Are squats and deadlifts good or bad??

[MichaelGoodman]

I always thought they were two of the best exercises

you could do. However lately I have been hearing they

can mess you up. I due have problems with my hips

and am afraid the above exercises will make them

worse. I know there are a lots of knowledgeable people on

this site when it comes to work outs just looking for

some of your thoughts. Thanks

[Shell]

I've always loved both exercises, and still do to this day. I also get great results from walking lunges. You can do all three exercises with or without added weight. If you do them correctly, slowly and good form, you should have no issues. If your adding weight and its to much, thats when you will injur yourself. @MichaelGoodman

Happy workouts!

[skidawg]

Great full body exercises as long as they are executed properly

[lpskier]

Nope.

[Texas6]

Agreed, both are fantastic exercises that I do regularly. If done right, and weight is moderated such that form is never compromised, they are great for skiers. Having said that, I dial DL's back a bit during the ski season just to prevent over use and injury

[TEL]

I found out a couple years a go when I changed to a good workout for my legs I was skiing much better. Strong legs were the key for me. Warm up two sets of lunges with weight then a good regiment on machines only, doing three sets with heavy weights four to six reps once a week.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

I think the critical part is "as long as they are executed properly". Its when they are executed in poor form that can lead to problems. Many people have poor form. If you have a good PT or knowledgeable workout partner, you'll be fine. Doing them on your own may be a crapshoot.

[WaterSkier12]

Agree with Bruce, also don't do them in the AM as your discs are full of water after sleeping. See Stuart McGill's books/DVD's

[TFIN]

I always tell my guys that if I were restricted to one lift or exercise it would be deadlifts. Replicates your power source for slalom perfectly.

As with anything, needs to be done correctly though.

TF

[bigskieridaho]

Totally agree with the comments above. After doing squats, lunges, and deadlifts, my legs have never felt so strong. No soreness after snow or waterskiing.

[lakeaustinskier]

Most people don't realize that deadlifts aren't just for your legs. Lots of core.

[RazorRoss3]

Deadlifts and squats are great but every high schooler you see in the gym is doing them wrong so they get hurt. If you execute properly you won't get hurt and it will improve full body movement and strength. You need/ should do a lot of stretching before either lift, they require hip flexor and back mobility to be done correctly so a good warm up of stretching and mobility work before lifting is good for you.

[Horton]

Great. I am going to just ski.

[WaterSkier12]

You don't necessarily need spine mobility, but spine stability, i.e. Strength. Alot of what is dispersed by the so called experts is wrong. Hyper flexing or hyperextending the spine puts the disc/ligaments at risk. See Stuart McGill.

Agree with hip flexor and hamstring stretching

[thager]

@Horton Don't forget to wear your ski chaps!

[jjackkrash]

Squats and deadlifts properly performed: good. Sitting in a chair all day: bad.

 

@waterskier12, I'd agree that deadlifts in the morning carry a different risk, but they can be done with proper prep time. I used to lift four mornings a week @4:30 a.m. because the job required it, and with deads I needed a few sprints to get the blood going then some mobility work in a dry sauna before deadlifting.

[WaterSkier12]

Agree on the first point wholeheartedly!

 

On the 2nd, u gotta do what u gotta do! Wish I'd have known I was gonna live this long, I'd have taken much better care of myself! ;-))

[webbdawg99]

I have mixed feelings on this topic now. If you'd asked me 6 months ago, I would've said everything that everyone above me is saying, "These exercises are good when performed properly".

 

Well, I can confidently say that I've been performing these exercises properly for several years now.....but I may never do them again. Despite all of my efforts of proper form, weight control, mobility, core strength, etc....I find myself with an injury that has been caused by excess stress on the back and spine.

 

No matter how strong your core is or how perfect your form is, you're still putting load on your spine. And lots of load over a lot of time can lead to disc degeneration and injury.

 

Overall, I say they are both good exercises when done properly for most people. But if you do ever feel discomfort or pain, listen to your body and STOP.

[RazorRoss3]

It is certainly true that these lifts, not to mention every other lift and type of training in the world can come back to bite you. Don't hurt yourself in the offseason training by doing lifts that you aren't prepared for as far as strength, balance, and mobility not to mention the proper form and muscle usage. And as stated above even if you are doing everything right, of it hurts you should stop, rest it for a few weeks going lighter machine and rehab work and then ease back in slowly. I'm over 1 year out from tearing my pectoral tendon and I'm still just trying to rehab the pec at 135 on the bench for sets of 20+ hoping to be able to peg up the weight in the fall.

[Bruce_Butterfield]

When all else fails, drop the weight and increase the reps. much easier to keep good form.

[lpskier]

I felt good about deadlifting 310 on Friday, until another guy (and an M.D. at that) benched 405.

[RazorRoss3]

@lpskier, 405 is light weight, you should avoid lifting with me or my little bro ;)

[Razorskier1]

It isn't about the weight. I use 135 for squats and 225 for dead lifts. Could I lift a lot more? Sure, but to what end? I'm working on hip mobility and core stability. That doesn't require a ton of weight. I feel like I have gotten plenty of benefit without risking injury. Lifting more isn't the objective.

[WaterSkier12]

Not all MD's are walking around smart lpskier ;-))

[6balls]

@waterskier12 and @lpskier are we MD's supposed to be weak? :smiley: Nobody told me or my med school lifting buddies.

