-28 to -32

[cragginshred]

What would you guys say is the main difference between -28 and getting into -32 for the first time and how would you coach someone moving into this loop?

 

Also as I got more consistent at making -28's I have opted Not to slow the boat down at all, however -28 still feels fast. Who would recommend taking .5 rpm's off for -32?

[TEL]

Let me know what ends up working for you. next year I will be working on -32

[DefectiveDave]

-32 feels faster because you take a narrower approach to the ball. You also generate more slack and fall further behind when you make mistakes, so proper handle control and stack become even more important. I think they feel very similar, but -32 is just less forgiving.

[RazorRoss3]

don't slow the boat if you are running 70% or better in my opinion. -28 is the first line where the rope is starting to move up the boat rather than largely side to side, this means you need to pay more attention to your load levels, edge change timing, and handle control. Those three things are largely dependent on each other in my experience.

 

Load: if you dig in too hard and fall away from the boat you will get unloaded up and at the buoy off the second wake and it will make it very difficult if not impossible to edge change smoothly through the wakes or control your handle out to the buoy, think about pulling across with your head and shoulders level and open down course.

 

edge change: after doing the first piece like that, you want to start screaming at yourself to "get the f### off of it". "it" being the pull, as the line comes in you pull with the same intensity but it will be for a shorter time duration. try and be coming up as you approach the wakes and move into the other edge no later than the second white wash.

 

handle control: after/during both of the above, be sure to be keeping your handle connected to you. the moment you let your hips separate from the handle the boat will take you up and at the buoy.

 

If you can manage your load, direction, and handle -28 and -32 will become a lot easier. Another big piece is to be high on your gate, even if in the short term you miss a few, the extra height early makes those lines a lot easier.

[disland]

@RazorRoss3

 

only all that?, no problem lol

[RazorRoss3]

@disland, if it was easy wouldn't we call it wake boarding?

[A_B]

More intense attack into the wakes and get off it on the second wake. Trust your work and ride it out. Don't try to get your body outside the buoy line. Those are the biggest things I see when people hit green.

 

Remember - get mean at the green.

[Lovell]

I'm out for the rest of season injured, but I got real consistent at -28 this year and consistently to 4 or 5 ball at -32, before going down injured. I wouldn't slow the boat down. Just work on technique and ski a lot of sets. 4 per week if possible.

[cragginshred]

@RazorRoss3 sounds an awful lot like what I am working on to get -28 dialed in.

Just more of the same with a greater 'lean angle' ratio!

 

Regarding the comment of head and shoulders level down course -is this to promote leaning (properly stacked) as opposed to pulling ?

[ToddL]

+1 to @RazorRoss3 comments.

 

I'll add that your have to ski with some confidence. Confidence comes from familiarity and successes (even if measured in terms of # of times I got to 3-ball). So, you have to practice skiing the new line length enough to stop thinking that is it something foreign.

 

For example, ski a whole set at -32. Don't worry how many buoys you get. Just work on a high/wide gate and clean 1-ball and 2-ball. If you can't get around 3, try to keep turning and crossing even if narrow/late. Gain familiarity with the feel/whip and sight lines. Eventually, you will stop thinking, "oh my, this is -32" and start thinking "load, direction, and handle control". When that happens, the pass will be run.

[RazorRoss3]

@cragginshred, yes and no. You cannot humanly win a game of tug-of-war with the boat, so leaning away is counter productive, not to mention you aren't trying to go away, you are trying to go across. But level and open shoulders does a few things.

 

It keeps you from creating load, load is bad, what gets loaded must get unloaded and that usually sends you into the buoy too hot.

 

It also keep you balanced, if you are out at the buoy and focus on staying tall, head and shoulders level, you will have better balance and the ski will come around quicker with more angle, and you will already be in good pulling position. Staying tall and level and moving across with good handle control is key. As someone who has a couple powerlifting awards and records I can say with certainty that you can't fight the boat or the green line. Work with them to generate your speed between the buoy and wake and ride the boats speed out to the buoy.

