Restoring a classic ski lake

[Horton]

 

The time as come to spruce up my parents lake. There are constraints and they are as follows

1. I am doing 99% of the work myself

2. I am doing it all on the super cheap

3. The lake is going to be full or at least 1/2 full of water

4. I live 2 1/2 hours away and manage a 5 year old so faster solutions are going to be chosen over best solutions.

 

To do any of this right would cost 10s of thousands to 100s of thousands of dollars. The lake really should be drained and redug but that is not what I am doing. My goal is to make the lake safer and good enough to ski on a few weekends a year.

 

There are 2 primary things that need to get done.

1 ) The current slalom course was installed with steel rebar that extends too far off the bottom for safety. In 50 years no one has been injured from hitting the rebar but I do not like it.

 

I plan on pulling out all of the rebar with a stake puller. That is the easy part. I want to pound in oversize tent stakes right next to the old stakes. I imagine moving the whole course 6" south so all the balls are close to being where they belong. The new stakes would be MUCH closer to the bottom and without sharp ends facing up. So much safer.

 

Exactly what stakes to use and how to pound them in is the question. I am looking at 30" tent stakes with eye hook. I will likely be standing in 3 or 4 feet of cold water when I do it. I can imagine a custom stake driver but since I do not weld ....

 

 

2 ) the other part of the project is reshaping the shoreline with a 40 year old Kubota tractor. I do not even know what questions to ask about that part of the project. All I know is there are places where there is a 9" vertical cliff at the water line and I need to taper it down. I guess don't flip the tractor and get a good slope are my key points.

 

 

 

[MNshortliner]

How hard is the bottom. Have you thought of screw in style earth anchors.

[Zman]

Thumbs up on the auger or screw type anchors.

To install, you could slot the end of a section of pipe to slide over the eyelet on top of the anchor. Then drill about 1/2 or 5/8 hole through the pipe near the other end to slide a solid steel rod or piece of rebar through to use as a handle to screw in the anchors.

You could get the anchor started with a breath hold dive. Then use the pipe to finish it.

What about getting the current course surveyed first? Then, if any adjustments are needed you can factor that in your offsets from the existing rebar anchors.

[Intheday]

Why wouldn't you bend the existing reo bar to make a loop at the top?

[Horton]

The bottom is very hard. I do not think screw anchors would work.

 

These are 31" inches long. If I can pound them in I think this is the best bet.

 

 

[Zman]

That might be a problem. I put 2 in my lake as anchors for a floating course. Deep lake, so I had to use my Jacques Cousteau vintage scuba gear. The bottom was very hard, but once I got a bite, the augers screwed in pretty good.

If you need to drive in the anchors, use a section of pipe to slide over the anchor eyelet, then a larger diameter pipe with a cap on one end, or plate welded on, and handles welded on two sides. The larger pipe slides over the smaller pipe, then lifted and slammed down as a hammer.

Wear ear plugs. :D

[Zman]

Oops. I missed the "I do not weld" part.

Fab shop nearby?

[skiinxs]

Why not just drive the existing rebar in farther? 5 lb sledge and some diving gear. Assuming zero visibility as most ski lakes are, locate the rebar with the free hand then move it before every swing of the hammer.

[mmosley899]

Use concrete anchors, much easier to accurately adjust the position of the buoys. And also to reposition if they get moved.

[GregHind]

Fill a bucket with concrete with some pvc pipe up the middle and put it over the stake. Then there is nothing sharp to hit but everything still works as it was. Cheap and quick.

[Dano]

I second concrete anchors set with an eye hook in the centre would be cheap and easy

[Stevie Boy]

Concrete Anchors are alright for lakes with silt or muddy bottoms as they sink in and do not move too much, not sure if that would be the case on a hard bottom they may move about, the Auger idea is the best solution if they will go in.

