DangerBoy

You can also create art with them. This is my collage du Connelly...

I'm surprised that in all this discussion there's been virtually no mention of the Monza. I'm definitely about the furthest thing you can get from an expert on this subject but wasn't the Monza an important ski in its day?

@melissamahar What about the Kimball Streak I posted a few posts up? What era is it?

The woods used were mostly different types of mahogany but the light yellow bits are yellow cedar. Please add your ski to my Show off your Vintage Skis thread (https://forum.ballofspray.com/discussion/20995/show-off-your-vintage-skis). You can see my collection of Connellys plus a number of others in that thread.

I would definitely go with Glastron over Bayliner any day. Glaston hulls are top quality, Bayliner hulls do not have this reputation. In fact, I've heard they're cheaply made. I must confess I know very little about the GTD but I can see why it appeals to your wife from a practicality/family point of view. Lots of seating space in the GTD. What I can see in the specs is that it's got a 6 inch wider beam, a flatter hull (2 inch less deadrise) and weighs approximately 465 lbs more than the GTS. It doesn't have the SSV hull either and you know how highly I recommend that design. Great ride, great ski wake, planes at lower speeds than most other boats, fuel efficient, really stable, handles well and rides the rough stuff really well. With the GTS I know what type of overall and skiing performance you'll get and I know you'd be very pleased with that boat. I know nothing about how the GTD performs and skis so all bets are off there. The only way you're going to know how the two hulls compare is to try them both out and see what you think. It's quite possible the GTD will be great for skiing too, I just don't know. What I will say is that whichever of those 2 hulls you decide to go with, put 150 HP on it (preferably an ETec). I have the ETec 150 HO on my GT 180 and it's perfect for that hull. Great hole shot, power to spare and terrific fuel economy. Either get the ETec 150 or 135 HO as they are both pretty much the same motor. (The 135 HO is rumoured to be 150 hp). Don't get a 4 stroke! They're way bigger, 100+ lbs heavier and have a lot slower hole shot than a 2 stroke. Between those disadvantages and the fact they have over 130 more moving parts than a 2 stroke, a 4 stroke kills every advantage an outboard is supposed to have. And of all the 2 strokes that are available, IMO the ETec is the best in the class. Remakably, the ETecs even have lower emissions than all or most 4 stroke outboards. That is quite an engineering achievement. I LOVE MY ETEC!!* * Note here I'm talking about the basic ETec line. I've heard the ETec G2s are great as well but they're quite expensive.

"Give 'er!" or sometimes "Give 'er Wild Open!" Occasionally it's just "Engage!" (Ala Star Trek) but probably most of the time it's just, "Okay".

Just picked up this old Kimball fiberglass slalom ski for cheap. Perhaps @Melissakimball or someone else here could identify approximately what year or decade it's from?

@mpo I have a 2010 Glastron GT 180 which I love and is great for skiing. The hull on that boat is slightly different than the ones you're looking at as up until 2012 or 13 the 180s were 17' 1" long which means they should've been called 170s but for some reason Glastron decided to name them 180s which would imply an 18' boat. My GT 180 has the classic Glastron SSV (super stable Vee) hull with a 20 degree deadrise. Glastron came up with the SSV hull design back in the 1980s and has not strayed away from it because it's a fantastic design and there has been no reason to stray away from it. The SSV is extremely stable, efficient and has a great ride even in very rough water. At the same time, it has a small wake that's soft and has a nice shape that makes it great for slalom skiing. One of the guys I ski with has an 18' Larson OB hull which we used to ski behind every other day and on the days in between we used to ski behind my old boat. Now that I have the Glastron, we only ski behind my boat and never ski behind his Larson because the wake is so much better behind my Glastron. With the Larson, you have to prepare yourself mentally as you approach the wake because you know it's going to jar and rock you and throw you off a little when you cross it. With the Glastron, the wake is so smooth and easy to cross you don't ever think about it as you approach and cross it which allows you to remain 100% focused on setting up for the next turn. Please note that I do strongly recommend trimming the engine up about half way after you've gotten the skier up out of the water to flatten and smooth out the wake to the best it can be. AFAIK, the models you're looking at are slightly longer than mine, actually being closer to 18' than 17'. I don't think you can go wrong with either hull but based on my experience, I would recommend the one with the 20 degree deadrise vs the one with 18 degree just because it will be a smoother riding boat in rough water than the flatter hull but will still give you a great wake for slalom skiing. While I'm here, I will also recommend that you pair the Glastron with an Evinrude ETec outboard if you can. They're fantastic motors and the best outboards made IMO. If you want to read about all the things I love about the ETec, check out this old thread of mine: /forum#/discussion/comment/334418

I concur that for LFF, rotating the rear boot clockwise is advisable - at least for some people. I rotate mine as far as it can go and it works great for me. It's more comfortable and feels like it's a more natural/ergonomic and stable stance to be in and for me at least it's easier on my right hip and knee (LFF). To answer your question @Dockoelboto, I think it will help your offside (I actually think it helps me turn better on both sides). It's definitely worth giving a try!

Congratulations indeed, @adamhcaldwell ! All hail King Slaloman!!

@rico That first shot is absolutely stunning! Gorgeous image.

