Almost bought a boat

[aspski]

Well gang I am quite disappointed today. I had talked with a guy selling a 2007 Malibu Response LXI, we had negotiated price and I was going to test drive it saturday morning. Got up in the am to make sure all was good to go and he said the boat sold the night before to some buyer who emailed the money friday night without even seeing the boat. I hate dealing with people sometimes. I had the cash ready to go, we had a handshake agreement, I have storage, insurance and everything else ready to go. Heres hoping I can find something just as nice prior to summer next year. I am super bitter right now and I hope the engine grenades next time the boat is turned on

 

[keithh2oskier]

Yeh same thing happened to me when I bought my nautique. Had an agreement lined up and then he sold it to another guy. What really chapped my ass was he was in my dads waterski club and sold it to some random dude. But it worked out in the end and I got a newer boat (TSC2 instead of TSC1) for less money. When I bought mine I think I mailed him a good faith check until we could get the deal done a week later.

[oldjeep]

Cash is king when selling anything, a non contingent deal beats one contingent on a test drive. Personally I always tell potential buyers that the boat/car/whatever is for sale until someone plunks the money in my hand.

[liquid d]

Nothing used is sold until you've got cash in hand

[John Brooks]

I've had too many sellers fall through and I agree with @oldjeep , if the money is in my hand, sold.

[aspski]

Still annoying that he didn't even give me a chance. Oh well, a better boat will come up.

 

Anyone have a nice mid 2000s Response for sale in Western Canada?

[Than_Bogan]

Agree re cash BUT why not give the first guy a chance to outbid? (Serious question; I have relatively little experience buying or selling boats.)

[Booze]

To me, a verbal agreement is a handshake and a deal. Unless the seller explicitly says, if someone else walks up with cash the deal is off.

Happened to me recently. We agreed on a deal but the seller dude said he was busy that evening, and I told him ok, I would call in the morning. When I did, he said boat was gone.

 

You either stand by your word or you don't. No excuses.

[DavidN]

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but for me a handshake is a done deal. Period.

And that's for both sides!

[LeonL]

If I were the seller in this situation I would have contacted @aspski and told him I need the money tonight, because of the new guy on the line, before I took the next Guy's money. You can't let a buyer slip away, but some level of integrity and commitment seems to be in order. Like @DavidN said, I'm kinda old fashioned.

[BraceMaker]

Two way street, as a buyer it sucks when someone sells stuff out from under you;

But the number of times a buyer has held me hostage through the weekend to come look at my stuff only to low ball or not bring cash or not even show up.

 

I won't come up in my offer when people play that game, they're usually trying to play you against them anyhow.

[LeonL]

I hate selling anything. I can't count the times I've had a potential buyer make an appointment and just not show up. That's why I wouldn't be able handle being on the promo program. Pressure to sell every year and then dealing with tire kickers and jerk offs.

[Bdecker]

A handshake deal with no other contingency is different than an agreed price prior to test drive. If the scenario was a handshake and you were just getting the bank check, then I think the seller should have called you. Doesn’t sound like that was the case here. Selling anything is a pain. Buyers flake out all the time.

[jhughes]

Hey the silver lining here is that you now do not own a 2007 LXi! A plus for certain. Now you can consider the many other boats in that price range that are better than that boat.

 

I also agree that cash on premise takes the deal. People are way too flaky these days. When I buy something big like this I always say "if the deal goes through it's meant to be". Sometimes a missed deal is the best thing that ever happened.

[dvskier]

I agree with@Bdecker, you hadn't performed the "test drive" and the buyer obviously had no such constraints. I usually tell the buyer that the first person with cash is the owner. There will be other boats that suit your needs down the road. Best time to buy in my opinion is Nov-Feb. I understand you're in Canada and that could make a water test difficult.

[FSSPCat]

@apskier I had the same thing happen to me in June. Luckily, an even better boat/deal came about. Was that the 07 on Kijiji?

[igkya]

@aspski, what would you have done if once you showed up for the test drive and the boat wasn't as expected? Would you still have bought it at the negotiated price? Cash (in hand) is KING!

[aspski]

@FSSPCat Yeah it was the 07 on kijiji. The owner actually contacted me about it prior to putting up the add since I have a "looking for" posting on kijiji.

[aspski]

@jhughes Not a fan of the lxi's? What other boats in that price range should I keep an eye out for? I love to slalom ski, but also like to surf and board, or just relax all day on the water with friends

[Chef23]

@aspski the LXI is a great boat for what you want. The only issue with the 07 is if you want to ski the course I don't think the 07/ had ZO they are PP Stargazer boats.

[MISkier]

@Chef23, an 07 can be converted to ZO. It's the first year Malibu that can be.

[bigskieridaho]

Yep was searching for a boat for my parents and the same thing happened. I threw cash down on mine right when I saw it in the add. Good luck and throw it down when you find one.

