Re-power

[UWSkier]

I'd love a 6.0 in my '01 Response. Getting the old engine out and putting the new one in, I could handle myself with a helper, but all the necessary fabrication and re-wiring I think I'd need a pro. I don't imagine these things are plug-and-play with old wiring harnesses.

[Yannis]

MASTERCRAFT PS190 TT year 2004, repower 6.0L , Z/O, same transmition ZF 1.56:1. All skiers are very happy skiing behind it.

[bassfooter]

@sgregg We're on Doug's list to do this to our '98 bubble butt, and it can't happen soon enough. The original engine is showing signs of giving up. Would love to see more pix -- dash, throttle handle, etc. It looks great!

[ski6jones]

@sgregg did you change to a new prop with the engine upgrade?

[sgregg]

@bassfooter - PP to ZO was the only change to the dash, using the original throttle. You will need to fabricate a shim to raise the engine box approx 1.5” - pm me if you would like more info on that

 

@ski6jones - yes, swapped props from a 422 to a 668

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jody_Seal]

Thought I would give a heads up to anyone considering a repower you may have up to a 12 week wait on delivery of the PowerPlant from order date .

 

Still cheaper then a new tugboat!

 

 

 

 

[MDB1056]

@bassfooter - or just pull the existing engine and have it rebuilt. Will be like new at a fraction of the cost, and everything reconnects easily. Is ZO really that essential and worth the cost and hassle?

 

[RAWSki]

@MDB1056 Yes and No.... Depends if you want to ski in the 20th or 21st century.

[MDB1056]

@RAWSki - IMO really depends on your level. At very high levels much more of a factor. At lower levels not so much

[bassfooter]

@MDB1056 More to it than just ZO. The old engine is a 351 HO, which is carbureted, and we've been running in saltwater with no closed cooling. A rebuild will only get us so far. This new setup gives us modern ignition and fuel delivery, closed cooling and 110 (120?) more horses. I know the boat very well, and my wife and I both love to ski behind it. In fact she's totally into doing this. I'm a lucky guy.

 

Most importantly, @eleeski told me he won't ski with me until I get ZO or a paddlewheel for PP. So there's that.

 

[DW]

@bassfooter - am I interpreting correctly 351 Ford > 350 Chevy as a powertrain update?

[bassfooter]

@DW 351 Ford to PCM ZR 409, which is based on a 6.0L GM Vortec. My understanding is that PCM is no longer offering the 350-based Excalibur.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

@bassfooter

That will be a sweet setup :)

[Mastercrafter]

Figured I'd toss in my submission for re-powers. Installing a 2018 Ilmor 5.7 in a 1991 Prostar. End goal is to build it into a 25th Anniversary Stars and Stripes 190 clone.. we'll see.

 

Got the engine running this weekend. It was somewhat involved as it needed a high pressure fuel pump installed into the original tank, as well as TBW throttle/shift control, custom wiring harnesses throughout. Still using analog oil and temp gauges. Far from plug-and-play but now that I've done it, it all makes perfect sense ;) I have a salvage 2016 Prostar doghouse to go on top, because the original was too small in every dimension.

 

I think this will be a fun, unique slalom machine.

 

 

 

 

[MDB1056]

@Mastercrafter - that's going to be a really fun boat! Great hull. Keep us posted.

[Hucklefin]

@Mastercrafter This is amazing. How did you do your driveshaft configuration? Custom cut, or did you just try to manipulate engine position to fit everything? Seems like you'd have to get really lucky for the latter to work for it all to line up and not cause some kind of CG or angle issue.

[Mastercrafter]

@Hucklefin I have a couple driveshafts to try but I think I'll need a custom length. The one from the boat is now too long by a couple inches. CG might be an issue but the engine is as far forward as it can be to have the engine box clear the air filter and the ski pylon. Fingers crossed. I supposed I could throw some weight in the bow to balance / level the boat but of course that takes away from my lightweight, low wake, ZO boat project. Engine angle is a non-issue, I've already made sure the shaft couplings mate up flush.

 

[Andre]

@Mastercrafter Cool project! Battery can easily be relocated to under the passenger seat if you need some weight in the front.

Should be a fun drive! You're putting ZO off course ?

[DW]

Mastercrafter: How much did the engine move? Sounds like it has gone a bit rearward based on your comments. Have you weighed old v new engine setups? Cool project.

[Mastercrafter]

@DW the original prop shaft, when installed with the Ilmor, is about 2” too long.

 

I asked a friend to measure between the front of their block and ski pylon on their 1994 190 with a GM 350. Their dimension was 11” and mine is 14.5.

 

This obviously isn’t ideal, plus this engine is way heavier, but without moving the pylon or building a really custom, split motor box, I’m stuck here. Fingers crossed, I guess. If it’s real bad, I could move it forward and go the custom motor box route.. or ski my 2015 Prostar and pull tubes with this.. ha.

 

Other option is moving the battery forward, and maybe even a custom fuel cell up under the bow to get weight out of the back.

[Hucklefin]

@Mastercrafter At least you have one thing going for you, that you can just get your current shaft reworked instead of having a custom one built. Have you analyzed if you need to upsize it though, if this was originally a non-HO non-powerslot boat? I don't know the limitations of the 1" shaft.

