Are we allowed to talk about Jump?

[ToddL]

My son (11yo B2, 75lbs, 4'8") wants to start jumping. Mom and I used to get dragged over the ramp for the sake of collegiate team scores, but we never really were jumpers. So, we are pretty clueless about getting a youth started out correctly with appropriate gear.

 

Some questions:

1. What size skis are appropriate for a boy that size?

FYI - I've been told that the double-wrap, pro wiley's bindings are too much for a young jumper.

 

2. What type of bindings are appropriate?

Are 72" Connelly HC800's too big/heavy?

 

3. Are there any good articles about jumping fundamentals out there?

 

He is riding them and cutting back an forth, but I have no idea if his body position is correct or not. I told him, stay stacked and on the balls of your feet, head up, elbows in... I guess I could take some video or something.

 

Any thoughts are appreciated.

 

[jimbrake]

I say "yes" we may talk about jump. For a kid starting out you can go with old school jumpers in the 68 to 72 inch range. Just well-fitting rubber bindings like slalom Wileys will be fine for how. Have you pulled him over the ramp at all yet? My son is B2 also and started last year before regionals. A couple of angled pulls over the corner just so they can feel what the ramp surface feels like on their skis, then some slow speed "plop" overs to start working on their balanced position on the ramp. The old "knees, trees, freeze" is still valid. What you told him sounds good, just add handle low and keep it there in the air, vision down the lake. Once he is comfortable and balanced on the plops, then you can have him start edging into the base and gradually move the speed up. Get coaching early and often to stay safe.

[kfennell]

You mean you can go off the side first so its less scary? WTF why didn't someone tell me that! I dont think I slept for 3 days before going off the jump this weekend!

[klindy]

haha...go off the corner first is traditional jump coaching. However it would be difficult to angle the boat enough at your place to make that work. The goal is to drive at approx a 45 degree angle to the ramp and let the skier just 'feel' the ramp by going over the corner. Go too high up the ramp and the left ski is much higher (and on the ramp longer) than the right which can make landings odd. So just let them get a feel for the hard, wet-ice on wet-ice surface a time or two then go for the gold.

[jimbrake]

@kfennell. If you're a little kid, yes, you get to go over the corner. If you're 18 and in college (or not), you go over the top.

 

I went to Suyderhoud's for the first time in '76 and he pulled me over the top the first time and by the third day he had me doing a 3/4 cut. I went home and started doing mad cuts at the ramp in a howling tailwind. I made it four seasons before I completely shredded my right knee. No one should go about it the way I did.

[kfennell]

Since we are on topic of jumping, i have two questions.

1. How long till I stop being like literally terrified to the point that it is barely fun.

2. I have been told to go over with my arms locked straight but I am definately pulling them in as I come off the jump, why can I not go over with my elbows pushed against my sides?

 

Thanks!

[elr]

@ToddL - Bennetts has a wonderful program for jumpers like your son - thats how my son started. You could also check out what the Ski Bees are doing, they seem to get the young ones off to a good start.

[cwillygood]

I know people have had terrible experiences but Goodman makes awesome jumpers designed for little kids, yes they will be more than the old school ones and you might have to wait a while but there awesome

[Kelvin]

Bring him over to Katy. We have a mini jump just like the one at Bennett's. A few times over the small one and he will be ready for the big one.

[Chef23]

@ToddL for your son an old pair of 72s will work fine to get started. I agree with @cwillygood that the skis Goodman makes for kids are better but they are more money. My neighbor just got a pair of 78" Goodmans for his girls who are about the same size as your son and they are awesome skis.

 

If you have a pair of 72s around they will work that is what my son is on.

 

The position isn't really stacked like on a slalom ski. It is more weight on balls of feet and knees over toes. My son tends to ride the jumpers more like a slalom ski and that is a problem at the ramp.

 

If you live near @Kelvin and can get him over the mini ramp that would be awesome. My son started when he was younger than your son but about the same size on the mini-ramp at Coble's Ski School and after he landed 5 in a row on the mini-ramp they let him go over the big jump and he landed 1 of his first 3.

[usaski1]

there's nothing that really gets my blood pumpin like jumpin'! Sorry to thread jack, but just thought you mike like to see this. I've been disabled my entire life, but still launch off the ramp.

 

[Jody_Seal]

I cant say enough Ride the skis ! Youngsters when they start jumping commonly just strap em on and try and learn how to jump at their parents misguided guidence , well not such a good 'idea as these kids probably have not had two skis on for many years. This also goes for older skiers wanting to learn how to jump. getting good control and skiing position is for-most before going over the ramp. When the skier is ready to take that first leap it is good to have a well seasoned jumper to coach them through it. after that again ride the skis more than go over the ramp.

If they decide it is something they want to get better at then get them good professional coaching.

 

Jody Seal:

Father of three time national jump champion Stephen "El Torro" Seal And W-1 jump sensation Monica "Dana California" Seal.

Been their, got the "T" shirts!!!

[Horton]

I want to go on the record - "I have not read a word of this".

