What Vintage Slalom Boat has the smallest wake?

[SC skier]

Hi there,  I am new to this forum.  I am looking to buy a vintage ski boat to slalom exclusively.  I don't ski buoy courses much or shorten the rope that often.  I do want a boat with fiberglass stringers (no wood).  My desire is to get a boat with a very small wake so this old man can cross without getting banged up too much.  I have heard 97-09 Ski Nautique  and 91-94 Prostar produce the smallest wake.    Is that the consensus in here?  Am I overlooking  manufacturers I should consider?  I do not mind a project boat and might even prefer it so I can put in all new components, overhaul engine, etc.  Anyhow, I am glad I stumbled on this forum and thanks in advance for your reply.

[Horton]

I don't know if you're committed to a much older boat, but the absolute grand champion of best wakes at all speeds was the Centurion Carbon Pro. 

[SC skier]

What range of years of Carbon Pro do you recommend?

[Mastercrafter]

I agree with 97-09 196 and 91-94 Prostar. 

I am a Mastercraft fan but would choose the Nautique. 

Haven't skied a Carbon Pro but that Horton guy knows his stuff. 

 

[UWSkier]

59 minutes ago, SC skier said:

What range of years of Carbon Pro do you recommend?

There was only ever one Carbon Pro hull so they all ski pretty much the same.  For use case, the 5.7L would be fine.  Nice thing about those engines is parts are plentiful and cheap.

Older than that, bubble butt Nautique gets my vote.  I'm a Malibu guy and my '01 Response has a great wake that doesn't really limit anyone, but not as great as the Nautique from that era.

[DvarianDan Johnson]

@SC skier your identified years of Nautique and MC are the overwhelming favorites. No need to complicate further. Go ski

[Rednucleus]

Help us spend your hard earned money - what's your budget?

AND welcome to BOS!!

[S1Pitts]

The carbon pro is probably the only hull I would consider updating from my 97 BB Nautique . The one I have skied behind had analogue gauges and a ZO stand alone HMI controller that probably (hopefully) will have support much longer from EControls  than the different ZO integrated HMI units currently being used by the boat mfg's. 

[dvskier]

I agree with the Carbon Pro having the softest, smallest wakes. I have a 2004 SN 196 and mine are pretty low and soft as well but the CP is the best for wakes.

[DvarianDan Johnson]

This is a guy who is going to be skiing long line, no buoys, at slower speeds. Not trying to be mean just honestly straightforward, he likely has no practical knowledge of "small wakes" etc.   He just wants to avoid the Four Winds type monsters so as not to die trying to cross. We're making this way more complicated than it needs to be, dissecting minute differences between Nautique vs MC vs Carbon pro - where skiing all at longline and 30 I'd bet he couldn't even feel a difference.  He's a casual non course rec skier. @SC skier - go buy any of these and you'll have a wonderful life!    

[SC skier]

Thanks all for the replies.  Yes mostly long lines at 36 mph.  

lol.  I think I would sink at 30mph.  

[sgregg]

 

Long line “lifer” here with a bad back who has had the good fortune to sample the 15-off wake behind pretty much everything that has been mentioned including the Carbon Pro  - the only way someone is getting our Bubble Back is by prying it out of my cold dead hands 😊

 

 

[RAWSki]

I owned a Carbon Pro and the wakes at slalom speed were really good as mentioned.  But if you want to go "way back" I might give the nod to a '94 ProStar 190 the wakes from 30-36 might have even been better. 

[aupatking]

I’ve got a 99 Malibu Response that puts out a great wake I’d let go. It is a project, not engine, but interior needs new skins. I love skiing behind it but I have a 2002 Nautique with Zero Off that I’m never letting go. My plan was to convert the Malibu to ZO as well and let it live at my river house but throwing money at it right now is not an option. 

[Taynton]

In my experience, although limited, the response at 15 off was one of my favorites, maybe not the smallest but the softest and easiest to cross for sure. My Brendella shortline comp comes in second, Ive always found the bubble butt nautiques and pretty much all of the newer boats a bit more robust at the 15 off mark. Im only a few seasons into skiing the course so take that into consideration but I am really sensitive to the wakes (probably because my technique is lacking)

[Ski_Dad]

91-94 has no wake at 28 off and shorter from watching my friend ski but lots of spray.  It really good at 15 off too.  I think I would have a Natuique 97+ b/c of a hair more room and not as much spray.   Feel the nautique has a slight advantage at longer lengths and slower speeds and tracks better.

[6balls]

If at 36 mph shoot ski 15 off.  Wake will be butter behind any of your choices there.

[jjackkrash]

Don't forget to drive the boat.  Lots of boats are great from the handle but the driver needs to put it down the middle and be comfortable doing it.  And as the boat ages so does the steering and throttle (unless that has been replaced) and other items.  I ski behind some well taken care of old boats, but there is a wide, wide range of conditions of these boats as they age.  

[swbca]

Master Craft advertised the 1986 Pro Star as the first NO WAKE slalom boat.  The 86 was the first year with the Rainbow Graphics.   I bought one because I had just had meniscus surgery on both knees from 10 years of skiing behind Nautiques.   The 86 wake was like a flat bottom race boat.  It also turned like a race boat. It turned with G's and no roll at speed.   Everyone now says it had terrible tracking but I didn't know better at the time. 

