2021 is my last year of USAWS

[dave2ball]

@A_B the coach’s and ski schools taking the course now that would make too much sense and would require some common sense. It is obvious that USA Waterski has more dollars then sense. The division issue well that is a ver scary thought. A shim division. What’s next sensitivity classes

[Mateo_Vargas]

Ah the good ole days when your AWSA member number was your social security number.

[A_B]

Any wonder how posting a picture of an infant while holding a beer bottle up to their mouth will go over with the SS crowd?

 

It’s just an hour…. It’s just to flatten the curve. It’s for a good cause.

 

Wait to see how you can spend your digital money on gas consuming recreation and if you can even access it if you don’t have your vaccines up to date, or maybe it will include your SS training….

 

 

[ForrestGump]

from Imgflip Meme Generator

[skibackwards]

@Mateo_Vargas "This isn't the good ole days"

Not at all in favor of giving social security number !

[lpskier]

Boy, this discussion makes me long for the good ol’ days of complaining about the Level 10 Rule.

[ToddL]

If you are on the fence or have decided to non-renew, you should let the leadership know so that they can accurately plan for the future. The link below will open up your default email program and populate the key USAWS/AWSA leadership emails & provide a sample email message text. You can edit the text to suit your situation before sending.

 

Click to compose an email to key USAWS leadership contacts

 

 

 

PS: Be nice. Be constructive. Offer suggestions. But, let them know if you are truly conflicted about renewing.

[lpskier]

Here is the straight poop on SafeSport and is a cut and paste from SS. Withdrawing from USOCPC, withdrawing from USAWSWS or forming a new organization will not result in avoiding any SS obligations.

 

“ Protecting Young Victims from Sexual Abuse and Safe Sport Authorization Act of 2017

On February 14, 2018, S. 534 was signed into law and became effective immediately.

The bill amends two federal statutes: (1) the Victims of Child Abuse Act of 1990 and (2) the Amateur

Sports Act of 1978.

(1) Victims of Child Abuse Act of 1990

(a) Extended reporting duties

The bill amends the Victims of Child Abuse Act of 1990 to extend the duty to report suspected child abuse, including sexual abuse, within 24 hours to certain adults who are authorized to interact with minor or amateur athletes at a facility under the jurisdiction of a national governing body. A “national governing body” means an amateur sports organization that is recognized by the United States Olympic Committee.

An individual who is required, but fails, to report suspected child sexual abuse is subject to criminal penalties.

(b) Civil remedies

Additionally, the bill amends the federal criminal code to revise civil remedy provisions. Among other things, it changes the civil statute of limitation to 10 years from the date the victim discovers the violation or injury (currently, 10 years from the date the cause of action arose). The bill also extends the statute of limitations for a minor victim of a federal sex offense to file a civil action to 10 years (currently, 3 years) from the date such individual reaches age 18.

(2) AmateurSportsActof1978

The bill also amends the Amateur Sports Act of 1978.

(a) Designation of United States Center for SafeSport

It designates the United States Center for SafeSport to serve as the independent national safe sport organization, with the responsibility for developing policies and procedures to prevent the emotional, physical, and sexual abuse of amateur athletes. These policies and procedures developed by the Center must include:

• A requirement that (a) all adult members of a national governing body or a facility under the jurisdiction of a national governing body or at any event sanctioned by a national governing body, and (b) all adults authorized by such members to interact with an amateur athlete, immediately report an allegation of child abuse of an amateur athlete who is a minor to: (i) the Center, and (ii) to law enforcement

 

• A mechanism that allows a complainant to easily report child abuse

• Reasonable procedures to limit one-on-one interactions between a minor and an adult

• Procedures to prohibit retaliation

• Oversight procedures, including:

• Audits, to ensure the policies and procedures are followed correctly

• Consistent training is offered

• A mechanism for national governing bodies to share reports of suspected child abuse

(b) General requirements for youth-serving amateur athletic organizations

The bill also modifies the obligations of amateur athletic organizations – a not-for-profit corporation, association, or other group organized in the United States that sponsors or arranges an amateur athletic competition.

