman]

ECM read out. This is a boat at OKEEHEELEE.