Warning - Shell Rotella no longer has gasolene engine designation

[Kelvin]

@sunvalleylaw My 98 Response also called for 20w50. A few years later both Indmar and PCM switched their recommendations to 15w40. At the time, Indmar had a deal with Pennzoil and recommended the aforementioned unobtanium Pennzoil Marine 15w40.

[sunvalleylaw]

@oldjeep , yep. Weird, huh? I have had old Alfas and with the high output 4bangers, that oil was called. Never seen any other vehicle use it. But here it is:

http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w92/sunvalleylaw/BoatBoating/4F031AF5-05A1-4C4D-B3BE-BFD5BC4B2C83_zpsqdpoi8br.jpg~originalhttp://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w92/sunvalleylaw/BoatBoating/18CE358E-02CC-4903-855D-7D778AAA897E_zpscc2dxdhf.jpg~original

All the 350 variations in this manual seem to have 20w50 listed.

 

@Kelvin , yeah, prior owner switched over in 2008 or 2009.

 

 

 

 

[Rmengdahl]

I'll jump in here too. I have a picture of the 2006 Indmar Instructions along with a bottle of "triple protection" and service designation on the back....my worry is...what was the oil I put in the boat? (I've bought a few of these bottles each year) When did shell make the change?

 

[Rmengdahl]

 

 

[lwsmith]

fyi - PCM does not recommend synthetic oil.

[dbutcher]

@JGray I'm guessing that Shell folks are hesitant to comment for a forum??

[oldjeep]

FWIW, Delo 400 SDE gallons are 12.57 on Amazon prime right now. CK-4/SN rated so it is good for pretty much anything. I bought a few gallons last week. Pretty decent deal.

Delo 15w40 on amazon

[skierjp]

@lwsmith, WRONG, this is straight from the PCM manual

Page 23

Synthetic engine oils may be used in PCM engines. Synthetic oils must meet the Engine Oil Requirments for Classification and Viscosity listed below. The use of Synthetic oil DOES NOT permit the extension of oil change intervals!

FYI, this engine in most GM applications comes factory filled with synthetic oil.

[dbutcher]

There is at least one SAE 15W-40 diesel oil that says right on its bottle "For use in all gasoline automotive engines currently in use where a SAE 15W-40 that meets API SN is specified." It is Traveller brand sold at Tractor Supply. It's manufactured exclusively for Tractor Supply, and it's about $1 per quart less expensive than the majors. It comes in gallons and quarts. I've never used it, and I know nothing more about it. I am going to try it next oil change however.

[Zman]

@oldjeep I jumped on that Delo SDE gallon container deal as well. Awesome price for a gallon, and good stuff.

[skierjp]

Why you guys wouldn't use 15-50 Mobile 1 is beyond me? Going the cheap direction on oil is not very smart. You can do a Mobile 1 oil and filter change for under 50 bucks!

[oldjeep]

Because 15w50 doesn't meet the mfg specs?

[skiinxs]

.... but 15w40 Royal Purple synthetic does meet the weight and spec (it is SN). Link I usually do the 25 hr oil change on dino oil to help with break-in then switch to synthetic at the 75. I'm re-considering that and may go straight to synthetic on the 25. Like @skierjp mentioned, these engines are usually factory fill with synthetic in cars and seem to break-in fine. Oil is cheap (even synthetic), motors are not cheap! Synthetic out performs on all parameters, so what if it is overkill and costs a few pennies more.

[BrennanKMN]

Can we not turn this into a this oil is better than this oil thread?

 

How about we stick to alternatives to the 15w40 conventional oil we can no longer use.

[skierjp]

Yes it does meet the specs.

[skierjp]

Mobile 1 would be the alternative and no you do not want to extend the hours on your oil change because it it synthetic! The 15-40 or 15-50 is not going to make any difference. The same engine in a new truck is going to recommend 5-30.

[Jmoski]

Two thoughts:

 

1. the reason some of us are concerned is for those with older boats PCM explicitly states "synthetic oil is not recommended" and "use of improper oil may void your warranty".

 

It sure would be nice if PCM would officially revise their position for older engines like my 2006.

 

Likewise on transmission fluid as you can't buy certified dex 3 anymore, only dex 6, which guess what --- is synthetic! I agree both synthetic versions are superior, but they contradict manufacturer specs.

 

2. Why is okay to run a heavier weight oil (15-50) than what the engine is designed for?

 

Just my two cents...

 

 

 

 

[sunvalleylaw]

@JGray , did any information ever come back from your wife's contacts?

[JGray]

@sunvalleylaw sadly no. They came back with questions on our use case, we responded and it went silent. Will see if she can ping them again .

