1990-2000s Mastercraft and Nautique Guide?

[ncskier]

I am thinking about buying a boat and am wondering if some of you can give me some pointers as to which ski nautiques and mastercrafts have the best wakes and which ones to stay away from. I mostly slalom and my best right now is 15 off at 32mph (so not that great). I am looking for a boat that is great at all speeds and is relatively cheep, basically a slalom course mule. I also mess around with the trick ski and kneeboard occasionally.

[Orlando76]

I'm a Correct Craft guy so I would say a 90-96 Ski Nautique would be the lower priced tug to start with. 93 and later gets you into a composite boat. 97-2001 ski nautique Is a world class slalom wake and still very hard to beat with a 2015 model boat and those are starting to be found in the $10k range. Mastercraft has good boats from that era but I think a few models were hit and miss, I'm not certain, same with Malibu.

I ski my '93 and a 2000 Ski nautique at 15 off 32 mph regularly and I feel the performance in the two are very close.

[rodltg2]

Just find a 98-2000 ski Nautique and don't look back !

[ncskier]

@Orlando76 I have skied behind a 1991 SKi Nautique and liked it pretty well. What year did nautique stop putting wood stringers in their boats and what is a composite boat? Also what changes occurred after 2001?

[wtrskior]

Nautique went wood free for the 93 model year IIRC

[TallSkinnyGuy]

The 91-94 Mastercraft has what is often considered as one of the best wakes ever. The 94 has EFI standard, so that is a very desired year. Some 93s were upgraded to the LT1 engine which also is EFI. This hull is also known for having more spray than desired at 35 off and shorter (particularly in a headwind), but it doesn't really affect those of us at longer lines.

 

The 95-97 Mastercraft hull dramatically reduced the spray issue but got slightly taller wakes as a result. I ski behind a few different boats including my own 97 Mastercraft 190 and a friend's 98 Ski Nautique. At 32 mph our wakes are very similar. I just skied this morning behind the Nautique at 34 mph 15 off and the Nautique wake is indeed a little better than mine. That TSC1 hull with the GT-40 engine is pretty hard to beat for a relatively low cost slalom tug.

 

I also ski behind an early 80s Nautique and early 80s Malibu skier. I would not even consider those boats for a slalom boat. The 90s boats are way better in my experience and by the mid 90s you are getting no wood stringers and EFI engines.

 

I have heard Nautique did away with wood stringers in 93, but I'm not sure about that. MC got rid of the wood back in the early 80s.

[Onside135]

@rodltg2…Curious why you did not include 1997 and 2001 model Nautiques?

[ncskier]

@TallSkinnyGuy how about the 98-2000 mastercrafts?

[Onside135]

@ncskier…some discussion here...

 

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/archive/index.php/t-49232.html

[TallSkinnyGuy]

The 98-2000 MCs are not well regarded by many (due to some quality, driveability and wake issues). I would definitely give it a thorough inspection and an on-water ski test before buying one of those years. But if you find a well-kept 97-2001 SN, no need to do a ski test behind it as that is a fantastic ski wake.

[9400]

Do not buy a 1998 Mastercraft unless the hull has been severely modified by someone who knows what they are doing. I have seen some of the best drivers put them on shore and wakes are terrible. I think the 99s and 00s are better but they pretty much had to be. 2001 is when they seemed to have gotten back on track.

[TNh2oskier]

Response LX would also be a solid choice. 99' and newer had the trunk, most all will be fuel injected.

