Shortline

[ballsohard]

What line length does "short line" start at?

[Drago]

32 off

13 m if you're in Florida

[skibug]

one might argue for 28 because it is the first length where you actually start feeling the whip and release effect from the boat.

[oldmanskier]

When in Florida at Chet's I hear the people refer to short line as 38 off and shorter due to 38 off is the first line length in which the handle is inside the ski buoy when skier goes around the ski buoy. Only skied into 38 off straight up one time in practice many years ago at 34mph. I got 2 at 38. Being an old man with many injuries now just happy to do my deep water start and run an occasional 28 off at 32 mph.

oldmanskier

 

[Horton]

38. that is the point where the handle does not reach the ball.

[ALPJr]

Ok. If 75' is long line, then what are the loops before -38?

[Than_Bogan]

I've always used the term shortline somewhat literally (yeah, I know you're shocked) and so begins at -22, the first time the boat actually has to pull in the rope (under the old rules anyhow!).

 

Then "deep shortline" is a little more vague, but tends to begin after 90 buoys, i.e. 36/-32 or 34/-35.

 

Finally "extreme shortline" begins at -38 for the reason that Horton pointed out.

[skihacker]

I'd like to vote for deep shortline is 38 off because I'm evidently never going to run it.

[andjules]

I'm with @Than_Bogan... -22. As a marketing guy, if you've got a sport that's struggling to grow, the last thing you want to do is make common terms more-and-more exclusive, and make the budding enthusiast feel like they'll never be part of the club. -38 is deep or extreme shortline. The day you run your top speed -15 pass, and they pull you into -22, you feel like a king/queen. Enjoy it. You're part of the club. Get addicted.

[Justin_C]

There certainly is a grey area between "long line" (-15) and "shortline". I've always thought of shortline as -32 and up with extreme shortline at - 38. It does leave you in limbo if, like me, you're in that -22 and - 28 gap though. For that reason I really don't talk much in terms of "shortline" but rather what line length I'm skiing.

The great thing about this sport is that I can be thrilled to run deep into -32 where as to one person that's an opener and to another that's simply unattainable as they're working on building their speed. Just remember, ski your best and be proud when you ski well!

[jimbrake]

You kids - I remember how stoked I was the first time the boat stopped to shorten the line to 15 off after I ran 34 then 36 long line. THAT was shortline, but THAT was a long time ago, too.

[Horton]

There was a time when I would argue what Shortline means. To me it means 38 or shorter but if you are offended by that you can all it anything you want. There are a lot of more important things to care about.

[Lars]

Under the "personal interests" section on my resume, it says 'shortline slalom skiing', so I'm going to go with what @Than_Bogan said since I'm in the 15-28 off range B)

[BlueSki]

+1 for the -22 argued by @Than_Bogan and @andjules, a kid that hits max speed and cuts the rope to -22 for the first time feels a great sense of accomplishment. I get the technical differences between line lengths, but only a jack wagon would tell that kid that he has several more shortenings to go.

[jetpilotg4]

I remember when long line was 75 feet of rope, meaning everything was “short line” I’m sure I couldn’t see the boat now if I was still going out long line!

[BrennanKMN]

I have always thought of 32 as shortline and 38 as the separator. I don't have a really good reason why. I think it is a product of who I was surrounded by and reading about all these people starting at 28 and 32 off. I still felt like a rookie running 22's. Was feeling pretty good when I could crush 28's. But when I crossed into 32's I really felt like I was part of the 'club'.

 

Just because some people don't think 22 off is shortline doesn't mean it should take away from your sense of accomplishment. I still remember the first time I ran 22 off at 36. That was 2 years of work! I don't care who you are or what you said to me that day I was on top of the world. The best part about running a line length is being able to shorten and go back at it.

[wart]

So, if -38 is shortline; then way back when Connelly made the Shortline ski... only about 10 skiers could ski it.

[bishop8950]

Most people I ski with would consider shortline 38 or less. I see the logic behind -22 but of that we’re the case why not -15 be “Shortline”?