[Chef23]

@MISkier I understand you are correct but I think it requires a new ECM in addition to ZO. Still cheaper than a repower.

[oldjeep]

It is actually possible to ski without ZO

[braindamage]

There is always another boat. Keep looking and you will find the right one.

[Ski_Dad]

i had a few buying experiences like that in the past. 6 years ago i was pretty upset at a sour deal and then we got a really nice deal a few weeks later. It was a great boat for us for 5 years.

 

I can tell you that Malibu is a great ski boat - i got a 2003 Sunsetter LXI with Perfect Pass this spring and it skies nicer than most of my friends boats. Well except for my friend that has a Nautique 200

[Chef23]

@oldjeep I mostly ski without ZO as I have a 2002 Malibu LX. However if I was buying a boat as new as an 07 I would pay a little more to get an 08 with ZO.

[aspski]

Will I notice a difference between ZO and perfect pass? I usually free ski as most lakes near me don't have a course. Would love to step up to the course but will a regular cruise control still do the trick?

 

[Nando]

Another thread that makes me feel thankful for the guy I recently bought a boat from- he got another offer, but told the guy that because I had expressed interest first, he wouldn't accept the second offer until after talking to me. Then he apologized to me because he didn't want to pressure me. This was only a couple of weeks after making an offer on a boat and having the owner call me the morning I was going to drive out to buy it and tell me he'd sold it the day before because the guy had cash- well, so did I, but after all was said and done, I feel better about giving my cash to the guy i did...

[foxriverat]

If you plan on training for tournaments and have the budget get a zo boat. I`m 5.7 160 ski 22 off 30 mph and I cant feel the difference between zo or perfect pass. My buddy who`s 6.0 225 and gets into 28 off can feel the differnence as he pulls much harder. Before ZO came around pp was used in tournaments.

[david_quail]

I'm just starting, getting 32MPH, 15off, and 30MPH, 22 off this year, but can totally tell the difference between ZO and PP.

I constantly switch between skiing behind my PP Nautique 196 at a public lake (mostly in the course but a bit of free skiing) and then behind a new 200 with ZO at a private ski club. Each time I switch, it takes me a few passes to get used to it, especially switching back to the ZO boat which will simply not give back anything, regardless how hard I pull.

 

I agree with @foxriverat about getting a ZO if you plan on tournaments. But IMO both are fantastic to ski the course and learn behind. They're just different.

[skiboat38]

No deposit=no deal. (In my experience with 28 promo boats) Also as soon as they say...I'm willing to offer or I can buy one similar for, I hear...this conversation is over

[BrennanKMN]

Like others have said if you have any intention of getting into the tournament scene ZO is a must.

 

I upgraded to a ZO boat this year and I should have done it sooner. I do not notice a huge different in the pull, but I am a light skier and was able to adapt easily after a few set adjustment period.

 

What I notice is consistency. Holy smokes is it nice to have the same pull every single pass. 1 person in the boat or 4 people in the boat - same pull. Head wind/tail wind - same pull. I have a course with a really short setup and at 36 MPH PP would overshoot it every time if you were not perfect with throttle placement. ZO has completely eliminated that problem.

 

If you are not skiing in the course 75% or more of your sets or don't have any intentions of running tournaments I would say ZO is a nice to have but PP would be absolutely fine too. Everyone is different, but for free skiing I see little benefit to getting ZO over PP.

[swc5150]

When I hear "I'm not willing to entertain any offers" my conversation is over:)

[Chef23]

@aspski if you are free skiing then ZO vs PP probably won't make that much of a difference.

[Shell]

@aspski i have a mint condition 92 Ski Nautique, see SIA for the listing

[BrennanKMN]

Like others have said if you have any intention of getting into the tournament scene ZO is a must. 

 

I upgraded to a ZO boat this year and I should have done it sooner. I do not notice a huge different in the pull, but I am a light skier and was able to adapt easily after a few set adjustment period. 

 

What I notice is consistency. Holy smokes is it nice to have the same pull every single pass. 1 person in the boat or 4 people in the boat - same pull. Head wind/tail wind - same pull. I have a course with a really short setup and at 36 MPH PP would overshoot it every time if you were not perfect with throttle placement. ZO has completely eliminated that problem. 

 

If you are not skiing in the course majority of the time or don't have any intentions of running tournaments I would say ZO is a nice to have by PP would be absolutely fine too. Everyone is different, but for free skiing I see little benefit to getting ZO over PP.

 

[Nando]

To echo @BrenanKMN's comment, I also am glad I upgraded to a ZO boat, but until I read comments here about mapping my course, the accuracy on a short setup wasn't as apparent. If you don't map your course, you're not taking full advantage of ZO. (I know 'cause I didn't at first- the difference is noticeable.)

[gregy]

The TXI skis better and addressed some quality issues. I think the guy did you a favor.