[jhughes]

Ski Nautique:

 

1990-1996 NWZ hull, all great wakes/driving/tracking/spray

1990 NWZ Hull introduction, has unique reverse italic gradient side graphics that look really cool

1991 Switched to trapezoidal vs. fin shaped tracking fins

1992 Windshield wing sections elongated

1993 Composite stringers, last year of the stripe/graphics of the 90-93 boats, purple avail that year

1994 Deck update, graphics update, interior skins update, new rounded windshield

1995 GT40 introduced

1996 New Teleflex throttle, clamshell motor box, FCC introduced on GT40

 

1997-2002 TSC1 Hull (in 2002 only avail in SNOB configuration)

1997 TSC hull introduction

1998 Reverse swing tach introduced, new motorbox introduced, new ECM programming for GT40 I believe to resolve idle flare and lean running issues for some

1999 Dash area no longer painted black, adjustable trim tab introduced on rudder, in some cases last year of removable rear seat

2000 N-swoosh graphics introduced (love it or hate it), redesigned helm area, teleflex gauges, pushbutton dash (which is still amazing to this day), options for rear storage available which moves gas tank to underneath seat. 75th anniversary stickers/decals

2001 No major changes from 2000 model.

2002 Introduction of TSC2 hull/redesign for Ski Nautique but SNOB remains as a TSC1 boat with updated graphics.

 

Can't go wrong on any of these years if you ask me, it's all about your budget and the condition of the boats that you're looking for.

 

As for Malibus, the 1998.5+ Response/RLX with the trunk and most importantly diamond cut hull is a pretty solid boat for this era as well but I'm not in love with the ergonomics and driver sight lines on these boats. IMO Malibu really started hitting their stride fit and finish-wise in about 2001+ with the updated dash/skins and drip mold decals and their 2003-06 RLXi is a terrific boat. The 99-04 Sunsetter LXi is also a great boat.

 

Seems like everybody has the MCs down pretty well.

[ncskier]

thanks for the imput everyone. I am definitely no rush to buy a boat right now, I just want to be informed. I will probably look for a nautique or early mastercraft. I have skied behind a 2003 malibu and was not impressed and just from riding on their wake boarding boats I have to say their build quality seems sub-par.

[PBD]

@jhughes great list but I'm pretty sure the GT-40 was available in 1994 for the Nautique lineup. I've got one in my 1994

[Chris Taylor]

1992+ Supra Comp

[Orlando76]

@PBD I think Joel is right. I believe the GT40 debuted in 94 but only in a Sport Nautique.

[Wish]

For wakes at all line lengths and speeds, there is none better then the 1997 SN.

[foxriverat]

@Chris Taylor I wish

[crashman]

@ncskier I ski regularly behind both TSC 1 and 2 hulls and at -15 32 mph I can't tell any noticeable difference between them. I've liked my TSC 1 as well or better than the newer boats I've skied behind. It's hard to lose much money on them since they have such a loyal following.

[escmanaze]

I have a TSC1 hull from 97 and I love it. I'm in the exact same situation as you with skiing. I only bought what I bought for the sake of the open bow. If you don't require that, then the cheapest way to go would be to look around (for a long time probably) for a fuel injected pre-1995 ps190. That Supra idea above would work too, but you'll look even longer for one of those.

 

I really think you should be able to get into a 1994 ps190 for right around 10k plus or minus depending on condition. The main drawback to that boat is the spray, but if you are still at -15 32mph like me, then spray won't really be your concern for quite a while.

 

Is that roughly the price range you are looking for?

[DooSPX]

@TallSkinnyGuy MC switched to NO wood in 84 production boats. But actually some later built 83's also had no wood. 91-94 MC Prostar 190, as said is regarded as one of the best wakes EVER. The spray can be an issue. In my experience, -35 off can sometimes get some spray, but most often it's beyond that. You can also reduce the spray a bit by getting as much weight as possible out of the back. I already relocated my battery, but I have seen a little difference in spray by backseat vs no backseat and fuel load. I am anal though...

[6balls]

'91-'94 MC look for EFI.

'97 and newer Nautique with GT-40.

 

At the lines you ski and trying to be price conscious...you will love either of these boats. The TSC Nautique is better at shortline due to spray, tracks a bit better regardless of line, and the driver ergonomics and sight lines are better. Stupid little stuff like the TSC seats are cushier, too, but have to get used to her backing left. Other cool thing about the bubble butt TSC and it's tapered platform is that you REALLY have to work to get a rope hung up back there on the rub rail or corner of the platform idling around a skier...sometimes that little stuff matters on joy of ownership. There is also an inline filter in the TSC water intake that spares your impeller of ingested weeds and debris...again a nice little touch that matters to swampy skiers like me.

