Radar Feather Frame convert to Aluminum Plate?

[ToddL]

Does anyone know or have successfully rebuild/converted a Radar feather frame binding to an aluminum plate?

[Slalom.Steve]

Which Radar binding? I did this once with an HRTP, sort of.
I tried a C-85 ski, and the front holes on the ski lined up fine with the feather frame, but the rear holes were too far back. So I did this, feather frame on top and aluminum plate under it:

The first set of screws is a normal mounting screw (though longer since it has to run through both plates), and it screws into the ski "like normal," holding down both the feather frame and the aluminum frame at once. The 2nd set of screws is a countersunk screw pointing up through the aluminum plate and the feather frame, with a nut on the other side holding it tight. This serves to attach the feather frame to the plate. Then the back screws are normal mounting screws that go through only the aluminum plate into the ski, but now far enough back to reach the rear holes on the ski.

Unfortunately I don't seem to have a picture of the bottom before mounting it, but this is how it looked on the ski:

This definitely adds height/thickness, since it has both the aluminum and the feather frame. I'd expect that the change in rear foot height would have an effect of some sort, but I don't know enough to comment how or how much. Also the head of the "upside down" screw seemed flush with the bottom of the plate, but the screw head still ended up marking the ski a little bit, I imagine just since the plate gets held down so tightly. That could possibly be mitigated maybe with some kind of pad on the screw head, or sanding down the screw head or something so it doesn't actually contact the ski even when the plate is tightened down.

I didn't end up keeping the ski, so I didn't trial this set up in the long-term. I don't see any reason it wouldn't have held up though.

[ToddL]

This is the same problem I am trying to solve for the skier:  Rear binding will not get close enough to the front binding.  Thanks for the insight.

 

[skialex]

I have successfully turned a rear feather frame to a front aluminum. Apart from the 4 screws through the 4 corners of the boot, I run a 5th screw through the middle of the like Radar does. Prong nuts on top, nothing sticking out, red loctite to be safe and keep everything in place. That was for a beginner slalom skier looking to put a ski together in the cheap.

[skialex]

2 hours ago, skialex said:

I have successfully turned a rear feather frame to a front aluminum. Apart from the 4 screws through the 4 corners of the boot, I run a 5th screw through the middle of the like Radar does. Prong nuts on top, nothing sticking out, red loctite to be safe and keep everything in place. That was for a beginner slalom skier looking to put a ski together in the cheap.

Have found a picture…

[Stevie Boy]

@ToddL No need to convert Feather Frame to Aluminuim.

For people who do not have a size 10 or 12 foot all of the adjustable RTP,s you cannot get your foot fwd, I cut approx 1 inch off, of the front of the feather frame but made sure I could get the last hole , see photo,s

I am a size 8UK size - 9 USA - size 42 EU

Edited September 4, 2023 by Stevie Boy

[Slalom.Steve]

Ah yeah, @ToddL if the need is just to get the boot closer to the front, there's a better solution, as @Stevie Boyhighlighted - cut down the feather frame.

I don't know why Radar has the HRT footbed/frame extend so far forward, it seems to be more than anyone would need. I cut down the rubber and the feather frame on my HRT (and even shaved a bit off the back of my front boot T-Factor plate), so I could get front and back boot closer: 

As compared to stock:

The stock frame has 5 holes, and I shaved mine down to three holes. I have size 10.5US foot and my toe still doesn't go past the end of the rubber footbed. Just use a grinder or a sawzall or maybe even a beefy dremel. As Stevie said, just make sure you have enough length to still reach the back inserts - I'm on the farthest back hole on the feather frame, like in Stevie's image.

[ToddL]

The ski in question is a 66" 2016 Vapor.  The factor location for the front boot is 29.25.   For the skier, we settled on 29.33-ish.  So, while the front binding is as far forward as possible, it is not far off stock.  It's just the feather frame mounting holes are not in harmony with the Vapor inserts.  Likewise, the rear boot is maxed forward.  However for the skier's small feet, this means a sizable gap between the boots, which is what I would like to address.   Pics below.   It looks like my only options are to move them to vapor/carbitex boots or manually attach an aluminum plate under the feather frame as noted in some of the responses above.  

[ToddL]

So, I found a Radar rear plate.  I discovered that the holes sort of lined up.   So, I mounted the rear of the feather frame to the plate and them mounted both to the ski.   The bolts in back are too long, so I'll source something better or cut them more flush.  This is good enough for the skier to try it out.  

No mods needed to either plate or feather frame.   I used slightly longer bolts in the front which go through both plates and into the inserts.  The bolts in the back are flat head and fit perfectly into the countersunk slots of the aluminum plate so, the ski surface is protected.  

 

 

 

Edited September 6, 2023 by ToddL
Fixed the photos

[Stevie Boy]

Good job, should be able to source some Domed nuts on Amazon or Ebay for the rear

[skialex]

Good job, but not a lightweight boot anymore. Another thing I have done before… I cut off the rear of an aluminum plate, S bent it so it can sit flat over the rear of the feather frame and the rest of it to sit flat on the ski over the rear inserts. Almost what you have done but the cut off aluminum goes over the rear plastic of the feather frame. Countersunks through both plates and reverse nuts on top. Nothing sticking out.

[BraceMaker]

@skialex not sure if you have something like this in europe but we have several companies like

https://sendcutsend.com/ that water jet and laser cut materials.

So you draw up what you need using a free software like onshape (note the drawing below was a ~10 second sketch where I didn't constrain or dimension anything if you were going to do this you would actually take measurements and lay out some construction lines with real measurements from your ski)

 

Then you export it from there to a cutting service....

 

You can have whatever shape you want with the holes you want (for the ski inserts, for the boot?) you can add countersinks to things like aluminum plate or just do it yourself.  And you can make those oblonged or slots.

 

Point being very easy to make yourself custom binding plates for ~30 bucks in about 1 beers worth of taking dimensions w/ a caliper.

 

 

Edited September 7, 2023 by BraceMaker

[skialex]

@BraceMaker yes there is such service, I have send a file with angle gauges to a water jet cut company.

they came out great, but I now printing them with my 3d Prusa printer. 
for the above, I have plenty of new and used plates, front and rear and cutting a piece with an angle grinder is an easy job for me, without needing to outsource it.

but yes, yours is a good idea!

thanks!