If this was an OEM effort, I'm sure that weight shift would be a huge issue, but given this is a custom project, I'm sure you can find a way to live with the results. Assuming CG location on the engine fore/aft probably isn't much different than original engine (thinking most of the added weight is high on the engine), losing 3.5" to the rear might not be the end of the world.

[FSSPCat]

Not to steal the thread, but it’s been 3 years since I’ve heard anything about the Indmar Ecoboost. I’m genuinely curious if it has been put in a ski boat yet, or just jet boats.

[storm34]

@Hucklefin -

Lots of detailed discussion on CorrectCraftFan a few years back with guys building high HP barefoot boats. I don't remember all the details but general consensus was it's not a necessity until you get up into crazy (600+) HP ranges. The 1" shaft shouldn't be an issue with this type of re-power. All new SN's & 200's with the 6.2 run a 1" shaft.

[chrislandy]

@Mastercrafter the boat wake is all about balance, too much weight to stern and it will make the wakes larger, you could just put a small amount of weight upfront to counterbalance the larger weight shift from the engine and move the centre of mass back to the original place.

[Ski2000]

@sgregg or @Jody_Seal

Have you guys needed to add any weight in the bow on the bubble butt nautique with added weight of the 409?

It’s about 100lbs heavier it looks like over the pro sport engine I pulled out

[Jody_Seal]

@Ski2000

Case by case. Even with the gt engines some boats may need extra weight forward.

Normally on the bubble butt I would slide 25 pounds under the driver seat as those boats seemed to be passenger side down.

 

[sgregg]

@Ski2000

 

We swapped out a GT40 and the Series 40 transmission, haven’t felt a need to add weight.

[Mastercrafter]

Got the repowered 1991 Prostar in the water for the first time Sunday. The thing rips. We didn't ski it yet, but it gets up to 36 fast and only spins about 3250 RPM there. 48mph top speed with a 14X20 prop, 1.5:1 trans. Despite a full tank of fuel and battery in the back, and the heavy engine moving back a few inches, it handled well with no porpoising. 100lbs lead under observers seat to keep things level with just me in the boat. So far, so good. Excited to ski behind it.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmkWOK5PmWA

[Jody_Seal]

 

Managed to catch one today.

Been on order since middle of November..

 

[rockdog]

They are magnificent photos.

[Kelvin]

@Jody_Seal didn't realize they still made the non-cat version.

[Jody_Seal]

@Kelvin

Yes pleasurecraft has a great repower program that in most cases allows a new 6.0 non cat to be installed in older non cat boats.

Now it is not without extra EPA paperwork but yes the engine is still available.

Pleasurecraft does not offer a catalytic engine that has dual exhaust. That becomes a big and costly problem on dual exhaust boats.

This engine is going in a very nice old Hydrodyne.

 

[MDB1056]

@Jody_Seal - what year Hydrodyne and can you post a couple of pics? I’m a big Dyne fan

[Jody_Seal]

@MDB1056

1994

 

Garbage out and zo installed.

Will set engine package in the next couple days.

New exhaust going in as well as strut bushings installed.

Have a leaking port side exhaust port i have to address.

 

[Mastercrafter]

@Jody_Seal - what do those PCM engines require for fuel and throttle? Are all the new ZR4 engines you get closed-cooled?

 

Does the engine mounted pump draw right from a tank pickup, or is there a low pressure pump to move fuel to the high pressure pump on the engine?

 

Is the throttle control completely DBW or does a throttle cable connect to a device on the engine that then converts it do “DBW”

 

With this Ilmor repower I had close to $2k in a fuel pump and DBW throttle/shift control which kinda sucks.

[Jody_Seal]

@Mastercrafter

Yes closed cooled.

They are DBW however Potentiometer is mounted on the engine, mechanical cable from throttle control the Potentiometer. Now if one wants a electronic throttle installed it can be done.

Yes the engine comes with a FCC mounted on the engine as well as remote oil filter.

They will run on piss water but mid grade and above recommended

[Mastercrafter]

@Jody_Seal , nice- thanks for the info. Better/easier package for repower, that’s for sure.

 

Does the FCC draw right from the tank or do you need a low pressure pump somewhere along the way to get the fuel to FCC?

[Jody_Seal]

The Fcc has both low and high pressure pumps on one modular unit..

[Ski2000]

 

[Ski2000]

Got it in last night, minted up the transmission. Ready to drop it in this weekend if all goes well

[Jody_Seal]

 

94 Hydrodyne! Like this engine was designed for this boat! Engine box fits too!

[thager]

Had a 93 Comp. Loved that boat! Awesome wake and with ZO it should be incredible!

[Ski2000]

 

Dropped right in. Lake test tomorrow. Need to get a couple electric items sorted with zero off, but should be skiing in a week or so

 

[GaryJanzig]

Please post some video when it is on the water!

[Ski2000]

https://share.icloud.com/photos/05d0kKYFaz6YzUMMFe-cauXmA#Saylorville_Lake

Here is a quick video from a rolling start to wot.

Gets there in a hurry. Kind of fun driving around going through the break in process

[Windsurfnut]

That thing sounds amazing!

 

[Ski2000]

Coming from a 5.0 the seat of pants feel is nuts. I’m going to take a few passes to get the right pull-up for people. The 5.0 was in gear-the punch it. Easy up for every but the lightest skiers

[GaryJanzig]

Saw the video. Sounds great!

 

[CBR51]

Awesome!

[Jody_Seal]