[escmanaze]

That is a good point 6 balls, I think sometimes I forget skiing behind my buddy's old prostar and I take for granted that the rope NEVER hangs. I didn't even know about the filter, but was amazed last time I looked at the impeller at how good of condition it was in after not replacing it for a while, even though I ski in super swamp conditions. So does that mean I need to change some filter some time soon?

 

For the record, I don't have the GT-40. I'm sure it would be nice, but honestly, I'm ok without it. It is still EFI, so I don't have to sweat the elevation changes here in Utah, which is what I really cared about. I'm sure the GT-40 would be great, but if you find the right boat in every other way that has a pro-ski like mine, still give it a ski and a drive to see if it is something you can overlook.

[6balls]

@escmanaze it's a wire mesh filter in a plastic cup on the right rear of the block if facing rearward. Just screw off the cup (don't lose the o-ring), pull the cylindrical wire filter and inspect. Dump it and swoosh it around in the lake water til clear and replace.

We have so much algae at the swamp this year we do it more than once per ski session and it takes place as soon as the water temp guage rises. Without it this year...my guess is we would be through countless impellers.

[DooSPX]

EFI is nice, but I will tell you, my carbed 351 with a properly tuned Holley 4160 starts every time with a flick of the key. If the boat sits for over a week, I pump it about 4 times and boom, she's purring away. EFI if you live at altitude or up north may be better, for FL where I boat year around, doesn't matter.

[akale15]

@ncskier This has been a good read. I am too, not quite ready in the market for a boat but hope to be soon and will be looking into many of the above mentioned boats....

[escmanaze]

Here is one that just came up here in Utah that is a perfect example of the 94 PS190 that is right around $10k like I mentioned above. They don't come up often with the perfect year, perfect model, and well taken care of like this one, but when they do, I just pray they get snatched up by a baller instead of a tuber.

 

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=35842142&cat=147&lpid=&search=mastercraft&ad_cid=8

[swc5150]

@escmanaze

That Utah boat is not a '94. It's actually a much rarer '93 Stars & Stripes, with the graphics removed. They also mention the 285hp (Ford), which was no longer available in '94. Seems strange that the owner doesn't know what he has? Decent price though.

[The_MS]

The 94 MC is a good boat but it is not even in the same league as the 97-2000 196.

[6balls]

@swc5150 often a scam in those cases, especially if priced a bit too low. Ran into lots of that crap helping my brother source a boat a few years ago.

[Onside135]

@MS...agreed, but why not the 2001 year model. No difference from the 2000 year model in hull/graphics/options/etc...same boat.

[escmanaze]

Yeah, I think you guys might be on to something. That boat has already been taken off the website, so it either got snatched up just that quick, or it really was a scam.

[The_MS]

@Onside135 I guess I should have stated all 196 from 97-2009

[Filipo12]

@6balls - any idea what sized wire mesh is used when it comes to this filter that has to be cleaned out? Is this a woven wire mesh - something similar to the 10 x 10 wire mesh seen here: bwire.com

 

Perhaps the best approach may be to replace the wire mesh with something that is not quite as fine. The less fine the wire mesh is, the less gunk and algae and other garbage will get caught up and cause these problems in the future.

 

Will not be an easy job to replace the mesh - but in the long term this could really help you out.

[Andre]

If you use smaller mesh,the gunk will go to the fuel pump...

[Filipo12]

Smaller as in tighter? Or smaller wire diameter?

 

What I am saying is that it is worth looking into different options when it comes to the size of the openings in the wire mesh of the filter.

[Andre]

Sorry Filipo,i meant if you use less fine mesh the gunk will go to the fuel pump.

Weird that the fuel filter is after the fuel pump on those years MC.

