Advice on a new ski and bindings for tall, open water, female skier

[quinne]

Hey folks,

 

So now that you've weighed in on my ankle issue I would love your thoughts on a new ski and bindings. I am 42 years old, 6ft tall, 130lb, female and open water ski at an advanced intermediate level. Speed is usually around 28. I make it to a course about once a year.

 

I'm leaning toward a 2016 Radar Lyric. (Currently skiing on an old 66 inch O'brien TRC.) It looks like the Lyric is only available in 65 and 67. Would going to a 67 be too long for me given my weight?

 

Bindings... I'll probably stick with a rear toe plate but any comments on the Radar Lyric Binding that looks like it is made to go with the ski?

 

Thanks!

E

[bigskieridaho]

@quinne Lyric is an awesome ski! My wife skis on one and loves it! 65" is a good size not a 67". 65" is up to 160lbs. The lyric bindings are great to for open water. My wife even runs them in the course.

[Than_Bogan]

Lyric is a great choice. 65" is probably the way to go, although at 28mph I doubt the 67" would feel ridiculous.

 

6'0" 130!! I thought *I* was narrow. :)

[bikesrus]

Hey, I think we all skied at Cobles together ( lake 4 July 1st?).

Thumbs up for a new Radar. We love our Radar Senates!

[LeonL]

I'm with @Than_Bogan at 28 the 67" would work well. I would always err on the large size.

[quinne]

bikesrus, yes! We did! Small world huh. Let's plan to coordinate next year to go at the same time. I remember that you were both loving your Senates.

 

LeonL, why err on the larger size?

 

Given that we often deal with less than perfect skiing conditions does a longer or shorter ski fair better in chop?

 

Comments on the rear toe plate? There are several options, from the basic no-frills slip in like what I have now vs. more elaborate/expensive options.

 

Thanks! This is super helpful... hope to order one this week.

-E

[LeonL]

Larger ski will be more stable and quicker cross course. I may be in the minority, but I believe that if you're on the fence about deciding size I would always go longer. Some skiers say go as long as you can and still turn it efficiently.

[ALPJr]

I'm 6'2 170 and have been on 68" skis for 20+ years. Manufactures always recommend 67 for my weight but I have always found a feeling of added stability on 68. A while back Drew Ross wrote an article in WSM that talked about the advantages of going up a length. Guess that stuck with me.

[mopowpow]

The 67" would be OK for now, skiing slower speeds and free skiing. But if you start skiing in the course and speeding up, it might be a bit long. I used a wider HO ski when learning the course, but when I got up to 30-32mph, it was a little too much. I ended up with several 66" skis after that. I am female, 5' 8" and around 150. I do wish Radar made the Senate/Lyric in a 66", I would probably be on it instead of a Vapor.

[quinne]

Thanks for all of the advice! After talking with Radar and thinking about my weight relative to the length of the ski I decided on the 2017 65" Lyric. My 66" currently feels a bit piggish (although that probably has more to do with it's age than length) but I didn't want to go longer. And the front Lyric boot and RTP.

 

And I have an appt with the orthopedist tomorrow to check out my ankle.

 

Can't wait for the Lyric to get here! Thanks again folks.

-E

[Than_Bogan]

@ALPJr I just digested what you wrote. What speed are you skiing at? At 34, I would expect a 68" to feel Yuge :smile:.

 

I am also 6'2" 170 and I have never been successful on anything longer than 66. On some of the wider skis a 65 was ideal.

 

I did one season on a 67 years ago. It was a monster. I can't even imagine trying sixty EIGHT!

[Than_Bogan]

Also, @quinne please tell us about your Lyric once you get a chance to ski it!

[TallSkinnyGuy]

@Than_Bogan Seems like at your weight you would be right in the sweet spot of what most ski manufacturers would suggest for a 67" ski. Interesting that you don't like going longer than 66" especially since you are also on the tall side and would therefore benefit from a little more fore-aft support from a longer ski. Of course, your skill level is 10x mine, so maybe turning ability is more important at that level than stability. I need all the stability I can get.