As for knocking stakes in, Tube that fits over the end, and then a inner bar slides down on top, which can be hit above the surface, you could also use the bucket and concrete idea, with a hole in it, to help position the tube with the stake in it, doing stuff underwater especially when it is cold, Sucks ! If on your own not that safe either, I suggest you make sure somebody else is always around, even if you have to pay them.

Have you though of forming a small club, for people that may want to use it on a adhoc basis,.

Many Hands make light work, they also generate ideas for problem solving.

[BraceMaker]

I like @GregHind suggestion. Technically you could put dry cement in the bucket an eye bolts threaded through it and a hole for the rebar.

 

Once set down onto the rebar you could cut the rebar flush or under the rim of the bucket.

 

For grading huge variety in what that old Kubota can do, assuming it's a fair sized tractor you should be able to drive down the lake where you drained it using a back blade. It will need to be wider than the tractor. One arm on the 3 point hitch can be adjusted to pitch the blade and you would set it up to cut that cliff. On my compact tractor I have an offer rototiller. With that I'd drive with my back tire just below the cliff and circle the lake about 5 times. But to do it quick you'll need a fair sized tractor.

 

[liquid d]

Put the concrete blocks in with rebar loop coming out of them. In 2 of the corners of the block you put a little piece of pvc that runs through the block. you can pound a piece of rebar through the pvc slot into the ground if you think you need to. The whole course can be done in 1/2 a day.

[PatM]

What about installing a cross lake cable course like they have at Okeeheelee?

[Jody_Seal]

I second the cross cable set up.

[ForrestGump]

I just want to point out that your dad's lake is not "A" classic ski lake. It is "THE" classic ski lake.

[Steven_Haines]

For shaping the slopes it’d be safer and more efficient to rent an excavator

[Stevie Boy]

Cross cable would be a good option, no rebar, relatively easy to adjust.

[thager]

I'm lazy! .Just cut the rebar with a hacksaw. Reinstall. The rough surface of the rebar will stay puy in the bottom. Not sure your smooth ones will hold in the hard bottom.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

I seriously doubt you will be able to position the hooks, pound them in and be within a foot of where they should be. Much better to use concrete blocks - 18” square, 4” thick work great. Drill a hole in the center for a stainless steel eyebolt and holes on opposite corners - with or without pvc - to drive a 12” piece of rebar through to “pin” it in place after you verify its close to the right spot.

 

That level of shore work should be easy with the tractor and box blade. You will be wishing for a hydrostatic transmission instead of the old gearbox within about 10 minutes but if you've never used one you wont know what you are missing.

[JayG80]

If you end up cutting the rebar, Bolt Cutters are better than a Hack Saw.

[RichardDoane]

organize a work party weekend. you've got lots of crazy skier friends who would love to help if invited.

[Horton]

@Bruce_Butterfield You're saying that standing in three or four feet of water I can't pound a stake within 12 in of where I want it? Really?

[Horton]

To clarify for some of you guys. I am looking for the fast and dirty solution. Most of these concrete solutions look like five times as much effort as simply pounding and some new stakes with an eye hook on top. This is by no means the ideal long-term solution but it's good enough to facilitate the few days of skiing the lake will get used for every year.

[markn]

The phrases "used a few days a year" and fast and dirty" tells me RC is not required....accu-float and just pull the old re-bar.

[BraceMaker]

Quick and dirty why not just put rebar safety caps on and pound the rebar deeper?

 

Or you could get some sections of PVC pipe with end caps and put some underwater epoxy in there and shove it over the end of the rebar.

 

After all if you're going to wade around this lake pulling all those rebars you could just as easily pull around a canoe, pair of bolt cutters, bucket of PVC caps and a T-Post driver.

 

Every time you get to one pound it down, cut it off, cap it and remount your sub bouy - move on.

 

 

[BraceMaker]

Oh and keep a magnet on a rope tied to the boat.

[buoyboy1]

Pull out all the rebar. Put in a portable course with one anchor each end. Start skiing.....