Huh. On another Denali related thread I said it will be interesting to see if any of the other ski companies uses Denali's one length/many widths sizing philosophy on at least some new ski models and I got a rolling panda for pondering the liklihood of scenarios that seemed far-fetched to some. Admittedly, I wondered out loud if some other things might also come to pass one day so maybe it was those wonderings and not the one related to the question asked in this thread that garnered me the rare and coveted rolling panda. ;) My non-expert/non-industry insider guess is that at least some of the ski companies will at least look at the idea and maybe even one or two might go as far as developing some prototypes following that design philosophy to test out. If any companies do actually put out some models using that sizing philosophy, my guess is that it will be just one or two models at first. Time and results will then tell if the idea takes over and becomes the way all slalom ski models are made or if it's only applied to certain models or not used at all by anyone other than Denali.

@B_S , @Horton I do not see what is so ridiculous/crazy about wondering if perhaps other ski companies may look at and adopt the Denali C-75 one length/multiple width ski design philosophy for at least some new models of their skis. It's a very interesting departure from the status quo and no doubt has some tangible advantages over the conventional one width/several lengths philosphy that has pervaded the industry's way of thinking for pretty much ever. You can panda me all you want but I believe other companies are going to at least look at doing that with some future ski models and I think it's interesting to wonder if any of them will actually adopt that concept on at least some future ski models/lines. If you think it's crazy to wonder that then please tell me why. I also don't think it's crazy to wonder if perhaps someday one or more of the bigger ski companies may want to own or licence some of the innovations the Denali boys (or SkiJay for that matter) have brought to market and patented (e.g. various aspects of their fin designs), IF those innovations prove to be very successful and IF they point the way to where future innovation and performance gains can come from. There's really so little difference between the skis each of the companies put out from company to company and year to year, they all must be hungry to find any idea/innovation that can give them a substantial leg up on their competitors. Well, now Denali and SkiJay have really shaken things up or at least raised some eyebrows with some radical new ideas and designs. It remains to be seen how much of a game changer any of those innovations will turn out to be but what I see is those innovations potentially providing fertile ground for future exploration in fin and ski design and development. Does anyone want to take the opposite point of view on that and argue it? I then respectfully ask, if it is possible that Denali and/or Skijay have patented something that may have an important role in some aspect of future ski/fin design innovation (I'm assuming they've applied for some patents here - please correct me if I'm wrong), then is it crazy to wonder if instead of paying to licence something Denali (or SkiJay for that matter) has patented, the interested ski company may instead choose to try and buy Denali or WhisperFin outright and get everything? I know waterski companies don't have a lot of money but stuff like that happens all the time in many other industries. Small start-ups with good ideas get bought out by bigger more established companies every day. All I said is it will be interesting so see if any of these things will happen. I didn't make any sort of judgement on how likely any of them are to happen. I just wondered out loud if any of those things might happen and said it's an interesting thing to ponder. Is it ridiculous to think like that?

It'll be interesting to see if any of the other ski manufacturers adopt the Denali sizing model for any of their next models. I'm also interested to see if at any point, any of the bigger companies ever offer to buy Denali out in order to get their talent, designs and/or patents. Of course, such offers would likely be kept confidential so if something like that did happen the only way we'd ever hear about it is either through rumors or an official announcement if the offer is accepted by Denali.

@Spitfire Sorry to hear that you just missed out on it. I've sent you a PM on a possible course of action you might take to turn the situation in your favor.

I second the recommendation on Masterline K-Palms. Very close fitting, great grip and extremely durable.

@foxriverat Yeah, at that price you'd think it would've sold by now. There has been a few offers made though. My guess is the seller won't go down much off the asking price. Still, at $190... Pretty good deal. If someone here buys it, let us know!

There's a cheap 69" Carbon Omni on eBay right now. Last I saw it was at about $118.50 with 22 hrs left. Snipe the bid in the last few seconds and maybe you get it real cheap. https://ebay.com/itm/1-HO-Carbon-Omni-Water-ski-69BWF/401858645057

Not sure what year. Has a scratch and a small ding on the top but is new and unused. $190 USD obo. Good deal for somebody. Hope someone here gets it. https://ebay.ca/itm/Radar-Graphite-Senate-Slalom-Waterski-65inch-NEW-scratch/401856614661

Simply incredible. Such great skiers. I'm in awe. :o

Well done!

@giantjoe There's a 69 HO Carbon Omni BWF cheap on eBay right now. https://ebay.com/itm/1-HO-Carbon-Omni-Water-ski-69BWF/401858645057 That would be an excellent choice for you, depending on what you can get it for.

There's a 69" HO Carbon Omni BWF cheap on eBay right now. https://ebay.com/itm/1-HO-Carbon-Omni-Water-ski-69BWF/401858645057 I think that would be an excellent choice for him, depending on what you can get it for.

I'm LFF and angle my rear binding as much as I can to the right. (If the tip of the ski is north, I make the rear binding go from SW to NE as much as I can. Don't know how much that helps but it feels more natural and comfortable and that's good enough for me.

@MS That was a good call and I'm glad I listened to you. It took a little while before we finally figured each other out but I really like the ski. Pretty easy transition from the Monza but it feels like it's a more capable ski. Both skis are capable of doing things well beyond my ability though so it's not like I could ever push either of them to anywhere near their limits but the V-type suits me fine and it seems not to have one particular quirk the Monza had (and that I don't miss ). I think the V-Type and I will be dance partners for many years to come. Thanks again for offering your advice!