[Jordan]

Nate weighs around 155 and absolutely rips his 67" ski.

 

I have no idea what that tells you except that a longer ski can be turned.

[AndersonSkiTeam]

I know 6 woman, including my wife and daughter, who are in your weight range and speed. They all prefer the 67". The lyric binding is really comfortable and for your skill level performance wise should be good.

[ALPJr]

@Than_Bogan yep last 4 skis going back to to '94 were all 68's and at 34mph except for a slow start at 32mph this year while coming back from some nagging injuries. Tried a couple 67's before zeroing in on another 68 this year.

[quinne]

Soooo.... I tried my new 65" Lyric this weekend. I'm female, 6 feet tall, 130 lbs, intermediate advanced (I think?), open water skier, and have been skiing on a 25 yr old O'brien TRC since college. It's comical to pick the two up at the same time. The O'Brien is huge. I was so excited, couldn't freaking wait to get on the water.

 

It was the worst I've skied in 10 years. I skied Fri afternoon, Sat morn and Sun morn. (We've got little ones so we have to get our skiing in early and book it back to the house to take the kiddos out for their knee-boarding, super mabel, etc.) The Lyric felt slippery and unstable in the turn. Loving the ease across the wake, it practically floats (probably due to the lighter weight of the ski) but the best I can say to describe how it feels in the turn is "wobbly". I was on the fence to buy the 67" vs. 65" because of my height and weight.

 

My sisters (one is 5'4" and the other is 5'8", both about 125-130lbs) also tried the Lyric. They LOVED it. And they killed it. The Lyric is pretty much the same size as the ski they've always used so that part wasn't an adjustment for them. I don't think they'll ever go back to their old faithfuls. My Lyric just became a "sister ski".

 

My question... is it just that I'm used to skiing on a longer, heavier ski and it's going to take time to learn how to ski on the Lyric? Or, will it always be this way and I should try to find a way to demo a 67"? Is a demo even possible? I don't live anywhere near a shop.

 

Super frustrated.

[bigskieridaho]

The 65" should be the right ski based on weight. It goes up to 160lbs as the 67" starts at 130. What speed are you skiing? Could be based on form as well. @eddie_roberts_jr might have some insight for you as well.

[quinne]

28-30 felt slow so bumped up to 31-32mph. And yes, I think it is all about my form, or lack of. :# What should my speed be?

 

I learned at Coble's this summer that I have too much weight on my back leg. Trying now to break that bad habit and shift my weight to be more balanced through the turn to allow for acceleration out of the turn vs. drag. I also just read the "Edge With Confidence" article and realized I pull twice, going into the turn, then I make the mistake of turning my ski myself, then I pull to accelerate across the wake. I need to set myself up correctly to let the boat pull me back. Conceptually I get it and I can break it all down in my head, but then I can't seem to translate that to reality. So I'm trying to retrain myself out of long instilled bad habits AND I threw a new ski into the mix so now it's all a cluster!

 

According to the information that came with the Lyric, the 67" is 160-200lbs. The 65" goes up to 170lbs and the 63" goes up to 130lbs.

[Than_Bogan]

(To be clear, I am not-at-all Liking your frustration. But I Like that you are reporting back about your experiences. This makes us all smarter for future recommendations.)

 

I would guess that either @brooks or @eddie_roberts_jr can work with you about altering your setup and/or trading it in for a larger ski.

 

The one thing I would personally recommend is: Don't speed up right now! Working with something unfamiliar (and so far uncomfortable) is the last time you want to be going faster than you're accustomed to!

[Chef23]

I will add that I agree with @Than_Bogan on not speeding up right now. I really don't think that the ski is necessarily too small. I watched one of my ski partners who weighs 180 lbs run 15 off at 28 mph on a 67 Vapor this morning and while it feels slow to him to me it looked like the ski had plenty of support.

 

If you can I would try to ski a few more times on the ski before making a decision I feel like you will get more comfortable on the ski in the turns.

[ALPJr]

I know that manufacturers use weight and speed to give good estimates for ski size. At least in my case I find height an important measure too. At 6'2" I really feel more stability into and out of the turns on a 68" rather than the recommended 67". @quinne try a 67" if you can.