[Than_Bogan]

@bishop8950 Because long line isn't really a thing. In most countries it literally isn't a thing, and even in the U.S. it is very rarely seen.

[gsm_peter]

It seems to demens.

 

For some it is shorter then 23 meters.

For me it is shorter then 18.25 meters.

For some it is shorter then distance to boies (11,5 meters).

 

I have not heared anything else.

[bishop8950]

@Than_Bogan both my kids ski long line so for me it’s a real thing.

[Andre]

If you go through entrance gates @38 off,you have become a shortline skier IMO.

[h2onhk]

@wart

 

 

 

[liquid d]

Once you run 15 off at your division's max speed, you are a shortline skier by definition! Welcome newcomers to the club as soon as you can.

[brettmainer]

I agree w @liquid d. Shortline happens after you run your max speed. Most 12yr old plus start at -15. Even LL kids begin to start at -15 before they run max speed (mine did anyways).

There is a big difference between 22 and 39, but that’s not the point. When the boat stops at the end to shorten rather than speed up, you are at shortline. In my case when the boat stops, they typically tell me to lengthen the rope or try a different sport.

[lazzn]

I always thought of shortline as 38 and above for obvious reasons, but I stumbled across an ad from WSM may 1989 that defines a little differently. Maybe at the end of the day we should all be thinking of shortline as whatever lies past our hardest pass...

 

[skibug]

Man!!! Short Line kneeboarding?? Who new I was a multi-short liner. :D

[ALPJr]

I skied in a tourney for the first time in 11 years this season. Saw a few skiers start at long line 75 ft. Back in south Jersey around 1978 when we really became hooked on slalom, we'd never seen a course and got all of our information from The Waterskier, Spray and WaterSki. We figured the best skiers were skiing at something called 35 off so we cut 35 ft off of our 75 ft ropes. We hadn't seen ropes with loops either :D

[jayski]

As @Horton @Kevin Bishop @Andre all stated 38 (11.25) is shortline...No matter how much one wants to justify all those other shortenings they are NOT shortline. Life changes at 38, that pass separates the skill of skiers. One can dominate 35 and get nowhere at 38...size of mistakes at 38 and beyond need to be minute for complete passes, any other pass one can get away with quite a bit and still run it.

[Ilivetoski]

Life changes at 28, then again at 32, then again at 35, then again at 38, then again at 39, then again at 41. I don’t think 22 off is short line, but I do think it starts at either 32 or 35... That’s also where the pros start

[MNshortliner]

If you are skiing a course and not at 75’ you’re a shortline skier.

[LeonL]

Interestingly enough that's a word that has never been a significant part of my vocabulary. I just speak in terms of "off". Shoreline really denotes nothing that you put a finger on, so I've practically never used the word.

[Andre]

 

Everybody runs 38 on the internet so everybody are shortline skiers!

[MISkier]

I think shortline would start at about 50 off. That is likely the point at which no human can get their ski around a buoy, because the line is too short. Anything else is "long enough".

[6balls]

Slight off topic...but where does the next line off (I know they are all harder than the one before) become a significantly more monumental challenge and, for many skiers, a pass that never happens?

 

I would group 15 and 22 as very similar...and the jump to successful 28 off geometry is a big deal for most skiers. Similarly I would group 28 and 32 together...and the jump to successful 35 off also a big geometry deal for most skiers.

 

After 35, each line length is less of a length in terms of shortening, but a huge separator in ability--it's just geometry and physics.

 

38 does really separate some very good skiers from exceptional skiers. As mentioned above there are many 35 crushers who are simply reliable for 2@38. Anyone running 38 most of the time...man my hat is off.

 

Running 39.5? Geez rare air...unbelievable skiers. 41 yikes.

 

In the end, the shorter the line, the more degree of separation in skier ability over a single line length. This is not different from other sport disciplines, or even academia. We all ascend to a certain level of incompetence...and that's where we live.

 

Keep up the fight all (or in other words...stay thirsty my friends).