• Amateur sports organizations seeking a sanction for amateur athletic competitions must implement and abide by the policies and procedures to prevent emotional, physical, and child abuse of amateur athletes.

• Amateur sports organizations, which participate in an interstate or international amateur athletic competition and whose membership includes any adult who is in regular contact with an amateur athlete who is a minor, must:

- Comply with the reporting requirements of the Victims of Child Abuse Act

- Establish reasonable procedures to limit one-on-one interactions between an amateur

athlete who is a minor and an adult

- Offer and provide consistent training to adult members who are in contact with amateur

athletes who are minors

- Prohibit retaliation”

 

[The_MS]

Offer and provide? So if I refuse the offer to take the provided training I don’t get to ski?

[lpskier]

No.

[ToddL]

Where is the language that says, "all officials must have background checks"? Where is the language that translates "mechanism" and "reasonable procedures" into mandated background checks for every volunteer "official" at any event? This is the misapplication that needs to be challenged. If our insurance company is failing to properly provide "reasonable" allowances, then that is not a SS problem. That is a need to shop for a different insurance provider.

[ski6jones]

That is the same information linked by Keith earlier and it still doesn't say we should be subject to what has been implemented.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

@lpskier thanks for posting. I think most can understand and somewhat agree with the legal requirements you posted. However, this misses the big point that has so many of us ticked off - the huge murky bureaucracy - mainly USAWSWS - that went from "reasonableness" of the legal requirements to the sheer stupidity of requiring criminal background checks for officials that will have zero impact child safety, limiting liability or complying with these legal requirements.

 

There are huge areas for intepretation.

- "offer and provide..training" does NOT say "require"

- what is an "adult member in contact with a minor"? Any adult on site with ONE child who is there with their parents? An adult who waives and says "Hi" when passing? An adult sitting in a tower when a minor is skiing?

- "establish reasonable procedures to limit one-on-one interactions" I would argue those procedures are already inherent in how a typical tournament operates.

- etc, etc.

 

We still don't know who made the flowdown decisions for mandatory universal SS training, official background checks, etc, what reasoning was behind them or how to appeal them. The only response I have seen is "....there is no debate or discussion on this. Its the world we live in...."

 

So while withdrawing from USAWSWS will not change the SS requirments, it absolutely will give more control and transparency over exactly how we (AWSA) as an organization comply with the legal and liability requirements for members, officials and LOCs.

 

Personally I would prefer for AWSA to function effectively within the larger organization. But every day that goes by, it seems like the chances of that happening go down.

[A_B]

Let's see, I haven't skied in a tournament in umpteen years, have been a member off and on since, mainly to support the AWSA when I remember to renew, but now I have to pay to take SS training? I guess I will sit this one out... I was taught right and wrong by my parents.

 

[Dirt]

Federal law has become a joke. Its illegal to take money from foreign nations in exchange for access and influence. Its illegal to alter documents and mislead a federal judge. Has anyone been prosecuted?

Would they arrest USAWS officials for non-compliance? That Federal Statute is a joke. Jay walking is illegal

[skierjp]

I took the Safe Sport course a year ago and couldn’t remember if there was a charge. I just checked and Safe Sport is free but a Background Check is $30 and required every 2 years.

That banner on the USA Waterski site is a pain.

[skierjp]

So who is required to have a background check? Did Safe Sport require your Social Security Number, I can’t remember?

 

[skierjp]

Found the info. I dodged that bullet. I’m only a driver and judge!

Background screens are required for all USA-WSWS staff, board of directors, Sport Discipline board of directors, level 1 instructors, junior development coaches, U.S. international team members (athletes, coaches, staff, etc.), judges, and show directors and assistant show directors.

[LeonL]

Jim, it's my understanding that only judges are required to have a BG check. That's bad, but why only judges? As a senior judge, I may just have to take a pass on that. First, it was MVR to drive, then SS, and I went with those (SSN not required since it's only "training") but now they want me to submit to a BG check providing my SSN and credit card to some entity that I have no knowledge of. $85 (I used to join for 5 years, but that won't happen again) to ski plus $30 to sit on a tower? Just not feeling it.

