Camera mounts? Wakeye vs Ski-Doc Orbit mount

[skimtb]

Is the front facing cam better than rear facing on iPhones for this use?

[UWSkier]

Can't fix the vibration issue with software since it's ultimately a hardware problem.

[MZito]

@DaveD

Here is a YouTube link to a video with my homemade pylon camera mount (see earlier post in this thread). This is my sons 1st time through all 6. This video is with a iPhone 11 using the selfie camera. I think it does a pretty good job controlling vibration and the shaking I have experienced with some other mounts.

[tap]

@skispray it's pretty simple, yet very purposefully designed. It's essentially just two plates separated by some silicone tubing. I used 1/2" thick aluminum plate cut to 6" diameter circles. I drilled and tapped six #8-32 holes evenly spaced about the perimeter (six in each plate, twelve total). There is a 1" long screw in each hole so that a 1/2" of screw sticks out past the metal plate. I cut six pieces of silicone tubing, 1/8" ID x 1/4" OD, roughly 3 inches in length (later trimmed to length). 8-32 screws are 0.164" in diameter, so the 0.125" ID tubing slips over the screws but is snug enough to make a secure connection. The orange bit in the middle is just a piece of foam noodle, it doesn't touch the top plate (it's not supposed to as that would diminish the isolation effects) and is only there to keep the system from crushing when your ski partner decides to put his weight on it. Once you have all the pieces, the key is to trim your tubing until it is just short enough that it has enough stability to not buckle under the weight of the camera. The shorter you trim the tubes the more weight they can support, but the worse the device will function as an isolator. The goal is to be very 'flimsy' in the lateral direction, but structurally sound enough in the vertical direction to support whatever camera you want to put on it. There is actually a lot more intent in this design than is obvious and more than I'm describing here... but this is really all you need to get something to work reasonably well.

 

From a vibration perspective, it's kind of dumb to mount a camera to a long metal pole in the middle of a power boat traveling at a high rate of speed and not expect it to vibrate like crazy. But... that's what we do.

 

Most of the vibration that makes the videos hard to watch is the ski pylon bending back and forth at a high rate of speed, aka vibrating. My mount is designed to specifically prevent this motion from getting to the camera. For an isolation system to work the natural frequency of the mount has to have a natural frequency quite a bit less than the driving frequency (trying not to turn this into a page from text book). If your mount is too stiff, it will actually amplify the vibrations instead of removing them. So... it's important to be as laterally 'flimsy' as you can structurally tolerate. Also, mass above the rubber tubing is very very good. The more mass the better. I used metal plates specifically for the mass. You can use plastic, wood, really anything, but adding some mass would be a very good idea. There's some really interesting physics/math here that defines the exact point at which you switch from amplifying vibration to isolating vibration... if you really care let me know and I'll point you to some literature.

 

Some cameras are better at dealing with the vibration than others. I choose to use my phone for the convenience of it. Unfortunately the quality of the video is just a bit to shaky for my liking if I don't prevent some of the mechanical vibration from getting to the phone. Works just great with the mount, and has seen a couple years now of continuous service without failure. I do replace the silicone tubing about once per year just to freshen it up.

[skispray]

@tap thanks for the detailed explanation! How about mounting it to the Orbit, and mounting the phone to it? Is that a specific part like a camera mount extender that's used there? Or some items from a hardware store?

[rimodico]

PVC pipe works fine

 

 

[tap]

@MZito that looped steel cable is a tried and true design. I almost went with that but I wasn't sure if there would be enough mass above the isolator to get a really smooth result... but that video looks pretty good. Looking at your camera mount above the isolator I'm guessing the cables are functioning more as a pivot point than a shear plate, which I could see working fairly well. I might have make one up and give it a go. There is some advantage to that design in that it can help with any axial vibration as well if done right.

[tap]

@skispray the bottom plate is mounted to the skidoc orbit using the standard 1/4-20 screw that is on the skidoc. You just drill and tap a 1/4-20 in the center of the bottom plate. For the top plate you just mount any commercially available phone mount to it using the same standard 1/4-20 fastener, or get creative and make something. You just want it to be rigid to the top plate. In other words, the only motion you want in the system is the purposeful motion of the top plate moving laterally from the bottom plate... you don't want a flimsy camera mount on top of your isolation mount. I broke a few of the very cheap amazon spring loaded phone holders until ponied up the extra $5 to get a metal version. That one has lasted a couple years. It's fairly rusted now and could stand to be replaced. I should just make something more robust, just don't have the time.

[Xpropman]

 

[skimtb]

So since a few folks have modified the orbit does they mean there is vibration if used as purchased?

[tap]

@Xpropman how's that working for ya?

 

If i had to guess... those tubes look a little stiff. Might want to swap them out for something much softer and more rubbery. If it's all you got, cut some new ones 2 or 3 times the length or more, that would also help. Also, bolt as much mass as you can handle onto the top plate. Ideally you want to get it to the point where you can tap the top plate with your finger and watch it slowly wobble back and forth.

[MZito]

@tap

Here is what I found for an anti vibration device. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0776BRT39/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I stuffed some high density foam in the pvc that rests between the pylon and top of the pvc/plastic sleeve. I used ram mounts and gopro accessories.

[tap]

@skimtb yes and no. Depends a lot on the camera you plan to use, how heavy it is, how good it is at stabilization, and most importantly how smooth you expect your videos to be. For most cell phones, ya it's probably going to vibrate a decent amount. But... the orbit is sooo good from a usability perspective that it's hard to pass on. The fact is, the pylon vibrates. Depending on your mount system as a whole it's either going to transmit that vibration, amplify that vibration, or prevent that vibration from getting to your camera. Don't get me wrong, you can certainly use an orbit without any mods, it's just very easy to make it better, so why not... The orbit is fairly sturdy and secures nicely to the pylon, unfortunately that's also why it transmits the vibrations of the pylon to your camera so efficiently.

 

I used to use a PVC homemade device very similar to some of the other ones posted. It worked very well. You can take out most of the vibration just by putting some foam between the pvc and the pylon (no hard connections) and adding some mass to the pvc. But... rope changes are just easier with the orbit.