[sunvalleylaw]

@JGray , not that it matters that much. Seems like most of us are just going to move on. But just curious. If it is any sort of hassle for you or your wife, don't worry about it.

[rodecon]

So glad I saw this thread, thank you @skiinxs !

 

I have always used rotella t and would have just blindly kept using it had I not seen this!

 

Went to my local auto parts store and found that Valvoline 15w40 has the SN rating so am using that for this oil change

[BraceMaker]

If you guys want some random HD oils

John Deere makes the Plus-50 II - I run this in all sorts of older engines

Mystic JT-8 is also a high zinc diesel oil - both are SM/SN

 

[Mtea]

This older thread has some good oil discussion so I wanted to add a bit more. I too noted last year that the Shell Rotella T4 no longer had the proper designation for gas engines for my 2000 MC engine so I called my brother who worked at NAPA Auto Parts for 40 years for advice. Our conclusion after some research was that this was more a government change than and oil change in order to help catalytic converters last longer. My MC doesn’t have one so no brainer. As a backstop I phoned the nice folks at Indmar and they confirmed it. Use the T4 even with the new designation.

[jhughes]

Do note that for the 6L and 5.3DI and 6.2DI the new PCM oil recommendation is 5W30 Dexos2, which is basically any bulk 5W30 synthetic. Oreillys 5W30 synthetic, Amazon 5W30 synthetic, etc. makes things way easier for those engines.

[Jmoski]

The 15w-40 Dino oils used to get an exemption on exceeding the limit of phosphorus it contains to get the automotive S* certifications. the government stopped allowing the exemption, hence no more automotive cert... The phosphorus is what messes with catalytic converters...

 

 

[RAWSki]

We ran into this for our club boats too. Interesting if you dig into the PCM website FAQ's they seem to have changed the oil spec's for the 6L engine in 2020 compared to past engines where they suggested the same oil for the 6 and 5.7L models.

[RAK]

What oil is best for 6L 2016 PCM 15W/40?

[PatM]

@rak PCM changed their recommendations last year to 5w/30 full synthetic

[RAK]

@"Pat M" Thanks just got some 5W-30 fully synthetic.

[MopedMedicks]

Here is the thread with the service bulletin embedded from PCM regarding the change from 15W-40 to 5W-30. Apparently it’s mainly due oil pump failures:

 

https://www.ballofspray.com/forum#/discussion/22487/pcm-6-0-oil/p1

[vic]

I use 10w40 Rotella T6 oil in my 1998 Merc 350 powered Boat, my 2001 cummins diesel motorhome, My 1989 xjs V12 Jaguar and 1972 lawn tractor. no issues with the oil and never had a break down after switching engine over to it.

[vic]

I believe that Pennzoil makes shell Rotella not positive.

[vic]

please note there may be a different requirement in oil type if you have an enclosed cooling system running antifreeze as they run at a higher temperature then boats cooled by raw water. Raw water usually 160F or less.

[Windsurfnut]

There was a thread, on bobstheoilguy a while back where Shell responded directly to the zddp level question on T4 vs the previous T. ZDDP levels remained the same, which is really what was important to any of us running flat tappet cams (GT40, 351W etc) motors.

 

FWIW I use T4 in my GT40 Ski Nautique and Mecruiser 502 MAG in my Baja.

[vic]

I went to shell site and appears they are coming out with new synthetic oil so now they rate their oil as

5w30 for both gas and diesel

5w40 now rated for diesel (I do not think they changed formula)

5w20 for hD truck gas use for newer engines

some of this oil also come with 0w++ rating

Result is get the correct weight oil for your engine and brand does not matter as much.

I think that the new synthetic oils are far better then older oils as ever few years the rating goes up. Manufactures of most engines now say they can use synthetic oil and the many engines comes that way from factory.

[oldjeep]

FWIW - I switched over to Delo 15w40 (dino oil) a couple of years ago. Still has the auto rating and is about as cheap as Rotella T4. Still use the Synthetic Rotella T6 in all my motorcycles - works great and is way cheaper than most of the alternatives.

[Ski_Dad]

I know this is an old thread, but when I was oil shopping the other day I noticed that Rotella T4 has gas rating on it again - says API SP.    Just in case you like that brand.   I guess you can tell it's winter LOL

[Tandcc]

Pleasurecraft Engine Group is issuing this Service Advisory to update specifications for engine oil. IMPORTANT:  ALWAYS refer to the Owner's Operation and Maintenance manual or the Technical Data on our website for the appropriate specifications for your model engine. Find below the updated specifications for engine oil. ***All 6.0L, 6.0L HO, 7.4L LSX, 6.2L Supercharged, 5.3L DI and 6.2L DI engines require the use of SAE 5W-30 DEXOS GEN 2 formula oil.  These engines should be serviced with this weight and formula oil moving forward. These engines are designed specifically with use of DEXOS GEN 2 formula engine oil.  This formulation is now found in most major brands of engine oil.  Refer to the technical information on the website for your model engine to get the correct engine oil specifications.