 

Anyhoo, back on topic. I've had back surgery and I do leg press...4 sets of 10 with 30 second rest intervals which alone keeps the weight a little lighter to come back that quickly. Also doing smith machine squats same way, then dead lifts but I'm doing my dead lifts with dumbells and not going so far down as one would with barbell (I'm not that flexible, anyway). Deads really hit the hamstrings, glutes and core and doesn't seem to be a lot of risk...I feel good so far. Doing that string of exercises for sets of 4 with 30 second breaks only really gets the heart rate going, too.

[lpskier]

@WaterSkier12 Au Contraire! It's just as a lawyer, I hate getting one (or more) upped by a doctor. Besides, you guys are supposed to be about finesse, not brute strength!

[UWSkier]

Good points on both sides here. Think the main issue with these lifts is that us guys can be our own worst enemies in the gym sometimes. Heavy weights when lighter will do, pushing for one more rep after fatigue and bad form have crept in (detected or not). For some lifts that's OK (like bench with spotter), but for anything involving the back, quit when you're tired and your form breaks even a little bit.

 

Lately I'm finding an inverted Bosu ball and some dumbells are my favorite exercises. Stand on the plastic platform side of a Bosu in your slalom stance, then do one-armed curls, arnold presses, side bends, etc. Then switch to normal stance and do goblet squats. It's less weight than your normal power lifts but more full body exercise. If your legs aren't shaking when you're done, you're doing it wrong.

 

I like this workout posted by Sandra Botas too. Been incorporating a bunch of this lately instead of traditional squats. The kettlebell row I like to do on my Bosu as well.

 

Workout

[34mph]

Dead lifts and squats put a lot of stress on your lumbar spine .... but so does skiing but then again why put more on it ..... there is many other things you can do in there place

[santangelo]

As many have said they are fine if you do them correctly. Problem is, they are two very technical movements. It's a skill that needs to be practiced before pushing passed ~50% max. I've read studies that state, even when done correctly, the spine still gets compressed during squats, and you should decompress afterward.

 

Also, some people aren't built for some exercises. For instance, if you don't have good ankle flexion, barbell back squats will be more difficult.

 

Some good alternatives that greatly limit spinal compression:

Single Leg Deadlift

Dumbell Rear Lunge (elevate rear foot to make more difficult)

[WaterSkier12]

Orthopods use bigger hammers, not lil ones!!! ;-))

[RazorRoss3]

Certainly highly technical lifts and I agree entirely don't push weight until you can execute properly. A lot about keeping your weight in your heels, staying stacked shoulders over hips, and pressing through the hamstrings and glutes. As stated above, 1 let deadlifts, kettle bell swings, and box jumps can accomplish similar goals although squats and deads hit the muscles differently which is good. Variety builds strength better than the same lift day in day out.

[epnault]

Great exercises and like most everyone has said form is everything. I will see this season if this type of training helps my skiing (I am very optimistic it will)

 

The best book I have ever read has been Becoming a Supple Leopard. It is a big text book style but I have lifted and trained all my life and this author taught me so much I wish I had learned at an early age. It is also a must read in my opinion for CrossFit athletes.

[34mph]

I'm not a great skier by any means but as a DPT and a Personal Trainer will tell you there is not much that will help you be ready for skiing .... its just so different then anything you can do in the gym. Just be in shape and ideal body weight !

[DaveD]

@34mph 12 oz curls are good prep for ski season.

[RazorRoss3]

As a fairly accomplished lifter I can agree that there is nothing you can do in the gym that will keep you from being sore when you take your first sets after the off season. With that in mind there are certainly things you can do in the gym that will prepare your body for skiing. By staying strong and keeping active in the off season my endurance stays up, I have the strength to take more sets more often to get my groove back, my mobility is better, my core is stronger and so on. So if the bar is can you do anything in the off season to make it so you aren't sore after your first set of the season? Probably not. But if the bar is can you do something in the off season to position yourself to be able to start the season with minimal soreness and a quicker recovery time the answer is a resounding yes.

[Triplett]

I would say squats and deadlifts at a bare minimum. And I will echo that proper form is key to moving the weight safely. Honestly, Crossfit.com has some really good videos breaking down the movements.

 

I have had athletes tell me similar concerns about knee and hip issues that with some instruction in the lifts and working on mobility have never had an issue since. Obviously if you have no cartilage left you cant stretch that out, but sometimes pain comes from lack of mobility/tight muscles. I would recommend some type of yoga, or yoga like program. I follow RomWod, which is a daily 20 min yin type routine that helps open your joints and become more flexible.

 

I feel the Olympic lifts, Clean and Jerk and Snatch, are some of the best for waterskiing, but these require lots of time and really good instruction so you don't hurt yourself.

 

 

[MrJones]

Just a reminder.

 

Most of us on here are older and nursing chronic injuries. It's not a question of "are they good exercises?", it's are the appropriate for you, are you performing them correctly, and is the load appropriate?

 

I have chronic back issues including surgery. Heavy squats irritate it and I believe likely accelerate my progression to a possible fusion in the future. Therefore, I use a curling bar with about 50-60# max across my chest in a front squat position so I lighten my load and ensure good posture for the lift.

 

The impact of jogging also inflames my disc. I use the lifecycle and elliptical instead.

 

Ditto for deep/heavy squats with knee meniscus or arthritis issues.

 

 

 

[Triplett]

@MrJones that is one thing I missed and 100% agree with, always scale appropriately. No reason to be a hero and become injured.

 

Front Squats are great for working the core!