 

-32 is a lot like -28, the reaction time just needs to be a little quicker. But if you focus on level shoulders and early edge change at -28 it will make it easier and will translate to -32

[Bruce_Butterfield]

Get wide on the gates. Thats nearly a universal issue. 28 and longer people can get away with narrower pullout, but it makes 32 and shorter really difficult.

[ToddL]

@RazorRoss3 said, "you aren't trying to go away, you are trying to go across"

Love this!

[Chef23]

If you are running 28 consistently I am with @Bruce_Butterfield you likely need to get wider on your gates. You should be uncomfortably high on the boat for your gate. That will enable you to do what @A_B said and be more intense in to the wakes. If you don't have the width at the gates you need to pull long into 1 ball and that messes everything up.

[Lovell]

The counterintuitive psychological issue for me at that line length is not rushing. You need to have high intensity and work hard, but you need to be physically aggressive in the right spots. I get impatient on the harder passes and pull early sometimes which is a killer at -32. I focus on letting he ski finish the turn get the outside shoulder back and try to look across the bow of the boat towards the next bouy. Front foot pressure on the gate turn in with a wide pull out and staying on the handle long is the other thing I focus on.

 

[disland]

Great thread, thanks

[Razorskier1]

I feel like shorter line lengths for me are about resisting against the line and moving my COM forward/across the wake. I am not good enough to "generate high intensity" and then release it elegantly. If I have high intensity before the first wake, it becomes difficult to edge change smooth and early. For me it is start high, move COM in direction of travel, resist boat. By the first wake I want to be actually coming up from whatever lean I have, and by the second wake I want to be flat on the ski (optimally). Then resist from an upright position for as long as you can. At 32 off you should be able to get to buoy width, early of the ball, with the handle still pinned to your hip. The start of your reach isn't to let both hands move away from the body. When two hands are on the handle, it is always close to your hips. This requires you resist the temptation to see the ball, think you are early, and reach (my own bad habit). If you do this the right way, you are actually not skiing the buoys, but skiing the path of the handle. This creates maximum space, maximum width, and minimum slack.

[TWB]

+1 @Lovell. Patience is key for me at 35 off. I need to be intense behind the boat and patient in my preturn and in my turn. The ball will be going past you and you are not at the apex of your arc. Don't rush your turn. You are better off finishing 15 feet past the ball with a good turn than forcing the ski to turn at the ball. This is a mental issue of running my hardest passes that I struggle with.

[6balls]

At 32 you begin the need to run the handle path. As you come off the second wash the handle path begins to come up the side of the boat...this height is even more necessary at -35 and more so again shorter...but I feel 32 is where this sensation begins.

 

So, you may have great angle out of the ball but if you try to maintain that after the second wake...pulling for the shoreline to get wide it's not going to work. You will get separated from the handle that now wants MORE up-course and LESS (but still present) outbound. If you continue more outbound by pulling too long it's a problem. You will be fast and narrow feeling like holy crap the line is short and this is fast how do I possibly run this?

 

Take your angle and load from the ball and as @razorross3 is saying begin slowly coming up a bit sooner than you think you should. This is NOT an edge change, this is transitioning up from the deepest part of your lean. If you begin coming up sooner, you will finish coming up sooner then with less load after the wash, and able to keep the handle longer both outbound and starting to come up the side of the boat (getting high...so cool).

 

If you are able to progressively unload like this, you will find yourself not so damned hot at approach to the buoy and life gets easier for now.

 

This is not easy...but to ski better you need to change and change is hard. I find turns generally take care of themselves with a good set-up and the set up is the proper lean. Just "handle control" is not enough because good handle control is not possible if you over pull. Get the lean right, then work the handle control, then muy bueno.

[ski6jones]

+1 on wide for your gates. Lots of other good info here but the other thing that made -32 and -35 super difficult for me was my tendency up my intensity in the gate too much. The shorter rope gives you more speed for the same amount of effort. Don't try to crush the gate. Start wide, progressive turn in getting your angle and hold until your edge change. You want direction through the gates and the shorter the rope the more important direction becomes. Almost impossible to get the direction without the width in the pull out.