[Nando]

I agree with @gregy that the guy probably did you a favor- if you feel like you were screwed by a guy who didn't sell you a boat, you probably would have been screwed worse by buying his boat. When I was boat shopping a guy whose boat I didn't buy, but who was very upfront about the entire process (he's a baller) told me to talk with any seller of a ski boat enough to tell if he's a real skier who knows ski boats and that will tell you all you need to know about the guy.

[DW]

@apskier : I hope you find your ideal boat and sorry the deal did not work out. As noted cash is king and I would put yourself in his shoes, if you did not like the boat after the test drive, he would have missed two opportunities to sell his vessel. Perhaps you did him a favor, you comment on hoping it grenades, perhaps he may have worried you may be the unhappy customer and it simply would not have been a favorable transaction in the end.

[LeonL]

@aspski "hoping it grenades", you sure are bitter. The buyer didn't do anything wrong.

[aspski]

@LeonL Yup, Was really pissed how it all went down. Oh well, I am over it now.

 

Anyone have a nice boat for sale in Western Canada?

 

[oldjeep]

Well, there is an 04 LXI for sale in MN. Not exactly Canada but the price seems right - vinyl needs some stitching repaired in a couple spots. Oddly enough this is identical in color to the 04 LXI that my inlaws own. Only difference is that the one on CL has an Indmar motor and the inlaws have a Merc Black Scorpion and the inlaws have a glass platform.

2004 LXI in Sleepy Eye MN

 

 

[MISkier]

Check with @bananaron. I believe he has a boat for sale.

[bananaron]

@aspski I sent you a email and msg about a 2003 Malibu Response LX........Pristine condition

[wtrskr]

I had a similar situation. Guy sold a boat out from under me after we had agreed that he would sell it to me for a specific price, assuming no major issues became apparent after being looked at by a mechanic. The guy sold it before we were able to get the boat to a service shop to be looked at.

 

A lawyer told me at the time that a verbal agreement is binding by law. The problem is trying to prove in the court of law what was agreed upon. In my case, I had an e-mail exchange with the seller that I was able to dig up to prove that he didn't hold up his end of the bargain.

 

I sent him a message and it must have scared the crap out of him. To make up for it, the seller ended up sending me a check for difference between dollar amount we had agreed upon and the extra amount (small) that the second guy purchased the boat for. I had made the suggestion that doing so would be fair recourse. My friends joked afterwards that I was able to get a guy to pay me money for not buying his boat.

 

Worked out in the end that I got a slightly newer and better boat and I'm very happy that I did. Second time I gave the seller a small down payment to cement the deal until he was able to deliver the boat and I was able to get him cash.

[BrennanKMN]

Every time I have sold a boat the buyer put a cash down payment on the boat. Typically $500. That is our agreement that I am holding the boat for them until we meet to transfer titles and the rest of the money via cashiers check. Without that the boat is still for sale in my eyes. I also let any potential buyers know that when they come look and leave without a deposit.

 

When I sold my old Sea Ray I had several potential buyers all looking at the boat at the same time. Once the first guy put the cash in my hands we were pending sale until it either went through or fell through.

[oldjeep]

That is pretty much the way it went when I bought/sold my last and current boat.

 

The one I bought I saw the ad on craigslist, called immediately and set up an appointment to look at it later that day. She said that another person was coming to look at it at 5:00 so I left work early and made sure I was there at 3:00. While I was looking at it she got 2 other calls about it, so I wrote her a check for 15K to hold it a couple of days until I got the loan worked out. Had I not given her the deposit I have no doubt that it would have been sold to someone else that same day. The boat was a real deal, I didn't even negotiate. This was all in Jan, so a test drive was not possible - but she had what was basically a promo deal with the local dealer and flipped her boats every couple years.

 

Selling my boat I had a bunch of people emailing back and forth, mostly dozens of looky loos asking dumb questions like - "what is the lowest you'll take". Jeebus people, look at the boat and then negotiate. Had a couple of them come out and take a look. Guy wanted me to hold it until he could water test it (still Jan), I told him that the boat was for sale until it was sold and if it was still sitting in my garage in Mid April that I'd give him a call. He didn't seem to understand why I wasn't willing to hold it for him even with a deposit. Next guy comes out and looks, his only condition is that I have to store it for him until late march - pays on the spot, I handed him the titles told him to get some insurance and he came to pick it up in March.

 

My points if I have one (or three)

1) You snooze you lose. If you find a used boat you are interested in, make the call and then hop in the truck ASAP so that you can be the first guy there.

2) A lot of people immediately flip the idiot bit on people who are trying to negotiate price via email before ever seeing the boat. I typically don't even respond unless the email reads something like - If you will take $X I will come out and buy it today.

3) People are trying to sell their stuff - anything that you are doing that is delaying putting money in their hand is making it more likely someone else is going to get the boat/car/whatever.

[FSSPCat]

@aspski DM'd you.