By the way,welcome to BOS!!!

[Filipo12]

Thank You - glad to be here and thanks for your input on this topic - I will look into it a bit further and see what sized mesh is used in others and then report back! Thanks again for the welcome.

[CBR51]

I am looking for a 99-01 Nautique. From what I have been reading they moved the gas tank a bit and put a storage locker in the back for 2000/2001 Did that change the slalom wakes from a 99? I would think they would have changed a bit ( better or worse). I am using it for slalom only and would like to make sure I get the one with best wakes. I have never seen any comments on this change. Can someone please explain to me the difference. Thanks

[Onside135]

I'm fairly sure that there are no hull or fuel tank differences between '97-'01 models. There was also no storage added until '02. The only significant difference in the years you are asking about (TSC 1 hulls) are graphics, and some dashboard gauge changes.

[CBR51]

Ok. Thanks. I know that the hull changed in 02 to TSC-2 hull and added gull wing storage. But I thought that in 2000 and 2001 the rear seat back rest slid up and down and there was a bit of storage, because they moved gas tank to lying flat on floor like the TSC-2 and 3. I don't think you can remove rear seats in 2000 and 01 just middle cushin ? Unlike 97-99

[Orlando76]

there is storage in 00/01 just like you described. Lift up the back rest and voila. Rear seat can't come out (reasonably) just the middle cushion.

[6balls]

Beg to differ. I have a 2000 and my back seat is completely out. Backrest was a single piece that slid up and out. The entire base comes up as well including the center cushion. If you leave the seat in the center cushion can be flipped over to create a step to the swim platform.

2002 picked up the trunk storage behind the seats accessible via hinged, vinyl padded doors.

As a ski tug unless I could get a TSC3 with ZO or had a mind to convert a TSC2 to ZO...I would go TSC1. Then you can pull the seat and don't have to climb over anything significant (the padded storage trunk) to get to the platform.

This is splitting hairs...they all ski and drive great. Dream boat one day is a 6.0 TSC 196 with ZO just lacking funds right now.

[Jody_Seal]

Yes 2000 and 01 had a crappy IL designed storage compartment that required a flat fuel tank that encroached into the back area of the boat. It did not effect the ski ability however made it one of the worst in serviceability and repair of of any componets below the tank..don't be afraid of it just be aware that changing out the steering cable will encompass about twice as much time then that of a 97-99.

[CBR51]

That's great guys. Thanks a lot for all your comments. I think I will try my best for a 99. I like the adjustable rudder

[BCM]

@CBR51 - I just picked up a 98 196, my ski partner as a 99. Darn near identical, they have the adjustable rudder. I have a rebuilt steering system. Mine drives night and day better. My point, adjustable rudders are nice, but a questionable steering cable negates any benefit. The adjustable rudder can be purchased for a 97 or 98 for about $600. I was thinking about swapping mine out but am happy with the way it drives.

[6balls]

My buddy has a 97 and mine is a 2000. His drives like crap. He has no adjustable rudder, needs a new steering cable and probably grease packing at the rudder.

 

When I bought mine I put in a cable and had the grease repacked and it drives like a dream with the adjustable rudder.

[Orlando76]

Swap the rudder if you find a boat you like but doesn't have the tune able rudder, all 196's are interchangeable. Orrind the edge off the older style and I bet you'll be happy if preload is what you're looking for.

 

My buddy has a 2000 SN, tune able rudder set neutral, drove pretty good. I bought my 93SN, standard 11a? rudder it drove good but not nearly as good as the 2000 and obviously not as good as the 07 SN I ski, neutral rudder. I changed the cable and helm in my 93 to the newer style and greased everything. It is now unarguably the best steering boat of the group and I never realized it but with the new cable I found out my rudder was shaved. I think from now on I'll always have the steering loaded, whether with the trim tab or by grinding it.

[CBR51]

Ok great, sounds like steering cable can be a problem. And yes for $600. I would take a good deal on 97-98 and just buy the tunable rudder.