Ski and speed control upgrade

[bigtallweed]

I ski into mid 22off 34 mph on a good day and ski on a HO CDX-1. I know good skiers ski deep shortline with this ski. I am wondering if upgrading to a S2 would improve my skiing or I need to be a better skier to take advantage of the new ski? I also use perfectpass classic and get times in tolerance.Is there any real advantantage to going to Stargazer at this level? I know there will be some advantages but does it justify $2000

[usaski1]

Shouldn't be $2000 to upgrade to PP stargazer with z-box. prob looking at 1200.. I'd do it.. the times are so nice with z-box, and if your going to ski any tourneys its a must.

[thager]

If you know how to use classic, Stargazer is no advantage except for simplicity when and if you get it set up properly! CDX is a great ski if its stiffness has not been compromised. My all time pb was on that ski. However, the right new era ski for you would help be it S-2 or whatever.

[bigtallweed]

usaski1,I live in Canada where Perfectpass can still pull tournaments and only go in one or two a year so I was not interested in Zbox $2000 was for a S2 blank, perfectpass stargazer module and multi line display. Thank you for your comment.

[Chef23]

I would say no need to go to Stargazer. I do think you might benefit from anew S2.

[Waternut]

The Stargazer upgrade is only $500 if you already have the original perfect pass but if you've savvy with the classic perfect pass and understand all the settings, it's probably just as good if not better since you'd have to learn and figure out a new system if you switch to Stargazer.

 

I've never used my Stargazer system in a course but I feel like the new Stargazer system cripples you a bit. I'm still learning a friends classic PP but it looks like you can adjust so much in slalom mode on the classic systems. On the Stargazer, you have no adjustability and consequently, my drivers tell me that I (a novice skier) will occasionally pull the boat down to 27mph and it'll compensate back to 32mph when the system is set to 30mph... IMO, that's a ridiculously slow response. Same thing goes with startup. A friends classic mode might overshoot 1-2mph and quickly corrects. My Stargazer will over shoot up to 10mph before it figures out it overshot and then 20 seconds later, it'll finally stabilize itself if the driver doesn't step in and assist.

[Drago]

Something is seriously wrong there . 10 mph? You better fix that before someone gets very hurt

[usaski1]

If you push the throttle to the floor ZO style, you'll be screwed with SG / Z-box. You must accelerate smoothly just up to the beep, and then that's it. If you do that you'll be fine.. and always drop at the ends. If you dont, SG/Z-box cant that the turn smooth, and you'll go into the course at 40mph. Theres no reason for you to over-run with the system if you know it.

 

[6balls]

You can stuff the throttle in @razorskier1's MC 197 that has SG w/Z-box and it stops on speed every time.

[gregy]

@6balls, what year is the MC197? My experience with PP SG is on a 94 MC205 (no Z-box). If have to watch the RPMs coming into the course or it will over shoot the speed. Maybe its a shorter setup?

[DooSPX]

@gregy, the difference could you have cable driven throttle linkage, and the 197's are DBW,

[gregy]

@DooSPX, I was thinking the 197 might be DBW. My buddy's 9-08 MC TT 197 has both but we never use the PP, only ZO.

[6balls]

@gregy it's a 2005 tourney team with drive by wire.

[gregy]

Thought we might have something set up wrong on the 94 MC 205 but sounds like its the servo vs DBW. The PP / servo took a little getting used to compared to the ZO / DBW. I overshot the speed into gates the first few times.

[bigtallweed]

To get back on topic I ski on a CDX-1 through mid 22 off and was asking if an S2 would make a big differance in my skiing at this point. I know the cdx is capable of deep short line. What have other BOS skiers found with the upgrade @ my level?

Does stargazer WITH OUT zbox give a better pull than classic. I get times in tolerance with classic and quite happy to put in skier and crew weights.Only really thinking of changing for no magnet timing as we use the hand timer but it is really no big deal.... What are your thoughts?

[Drago]

I'd say you're fine with the Classic and you can almost always do better then a CDX

[bigtallweed]

We have seen many posts on how the Zbox in working and how to set it up but I don't think I"ve seen one on the new 8.0 software change without the box.Are skiers staying with classic unless they go to the Zbox? If not, how is the update. Is it more than just gps no magnet timing.Also I use the hand timer only with classic as it is a pubic course and there are no magnets. It seems to work well as the times repeat. How many others are doing this?