 

Maybe Jody is in charge of BOS Jump

[Ham_Wallace]

Jody is correct. Time on the skis is KEY! It is impossible to clock in quality time on a private slalom pond. It is time for rivers, big lakes and open water.ride the skis, launch over the wakes, learn to edge and make plenty of turns. Long jump pulls on a 75' rope are much more effort than short slalom pulls that are 8/10's of a second. Once Junior can clear BOTH wakes on the jump skis, then, it's time to go to the "big red wedge"! DO NOT tell him the day before he gets to go over it. He won't sleep the night before. (Still addicted after 47 years of jumping)

[ForrestGump]

When I was learning, Charles told when I could run the slalom course at 34mph on my 90 inchers, then I had enough control to go over the ramp. It took me half the summer to get there, but it was a blast.

[ToddL]

This is all great!!!! @jody seal = BOSJ

 

Mark ( @usaski1 ) - Loved the video!

 

Matt has been riding them a lot. He is so pumped to learn about the mini ramp at Lakes of Katy! Thanks, @Kelvin

 

I need to invest in some wiley slalom bindings for him. The adult Lrg Pro Wraps are just sloppy big and have released once during a funky turn around 6-ball (yes, I mentioned a slalom course, so maybe @Horton will read this some). Matt has been skiing around at about 24.9 MPH and at 15 off, simply because he likes to take a jump ride right after his slalom set. I'll start putting him on the jump line, though.

 

BTW, by "stacked", I meant - ankles bent, knees in front of ankles, hips over ankles, shoulders over hips, head up. I did talk to him about being on the balls of his feet. He giggled and said, ...balls..." Yep... I do know that when the time comes to hit the ramp, there are some keys to success: Knees, Trees, and Freeze; Lean forward into the jamp; balls of the feet; head up; stay strong on the ramp and in the air; handle pushed down low with straight arms; head up in the air; head up in the landing; feel it vs. see it.

 

 

[klindy]

Two other cues that often work. To "lean into the ramp" think about going up a set of stairs. If you go up the stairs on your heels you'll fall backwards. Natually you "lean into" the stairs to maintain your balance. The natural reaction seeing that Big Red wall headed toward you is to lean back to 'take' the hit. Do that and you'll fall backwards - every time!

 

For body position all you've said sounds pretty good. Another way to 'get the feel' for your body position on the ramp is to stand about 2 feet from a wall (or post) looking down the length of the wall left shoulder facing the wall. Feet shoulder width apart handle in hand like you'd be at the ramp (left handed baseball bat grip). Now, while keeping your upper body basically vertical and head up, lean over to the wall using your hips and knees, weight on the balls of your feet. If you can maintain that kind of "edge" into the ramp (assuming we're past the basic plop jumps), you're in good body position.

[elr]

My two son's jump experiences were vastly different and I attribute that to the fact that my younger son (good times) was instructed by folks that coach beginner jumpers all of the time, and my older son (doesn't want to do it) was coached by well meaning people. For us it was more than just the availability of the mini-ramp. It was learning to ride the skis well with proper form. It was learning the proper path for a plopper - very different, before even going over the mini-ramp. When I saw how my younger son was coached and his safe results I wished I had put my older son through the program. If my older son ever gets interested again I'll put him in a proper program.

[eleeski]

Jump coaching matters more in jump than any other discipline! I had terrible jump coaching when I started - I not only suck at jumping but it isn't that much fun for me. Kirk has had great coaching (thanks Connie and Terry) and he is quite skilled and has fun with it. Plus he has not been injured jumping.

 

Eric

[kfennell]

How soon should I be looking at getting coaching, Lori kinda owes me some coaching, so I am wondering if I should be using that now when I am just plopping and only have landed once?

[Brian_M]

AND when going over the full ramp for the first time, tell your kids NOT to let go of the rope 10ft in front of the jump. This is a pic of my sister circa '89.

 

*Don't worry, I made sure she was okay...right after I got a few pics!

[ToddL]

@elr - who coached your younger son / where?

[elr]

@ToddL - the staff at Bennetts, Jay oversaw everything.

 

@kfennell - I would go to Lori (IIRC she was staff at Bennetts) as early/often as possible.

[kfennell]

@elr I think more important then staff at Bennets is that she is Freddie's sister :)

[elr]

@kfennell - Freddie's sister + staff at Bennetts (nothing but praise for their beginner program) is hard to beat for a jumper starting out.

[gregte]

Fluid Ski has the best learning program out there IMO. Scot Ellis will actually ride over the jump with first time jumpers, talking to them the whole way and even hold on with one hand to help the balance. My son (8 yrs old) did it with him last year and loved it. He was sticking landings by himself over the top first day on jumpers.

[6balls]

I rode jumpers a lot as a kid for fun cutting hard and popping some serious air off the wakes. Never jumped until in college forced into it at regionals as one of our jumpers got hurt. Landed no problem...I think it speaks to the "ride the skis" advice mentioned above. I hammed it up on the way to the jump popping off the out of the hole roller, picking up my skis and slapping them down, taking a big counter cut...then coasted slowly across the wake, stood there frozen and went 35 ft.

[RichardDoane]

I learned at age 40, it's taken 8 seasons, but 3 more feet and I'm in the century club !

[Turtle]

Ham Wallace...I think we knew each other back in the day.. Anyway, the name sounds familiar.

Ron Trobaugh here. I skied out of Ohio in the 60's.

[klindy]

@richarddoane‌ wait later..... :)

[ToddL]

Wow... an old thread bubbles up to the top. Timely, though. My son finally went off the ramp, sort of. Now, he is asking when he can get back to the lake to go over the top.

[RichardDoane]

@toddl - make sure your son learns to "pass" if/when things don't feel right when heading for the ramp