[Waternut]

Lots of good insight and lots of things for you to try and work on. Hardest part for me is visualizing shorter line lengths. Pulling until your eye line gets to the buoy and slowing it down is easier at 22off and possible at 28off. If you try to do that at 32off and shorter you might get you to about 3 ball and then you'll be so late, you'll never make 4.

 

For me, I feel like I can generate all the speed and angle in the world but knowing when to stop pulling and slow it down is tough. The fear of stopping too early and running over the buoy typically makes me pull longer giving me the feeling of being narrow and fast. When I can keep my head and get my timing down, 32off falls easily. If not, even 28off can feel difficult.

[jhughes]

I'm right here too. 28 is extremely consistent and getting better and better. 32 ends at 1,2, or 3 every time. I was hoping to just blow through 32 since everybody says its "the same pass" but it is certainly not the same.

 

I am working on a directional and efficient move-out to get as high as possible.

 

There is something to the over pulling thing for sure because I did make a trip to 5 ball this week and I felt like I was half assing it the whole time, odd feeling for sure.

[A_B]

I found that the intensity needs to be more to keep the same position as 28 off. You need to resist more to keep your lean angle the same, not that you have to drag your hip in the water behind the boat. As the rope gets shorter the boat has more leverage on you to stand you up. If that makes sense.

[RazorRoss3]

-32 is similar to -28 in a lot of ways but it's an animal in its own right. When you do it right you get to the other end and aren't even winded because you've used your leverage effectively and in the right place and controlled your position and handle off the second wake.

[bassfooter]

@cragginshred lots of good advice here. I see the same themes over and over, and they're all things that have worked for me. I cannot recommend lowering the speed for training unless you do so sparingly. I think you just have to get out there and ski it.

[wtrskior]

Don't be afraid at slowing the speed, but no more than 1mph, then increase .5mph. Many pros have learned new lines by slowing the speed a bit.

[Laz]

I found 32 quite tough but have now begun to run it fairly regularly. What helped me is understanding that the course is actually quite narrow compared to its length. Once I realized that I would get the needed width even with a slightly earlier edge change, I stopped getting slack at one and two.

[RazorRoss3]

Like @Laz said, you still have a lot of rope, the fear than you won't get there is all in your head. I've taken the handle outside the buoy at -32 a few times this year.

[GAJ0004]

When you are at 28 off practice shortening the pull zone because it gets shorter as the rope gets shorter. Let the ski finish its turn for as long as you can. This will allow you to adjust for the shorter pull zone at 32 off. I had a bad habit of pulling too long at 32off. I don't run it every time, but I am getting more consistent with it. Like on every pass it is critical to start out wide before the entrance gate, and get very early to ball one.

[6balls]

Oh yeah...maybe others will disagree but I like a "Brenda" rope from IN TOW that has the intermediate loops...so you could have a 30 off loop, for example. If nothing else it's fun.

 

I run the majority of my 35's and a 38 here or there, but have had a riot at 33.5 this year. It feels 35-ish but a lot more forgiving. Maybe 30 off gives you a stepping stone to the green line.

[Razorskier1]

I will echo something @6balls said in an earlier post. You won't believe how early you can be coming up and still get space, width and the right speed. I ran 28, 32, seven 35s and a 32 this morning. I was coming up to almost flat near the first wake. Ski still carried out wide and early, but my speed coming into the ball was so much nicer. All it requires is keeping the handle next to the hip and riding the path of the handle. So nice!

[ALPJr]

2nd on the InTow 30off loop. Love mine.

[cragginshred]

@6balls I use the progressor line by Masterline. The -25 loop is typically my opening pass and so similar to -28 but slower and more controlled. So the -30 loop will likely be in my future much sooner than the -32 loop.

 

I am not interested in skiing tournaments so it is very usefull and as you said 6balls Fun!