[Than_Bogan]

Wait, did you also change binding style? That can be a HUGE change, much bigger than a ski change usually.

[elr]

Definitely talk to Brooks and Eddie.

 

I am in the minority here but feel that height is just as/more important than weight for ski sizing. My son is 6'2" 135 lbs and rides a 66..5 inch slalom (35 off/36 mph) and a 43" trick ski for hands both well out of the weight ranges. He needs the extra support for his height. To me it seems logical that your sisters would love the ski and you would struggle.

[Than_Bogan]

I think the height factor is a big wildcard. At 6'2", I hate long skis because I'm too darn scrawny to turn the thing! Other tall people talk about needing more support to maintain balance.

 

For sure try longer. Worst case it doesn't help. Best case it's awesome.

[Gar]

A friend of mine may still have a 66.5 Goode Flextail if your interested.

[bikesrus]

Happy to hear you got a new ski. When I got my Senate, it felt all crazy at first and a friend made a couple of (what I thought were tiny)adjustments on the dock and I took it back out and it was money. Good luck! Hi to the sisters!

[ScottScott]

Did you leave the wing on? I have a friend that got a Lyric not long ago, and they said it felt a little unstable. I took off the wing for her, since you really don't want/need it until short-lining and she said it felt a lot better.

[quinne]

I love this forum. All really helpful.

 

Our warm season (NC) is winding down (booo) so I plan to use the remainder of this summer trying to familiarize myself to the 65. I'll slow the speed back down, try removing the wing and just spend time getting to know the ski. I've been riding that old O'briein for so long it might just take dialing it in. Then if next spring I'm still having trouble I'll figure out a way to demo a 67".

 

Yes, @Than_Bogan, new binding. My old one was factory with the old ski. On that note, how tight should I lace it up now? Still having ankle pain, wearing a boot right now as a matter of fact.

 

I talked with Brooks yesterday. He wants video of me skiing before he gives an opinion. Depending on the weekend and who is able to get to the lake that is harder to accomplish than one might think... I'd rather have my 5 year old holding on vs trying to play film maker!

 

Again, thanks so much for the advice. I am waaay novice compared to you guys but am crazy about skiing and want to improve. <3

[Than_Bogan]

I would bet that something like 80% of what you are feeling is the binding. If possible, move your old binding to the new ski until you get used to it. If not possible, be patient with a new binding. Expect 4 sets before it feels even remotely normal and quite a lot more for it to truly become what you're used to.

 

And I apologize for not mentioning that first. I've said it so many times on the this forum that bindings are way harder to adapt to than skis, that I forget people new to the conversation haven't heard that yet!

 

I have never used a Radar binding, but I have read again and again that the laces should be run pretty loose, both for safety and performance.

[TallSkinnyGuy]

I snug up the bottom laces pretty tight but leave the cuff laces loose enough that I can fairly easily pop my foot out of the binding without loosening the laces after a set.

[quinne]

I'm happy to report that my lyric and I are getting along better now! First date was pretty rough but I think we're both committed to the relationship and are taking baby steps. I'm having a lot of fun now! Only downside is we're getting a little cool here in NC so will soon be going into skiing hibernation.

 

Thanks so much to all of you for thoughtfully writing back with advice and encouragement!

 

One additional question... my sisters love the ski. Is there any reason why two or three people can't share one ski? We've always had our own but we ski together so we're currently just leaving the old skis on the dock and using the new lyric. Our weights are in the same range, height differs greatly.

 

Thanks!

Elissa

[Than_Bogan]

Awesome news!!!! Thanks for updating us.

 

Buy two more Lyrics. That creates more options. Also supports the industry :smile:.

[TallSkinnyGuy]

My brother and I have been sharing the same ski most of our lives. We have the same size feet, are about the same weight and are both RFF. Always made sense for us. We also co-own our boat. Works great for us and makes the sport more affordable.

[LeonL]

As long as foot size is similar, you're ok. Some big footed person may stretch or rip your binding.