[Razorskier1]

@bigtallweed -- I updated my software about a month ago (I think). I presume that was 8.0. The boat has been great since (2005 MC 197 DBW). My observations are: you have to spend time tweaking for your particular boat. This is a hassle, but it is worth it once you get it dialed in. The boat is great for slalom at speeds 28 and over, but with slower speeds even the DBW boat seems to struggle to get settled in right away. For trick skiing it simply doesn't work (IMO). Overshoots, undershoots -- back and forth for a long time before getting the right speed. I hand drive trick. If all you do is slalom and you don't mind spending the tweaking time, I'd recommend Zbox. Oh, and the no magnet thing is really nice. We had three courses this summer and I just programmed them each in and was done.

[bigtallweed]

Thanks for the reply Razerskier1. I am disappointed to hear stargazer does not work well for trick as a do a little tricking. How long does it take to settle in? I just trick once in a while for a change up to slalom? Also do you know of any good trick intructional DVDs.

[6balls]

@bigtallweed, I think @razorskier1's boat held trick speed fine w/stargazer alone, has been hunting since z-box at trick speed. It's been dialed on slalom with both stargazer and stargazer w/z-box. Correct me if I'm wrong on that, brutha.

[slalomboy96]

I tried z box with SG in my 08 LXi (DBW) and had nothing but problems, it was so sensitive to driver input, i lost a pass each set, I could not even get it to trigger on the turn bouys it was always beeping a 1/2 boat length early on a surveyed course, I want a system any one can drive. After a wasted tank of gas trying to sort it out I gave up and pulled the zbox out, now with V8 software and no zbox it just sucks and the motor sounds rougher.... I am ordering a ZO coversion kit next week and cant wait.

 

[buski]

For what it's worth, I'm skiing probably slower than you and at 15 off, and I love the S2. Really feels like an improvement for me and I've been skiing a lot more consistently on it.

[ToddF]

I upgraded to stargazer this year and use the entrance magnets setup and it works great.

16.95 90% of the time. It pulls my son 21 and 23 mph very consistently there as well. I didn't even calibrate those passes.

 

My wife throttles until it beeps and then lets go. I usually ease into it more but either way it seems to pull just fine.

 

I did have to invert the rpms otherwise it was horrible and I was going to sell it.

 

I don't have the Z box but I guess I am not that sensitive because I don't really notice significant difference between the two ZO and SG. I get the same amount of buoys either way.

 

 

[bigtallweed]

The other option to getting 8.0 module for no magnet timing would be to install magnets in the pubic course but both the turn balls and boat guides get cut off by non skiers using the course. Have people had success in mounting magnets in a manner they don't get damaged or cut off? As I said a hand timer works ok but I'm looking for a way to make it easier for people who drive the boat for me. If they forget to press the hand timer the pass is @ pregate speed which is half a mile per hour slow.

[Razorskier1]

@bigtallweed -- the trick speeds take 15 seconds to find home. It is quite annoying. For slalom I like it a lot (especially given the cost of a new ZO boat!). As for magnets, we do maintain them on a public course because everyone else who skis has PP classic. To keep them from getting cut we use a separate line for the magnets and the buoys, with the magnets about 2 feet underwater. That way if someone props a buoy line the magnets are usually untouched.

[bigtallweed]

Thanks razerskier1.When you attach a second line for the magnet, does it go to the boat guide as well to suspend the magnet or is there another way to hold it up?

[ToddF]

We tie one line on the magnet then the buoy line goes through the magnet, same as razorskier about two feet down or as far down as you can go before you lose the signal. This way is pretty hard to lose a magnet, even if it loses flotation it will still be attached.

 

We also have mix of pp zo and stargazer at our ski hole, plus jet skis and fishers who like to anchor off of them.

[BruceEmery]

For all that have SG with Zbox, try the light setting. This seems to have made a huge difference in the skiability of my friends 93 SN. Feels much like the newer boats ( without the big price tag).