Service Advisory Updated Specifications for Engine Oils #SAP2019-01     July 2019    

Prevailing Ambient     Recommended A.P.I.     Temperature     Classification & Viscosity     Above 50˚F     SAE 15W-40 “GF-4/SM”     Below 50˚F     SAE 5W-30 “GF-4/SM”

Engine Oil and Oil Filter Change Intervals     •     Initial oil change - 1st 60 days or 5-25 hours of operation, whichever occurs first     •     Regular oil changes - Every 50 hours of operation or 120 days, whichever occurs first     •     Heavy Duty High RPM / High Load Use - Every 30 hours of operation or 120 days, whichever occurs first NOTE: Never over-fill the engine with oil. Engines over-filled with oil can cause engine damage. IMPORTANT: The use of oils which contain “solid” additives, non-detergent oils or low quality oils specifically are not recommended. WARRANTY NOTICE:  Pleasurecraft Engines reserves the right to refuse warranty on part(s) and/or engine(s) damaged by using improper fuels and/or lubricants.

Engine Oil Requirements    

Prevailing Ambient     Recommended A.P.I.     Temperature     Classification & Viscosity     All Temperatures     DEXOS GEN 2  5W-30

Engine Oil Requirements

Published by Pleasurecraft Engine Group Training Services. Pleasurecraft's policy of continued improvement creates dated information and necessitates changes in procedures, specifications and methods used in trouble shooting and repair. In the event you have any questions regarding any of our products, the most up to date information may be obtained by contacting our service department to insure that any published information in your possession has not been updated. The information in the publication is believed to be true and correct at the time of publication. This publication is for informational purposes only and does not constitute a guarantee or warranty or in any way change or modify the written warranty, which is attached to Pleasurecraft Products at the time of sale. The knowledge of this publication, the information revealed herein and/or the possession of this publication grants no license or authority to anyone to perform any action or make any statement or commitment, beyond the specific instructions stated herein, in behalf of or in the name of Pleasurecraft Engine Group. It is the sole responsibility of those using the information contained herein, to follow industry standard and common sense safety procedures when using the information contained herein and those using the information contained herein agree to defend and hold Pleasurecraft Engine Group harmless in all cases where injury and/or damage may occur during the use and/or application of the information contained herein.

***All model engines not found above, i.e. Ford GT40, 5.7L and 8.1L.  These engines should continue to be serviced with the weight and formula oil found below.

Engine Oil and Oil Filter Change Intervals     •     Initial oil change - 1st 60 days or 25 hours of operation, whichever occurs first     •     Regular oil changes - Every 50 hours of operation or 120 days, whichever occurs first     •     Heavy Duty High RPM / High Load Use - Every 30 hours of operation or 120 days, whichever occurs first NOTE: Never over-fill the engine with oil.  Engines over-filled with oil can cause engine damage.

NOTICE:  This DOES NOT require an immediate oil change to these engines with the updated specification.  This advisory is to serve as notification that during the next required service interval, use DEXOS GEN 2 SAE 5W-30 for the engine oil change.

[Jmoski]

FYI, dexos gen 3 has replaced gen 2.  I could only find gen 3 this past Fall when I winterized.

[Dano]

Interesting that they list the GT40 as requiring 5w30 now.   Didn’t they previously call for 15w40?  

[dvskier]

@Dano Absolutely, I’ve used Rotella 15-40 for over 25 years. No problems at all.

[Dano]

@dvskier  Ya I know most were using 15w40.  I was pointing out that PCM is now recommending 5w30 for the gt40.    

[Jmoski]

@Dano I don’t see the post above changing guidance for the gt40?  

 The bottom section of the PCM guidance post above for “others like gt40” is incomplete as it specifies the change interval only.  You can see on the PCM site, the service advisory notice on this still shows 15w40 for the gt40 (above 50 degrees F)

The switch to dexos 5w30 from 15w40 is for the newer DI engines.  This is where the “Notice” at the bottom regarding change it at the next interval is relevant.

[Dano]

@Jmoski thanks,  I didn’t realize the quote was incomplete.  I thought it was new info since PCM’s 2019 advisory.