[lpskier]

$30 to sit in the tower for a year? If you quit skiing, it’ll cost you $200 for two rounds of golf every weekend. And you’ll be miserable.

[6balls]

@lpskier or 5 gallons of gas in your own boat, 2 sets each with a buddy, done by 8 a.m., with the rest of the day to do as one pleases...

If that's misery sign me up.

[LeonL]

I didn't say that I'd quit skiing.

[skierjp]

My copy and paste from the web site does not mention judges.

[skierjp]

Whoops reread my post. I read it as judges for International. I’ll pay the $30 but not happy about it. If they require a Social Security number I’m out!!!!!

I thought this was a volunteer sport?

[skierjp]

My wife’s Social Security number was compromised at the hospital. That ended up in someone claiming her tax return. And now every year for ever we have to have a specific PIN number every year from the IRS.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

@skierjp Nope. ALL judges - even assistant slalom judges - for AWSA events must have background checks under the current guidelines.

https://teamusa.org/usa-water-ski/safe-sport/sanctioned-event-requirements

Under "Requirement", click on Compliance Chart

 

USAWS keeps stating liability as a major reason for these new requirements. I wonder how they will deal with the liability when a few SSNs get stolen and members starting being significantly financially impacted. I guess they aren't worried about that part.

[Jody_Seal]

@Bruce_Butterfield

Agreed especially when the organizations employees do not work at a "brick and mortor " office. They work from home. How long till one of them becomes disgruntled?

Multiple servers provide service...

 

Bottom line people socialisim has landed in waterskiing.

" But Jody it ain't like that!"

Yes it is!

Allow government into the sport you get the

current governments policys of overreach, woke

ideology as well as CRT thinking.

United socialist association for waterskiing has now become a government agency period!

 

[Bruce_Butterfield]

@lpskier if a judge simply forgoes the $30 and BG check, he/she can still go to the tournament and ski, but won't be able to judge. How do you think that is going to work out?

[Golfguy]

S 534 makes all individuals are requirement to report child abuse, I agree whole heartily to that. It does not make it a requirement to mandate everyone take a SS course. Why can't we simply add to the wavier that one will abide by the laws of the land.

[The_MS]

Unless we get some good news out of the BOD, I am down to my last 5 days. The bright spot would be more money in my wallet, more time on my home lake and more fishing on the weekends.

[jedgell]

Assistant judges need the background checks also? Guess I had assumed it was just for Regular and Senior. Guess I won’t be helping out next year. Would probably do it if I didn’t have to enter SS# with credit card.

[Mrs_MS]

I used to be a Reg Driver and Judge. I’m down to Asst Judge now and will not continue. I will do SS and join again if our site decides to host a couple tournaments. (I can maybe dockstart) ??‍♀️

[dave2ball]

@skierjp yes you do have to submit you SS number for the background check per my email with Nate Boudreaux and my conversation with Mr Hardy last week.

[skibackwards]

Tell me that it is a good idea to give my social security number AND credit card number to someone probably working from their home for a company I know nothing about. SS ok, but background check to continue judging after over years is on the brink. Something needs to change.

[ForrestGump]

Gonna be really interesting to see what the judges rosters look like in March when people are starting to prepare for the spring and summer tournaments. Oh well. USAWS dug this hole. Let them dig their way out.

[A_B]

I stand by my Nov 30 comment in this thread. The USAWSA appears to have no idea how big the can of worms is that they are opening.

 

Who is developing the restrictions due to defects on background checks? What are the guidelines on what is acceptable defects on the checks? How will they ensure that these will be consistently applied across all Regions? What if it is dear old Billy Bob driver that everyone now loves who has turned his drunken abusive self around from his younger foolish days? What if this information somehow gets leaked into the public at large and Billy Bob rightfully sues the governing body? What if we have a situation with little Suzy, and all the efforts taken to ensure no harm comes to minors doesn't stop a damn thing? Who gets sucked into that lawsuit? We have seen both sides of the NS issue and there are folks at both ends of the spectrum and everywhere in between.