[Horton]

Capping the old rebar is not the solution because some of it is pointing straight up and some of it has been bent up like a pretzel. it's a mess and a hodgepodge. some of it is for sure sharp. I cut myself when I was poking around out there two weeks ago.

 

Pulling it all out and putting in a portable course is an attractive solution but is expensive.

[BrennanKMN]

I couldn't agree with @markn more.

 

Pull the permanent course and install a portable with some good anchors on each end. When the time comes for the 'slow and clean' restoration you will have a clean slate to start with a proper install.

[andjules]

Let me get this straight:

you don't have much time or money

"In 50 years no one has been injured from hitting the rebar but I do not like it."

 

"I am looking for the fast and dirty solution."

Pool noodles over the rebar, secure with cable ties.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

@horton yes really. Have you ever moved anchors underwater? You think you moved 3“ in one direction but really moved 8” a different direction. Depending on the contraption you come up with to hammer your stakes its hard to say how close you'll get.

 

You asked for advice remember? Feel free to ignore.

[Deanoski]

I don't see how a 12 inch smooth spike will stay it the ground with a sub and buoy pulling up on it they will eventually pull out.

 

I see a baller work party in the making

[APB]

a small screw anchor would work so good. cool project! anyone ski there now?

[MISkier]

Use duckbill anchors after you cut the rebar off.

[Horton]

@andjules now that is insightful. I'm going to have to think about that. I would still prefer to get it all out and put in a portable but I'm not opening my wallet to pay for a portable.

[Stevie Boy]

The rebar sounds Nasty ! Without a proper setup and homologation the bouys could end up anywhere, it sounds like the portable course would probably be more accurate, quicker and easier in the long run.

I vote Pull the Rebar, but make sure you get it All !

There is a couple of portable options currently on Ski It Again.

[Zman]

Portable course in 3 to 4 feet of water? Good luck, even if you did splurge.

[Mateo_Vargas]

The cheapest and easiest solution may be to leave the course the way it is and bubble wrap the skier.

[swaterkd]

Duckbill anchors!!

[ToddF]

Cut, Straighten, Cap and notch for cable/chain to clear.

 

[jimbrake]

@Horton - what about the trick lake? Is that next?

[Horton]

@jimbrake Lake 2 is dry. If Lake 1 is ever re-dug the dirt goes in Lake 2.

[markn]

Holy smoke Horton!! What is your time worth? Pull the re-bar and you could have the course in place in less than 2 hours ready to ski. Don't step over a dollar to pick up a penny!

[Deanoski]

just move there and do it right!!

 

[A_B]

While in NY we skied in a 4-5’ deep beaver pond (yes a beaver created it) and the owner used a portable slalom course and it was always getting hung up and wanky.

 

If the current buoys are accurate I would try to take advantage of that and drive some new pins all in the direction you want to move the course. You may end up needing to get a pipe to fit over them with a heavy bolt through the pipe so it rests on top the pin about 4” from the pipe end the. You can stay above water once started.

 

About the shore line. Unless you want to drop in rip rap racks I have had better success moving the shore into the water. The waves break it up nice over time. We even use tree dibble bars to break the dirt loose and into the water.

[lakeside7455]

We used a bullet type metal flange, only about 2-3 inches long, that had some type rope attached that ran up to the sub bouy. We used a piece of rebar in the bullet flange to pound it down into the lake bottom. I was able to pound it pretty deep in the bottom and it held well. I think the flange might have even turned 90 when we pulled the rebar out. We had a surveyor on land positioning the rebar, when he said we were on, we pounded it down. I'm not sure where we got the special bullet metal flange, but it worked and course is about 20 years old with same sub bouys all attached to bottom of lake with the bullet flange.

[Chef23]

@Horton how about a sponsor for the floating course. The official course of BOS at Horton Lakes. That might help with the cost.

[GregHind]

@horton nobody will give you a floating course. Really? A video from you would sell heaps of them.