How do I stop skiing like this ?

[swbca]

For the last few decades I have been a snow skier, not a water skier. In my head I know I complete every turn with the mind set of leading with my shoulder to the next alpine gate. How do I stop doing that ? In the mid 80s I rarely missed 35 off in tournaments . . . . I think I had the same wrong mind-set then. When I attempt to correct this I end up tipping my head back but not improving body position.

Unrelated, look at the attitude of the skis when the skier is over the first wake trough. All 3 images are at 35off. Terry 30mph, Nate 34, I'm at 32. Live video makes it look like the skier is holding an edge through the wake. Stop action shows there is almost no ski in the water. These 2 pros were at slow boat speeds in these videos to show older age divisions how it done.

 

Off Topic: The wake Look 13 feet behind the 35off skiers. That's the wake at 22 off. The ProStar 197 wake in the left image doesn't have a sharp top on its 22 off rooster tale or at any other rope length. That's due to a stainless steel plate added to the transom of the ProStar that functions like the Correct Craft Hydrogate in full slalom position. The troughs are also shallower than before the plate was installed. Without this 3 frame comparison, I hadn't previously noticed how much difference there is. Comparing this ProStar 197 wake it to the Correct Craft wake in the center image is interesting.

[vtmecheng]

For me it has been a real struggle and I’m still working on it. Currently I’ve been repeating “stand tall” or just “tall” over and over. Try to find some thought or visual to have in your head that will work for you. The hip to handle, hips up, etc never worked for me. Also, try to learn the body position outside of the course. I get buoy stupid when things are not going well and all bets are off on my form. Good luck because it isn’t easy.

[Dysco]

I like your observations of the wake crossing. I was just reviewing some video a friend took of me. At the same spot, my ski was also barely in the water. I kept thinking "why's just the tail in the water? What am I doing??" Now I don't feel so bad.

[skiboyny]

I really think it's an evolution that takes time to develop. You have heard all the hips up, shoulders back, stand tall, and none of it is wrong, but you have to physically and mentally, be able to do it and that takes time. It's not a switch you flip. I believe there is a lot of muscle involved in holding the correct position, and the people that do it best have put the time in to develop it, but are largely unaware that it even exists. At the same time your brain needs to learn how to comfortably take that position, and it's incremental. Your body position looks about typical for the time you have in it. Be patient, be aware, you are on the same journey as everyone else only at a different time frame.

[swbca]

@skiboyny @Dysco I reversed my grip to the "correct" grip about 3 weeks ago, after the picture I posted above. I think that is helping, particularly on the off-side.

[BraceMaker]

Skis aren't in the air you just caught the micro second of the trough. the skier ski body unit has enough inertia to not drop into the dip or for the ski to suddenly drop so thats an analog for how deep the trough.

[RGilmore]

@swbca Your hips are back through the wake because your hands are up and out. Your hands are up and out because you never really got them down and in. You have to finish your turn with skiing into a stacked, hip-up-hands-down position. Until you learn to do that you will never look like Nate or Terry, because once the load comes on you do not have the physical strength to then get stacked - no one does.

 

My key for getting stacked before load is to sight down length of the rope through the second wake, while also making sure I can see my chest/hips in my lower peripheral vision. My "mantra" for focusing on achieving this position is "Hips First" - the underlying concept being that my hips must lead the gate turn-in, lead the wake crossing, and be connected to the handle before the load comes on. Being RFF, this will not be as hard to learn as you might think - your right hip will naturally lead the gate turn-in... if you learn to let it.

[Cam]

@swbca great that you have now posted a picture and most will notice your lack of connection but I am sure that @scoke will now give you the benefit of his knowledge and help you to get to where you want to be B)

[The_MS]

Take up Pickle Ball

[sodbuster88]

My first observation is the ski, but then in the pics above, I look at head position and line of sight. I’m the last person to give advice…but years ago I trained with a ball cap on, sun bill pulled way down to train me to watch the horizon. Took my attention off the wakes and the boat and really helped with body position through both wakes. I still revert back to that old cap at times.

[andjules]

When I look at that triptych, I see two main things in your pic (compared to Nate & Terry):

a) trace a line from the heel of the back foot, through the hip, to the left shoulder. Your hip is back, and your shoulder is forward (and your hands are higher).

b) frankly, they're leaning harder away from the pylon.

[Taynton]

I'm a beginner course skier however as a professional watersport coach I have many years of experience, that being said the biggest tip and the most effective technique for learning a skill behind a boat that I have found is to learn it on dry land first, get a mirror and a rope and start practicing the position you want to be in. The more time you spend on land learning the less time you will spend behind the boat learning that skill.

[ToddL]

Different words sometimes click for different people. Try these: Push your face as far away from your front foot as possible at the start of the load from the boat (start of the lean phase).

 

The other thing is the ski will go where the front foot is pointed. The front foot is pointed where the front knee is pointed. Even better if your belly button is pointed where you want the ski to go, too. Some people "lead with the hips" by thinking point the belly button. It's hard to feel like you have it pointed well if your hips are back. I guess you could combine these into lead with the belly button.

[aupatking]

I think @ToddL is on to something. As far as the 3 pictures go, notice the perspective: yours is straight down the line, while theirs must be from the observers seat. If the perspective were the same, I’m betting you could draw a line down the rope to their inside hip (left going to 1 ball).

[lpskier]

@ToddL Right on! My key is to “stretch the rope as much as I can.” Same idea as getting your face away from your feet. I find that thinking about this one key can correct a number of alignment issues. Excellent point.

[ToddL]

I'll add that the wrong time to get into stack is after the boat's load/pull is strong on the skier. That's too late. In my opinion there are two times within the course when the skier can regain or fix stack. The first happens at the last part of the edge-change. At this time, the skier should have little to no load on the rope and is casting out in preparation for arrival at the buoy. At this time, the skier should be thinking about rising up taller while lifting those hips (focus on the inside one) forward to meet the buoy first. The second time to regain or fix stack is more difficult and that one is at the end of the turn when the line is tight, but the boat's force is not fully on you. Again, this is where one would "post up", get tall, and put distance between the face and front foot.

 

The absolutely ideal place to always stand tall is everything outside the gates. Get up, get tall. Follow the boat tall. Initiate the lean out (counter cut prior to gates) tall. Glide tall. Initiate the turn in tall. After the exit gates, ride tall. Cut to set down tall. Glide to set down tall. Make tall feel normal.

[swbca]

@ToddL Good descriptions . . thank you

[harrison_343]

knee over your big toe

[ForrestGump]

I once had a coach ask me where I should be getting into position. I said when I'm getting ready to pull out. He then threw a wet glove at my head and said "No, you dumba$$. You just gave up 300' of practice. I want you getting into position tall over the ski, your hips squared, and your arms low and long as soon as the ski planes off after the pullup. Then if you dick it up in the course, I want you back in that exact same position when you come out of the gate, all the way til you sit down. Sooner or later, that 300' at the beginning and that 300' at the end starts to be reflected in your muscle memory. "

[ToddL]

Someone whom I trust said to a male skier: "Put your balls over the ball (of your front foot)." So, "balls over balls" is all I need to internally recite to get it right.

[swbca]

@ToddL Over my life time I have spent 10 days at 2 ski schools. Karen Roberge was one the coaches. If she had mentioned that I am sure I would be a much better skier. Thanks, it never too late the learn.