 

The SSN and Credit Card brings in PCI Compliance, and more risk for data breaches. How good is the firewall at USAWSA? Better than Target?

 

All I know is my 12 year old nephew is about to get home-schooled because he is picking up stuff I never heard of until late high school. His parents say there is ZERO discipline and respect shown in the classroom. A friend of mine is a teacher and breaks down and cries when she talks about what goes on in her 6th grade classroom, wondering if she can be a teacher any more.

 

Houston, we have a problem. Lack of morals in children and adults is the problem, and no amount of Safe Sport training or background checks is going to help. It may make some people feel warm and fuzzy that we are "doing something", but I don't think it will be far out on a limb to say it won't do one damn thing to curb the underlying issue.

 

The AWSA should run away as fast as they can while they still have a membership and focus on core three event disciplines on American soil.

 

It isn't a matter of what will the AWSA lose by breaking away, it is a matter of what will be lost if they stay... The staunch supporters of the old AWSA will still be there, but not for long...

 

 

 

 

[dave2ball]

@ForrestGump USAWS will not pay the price. The skiers and LOC will feel most of the shortages when it comes to judges. Especially Sr. Judges. We may not have as many events or we may pay more because judges may want or feel the need to be compensated or even offered by the loc because of supply and demand issue to keep the event on.

[ForrestGump]

All that equals less revenue to USAWaterski. So they lose, too. I don't disagree that it's the skiers that lose no matter what.

[lpskier]

@Bruce_Butterfield Yes, I think that is exactly how it will work. If you don’t want to judge, don’t judge. Isn’t that how it always works?

 

@6balls Perfect! You can tee off at 9 and be off the course by 3. Have fun!

[skierjp]

I’ll bet $100 that when a judge is needed the LOC will look the other way and doctor the paper work to get the event finished. Tournaments in Florida barley have enough officials to run a tournament as it is. Now with the Seals stepping away it will be bad. Florida has very few 3 event drivers?

[dave2ball]

…….

[LeonL]

@skierjp how could they doctor the paperwork? I have to assume that if a judge doesn't have a BG they'll be flagged in the system. If the LOC uses said judge it's the same as using someone out of the crowd who has no rating. Then the tournament scores will be invalidated.. It's gonna be a fiasco, already is until someone higher up uses some common sense.

[lpskier]

I am inundated with requests to judge at our Orlando tournaments. If the “old timers” choose to back out, there will be plenty of new ones to take their spots. Same with drivers. There are lots of folks who would love to get the chance to get in the seat. To me, it sounds like an opportunity to cull a lot of bad attitude out of the herd.

[ForrestGump]

@lpskier You're inferring that because the center of the waterski universe is like that, the entire country will be like that.

[ski6jones]

So @lpskier, is the implication that those opposed to the current mandates, SS and BGC for judges, have a bad attitude? Hope not. I'd say they are just trying to prevent the sport from going down a road that will further reduce the sports numbers with no appreciable benefit.

[JackQ]

The landscape in North Florida (and many other areas) is much different than Central Florida. We struggle to get sufficient judges/drivers/boats/scorers, particularly on our Record tournament. Many of the judges that will likely not renew are the younger ones, that have families and commitments, where the just two more things are required is two things too many.

[unksskis]

Being “inundated with requests to judge” and “plenty of new ones to take their spots” don’t exactly go together.

[Stevie Boy]

@Ipskier have you heard of the term "Desperate" have you not been asked before ? Maybe they are trying to get ahead of the rush.

[markn]

@lpskier I worked my ass off over several years and was coached by drivers who have pulled records to get my senior drivers rating. I gave it up a while ago, but simply wanting to "get in the seat" does not replace the skill set acquired over several years. You seem to think those who have contributed to the sport over numerous years can be easily replaced. A 3-event driver such as Jody Seal has a skill set very few drivers can match. They are a talented, select and sought after group. If you have not driven R tournaments or pulled a pro into 41, I suggest you don't dismiss those who have so easily.

[ski6jones]

I'd still like to hear an answer to this question.

 

@klindy Appealed to and rejected by whom?