[MISkier]

Boats I would consider:

1991-1992 MasterCraft Prostar 190 (great wake, carbureted engine)

1993-1994 MasterCraft Prostar 190 (fuel injection, softer wake, but some spray at shorter lines)

1995 MasterCraft Prostar 205 (essentially the same wake as the 1994 190)

1995-1997 MasterCraft Prostar 190 (firmer wake, but less spray)

1997-2005  Nautique 196  (great wake, great tracking)

1999-2009 Malibu Response LX (low, firm wake and still easy to cross for beginner)

2014+ Centurion Carbon Pro (great wake)

I've skied an old American Skier that was quite good, but you are probably getting into wood construction and I would avoid that unless you know the previous owner and how the boat was maintained.

No experience with other non-big 3 boats.  I had inconsistent experiences with the Malibu LXi.  Some were good, some were not.  You want to ski and drive any boat you are considering, though.

Full disclosure:  I have owned a 2000 MasterCraft 205 and still own a 2009 Malibu Response LX.  The 205 was very good, but couldn't get ZO.  It did also have more of a 22 off bump than anything else listed above.

For those wondering why I didn't go beyond 2005 with the Nautique, I skied some later models that had some wake issues and wasn't sure if those were one-off quality issues or some change affecting the wake design.

I didn't list any newer boats (other than the Carbon Pro), because the pricing changes substantially.

Edited: I accidentally omitted the 1999-2004 Malibu Sunsetter LXi (you must get the model with the cantilevered stern), which has a wake very similar to the Malibu Response LX hull upon which it rides.

Edited March 9 by MISkier

[2dwoods]

Sc skier if your interested I have 98 bb Nautique if you like to check it out on lake murray ,this is killing me writing this .

[Jody_Seal]

we have a 99 SN in our club getting the 5.7Excalibur/zo treatment. looking forward to skiing it. current two boats we utilize are a 2017 6.2 200 and a 2008 196. both great wakes. I heard about a 200 that recently sold for under $30K (no trailer).

Lots of great ski boats out their for sale this spring.

[DvarianDan Johnson]

91-94 MC's are the same hull. Changed again in 95 

[MISkier]

@DvarianDan Johnson, I probably should have included that clarification in my post.  Thanks.  I separated the carbureted versus injected engines.

[Minelickskier]

91-94 prostar…

[RAWSki]

A few California "sleepers" might include the MB190 boss  and the MB200LS

The Tige 2000comp and 2002slm  (Those are models not years)

And Centurion Falcons, LaPoints and the Eclipse. (same hulls with tweaks)

(The original Tiges and Falcons were all made by Fineline-Centurion)

[jjackkrash]

Don't forget the Ski Brendella!  (Started using an MC hull mold IIRC).  

[Dano]

I have a Falcon.  I think its wakes are really good.  Low and soft.  Tracking isn’t that bad and there’s next to no spray. Its beam is a bit wider than most of that era, so it’s not as prone to weight distribution.  The boat is like an Indy car on water as long as the water is flat.  It really is a rough ride in choppy water is the only complaint I have. I’m not sure but I think the falcons and the Tige’s share the same Hull produced by Fineline as @RAWSki already mentioned. I don’t know what the differences would be outside of the branding.

[Rednucleus]

If you don't need alot of room and bells & whistles, the Malibu Sportster is a fine ski boat and handles like a sports car. Both my buddies have one - a '98 and '01. Lots of free skiing and fine in the course as well. Great for barefooting.

[JAS]

Bubble Butt no question.

[kmenard]

@RAWSki I think the Tige SLM is a total sleeper boat!

[BraceMaker]

8 minutes ago, kmenard said:

@RAWSki I think the Tige SLM is a total sleeper boat!

I've looked at two in the last 5 years but they both had rotten stringers.  Unfortunately I feel like the people who bought then worked em hard and put them away wet.

[stevezie]

We have a 2001 Centurion Eclipse and the wake is extremely small.  I'm sure many will disagree but I would put the wake up against any of the very best boats.  The people who disagree are probably making assumptions and haven't actually skied behind one (there aren't many out there).  It's a bit of a unique boat for that generation because it's significantly wider than others giving it a really large interior and somewhat functional bow compared to others from that generation.  With the added space, it's a really good family ski boat.  It's got absolutely great wakes at low speeds.  My kids don't like skiing behind my 2014 Prostar and want to ski behind the Centurion solely because the wakes are so much smaller at slow speed.  It's got a Mercruiser engine also so parts are super easy to get as well.  

The downside is it's extremely tricky to drive well.  Free skiing is fine but driving in a course is really difficult.  Ours is extremely twitchy with small inputs.  Perhaps someone better at boat set up could improve it but our efforts have failed.  It's also absolutely terrible in any kind of rough water.  I'm not talking ski boat terrible.  It's worse than your typical ski boat.  Not only is it very flat, the deep chines down the edges of the bow act like a tri hull and seem to trap the wave energy instead of pushing it out to the sides.  It rattles and shakes like crazy but has no stress cracks.  The vinyl is thin and the hardware and build quality is typical Centurion stuff.  

It's a great free skiing boat and a great family ski boat, which is unique for this generation.  It's perfect for the 765 acre lake we are on.  

[bananaron]

I have bought and sold all of the older boats and one of my favs would be my 2001 GEKKO GTR.Fantastic wake at all line lengths and you can buy one and it won't drain your bank acct.....

[Dano]

@stevezie You summed Centurion up pretty good.  Great wakes, rough ride.  If you have calm water these boats skied really well.  The Falcon hull was a great skiing boat with very little spray.  Wood stringers was one of the negative to them as well.  I think the Tru Tracs and Lapoints were very similar and I'd expect them to ski very well too.  I believe the Eclipse was a continuation of the Falcon hull but was composite construction and open bow.

[RAWSki]

2 hours ago, Dano said:

@stevezie You summed Centurion up pretty good.  Great wakes, rough ride.  If you have calm water these boats skied really well.  The Falcon hull was a great skiing boat with very little spray.  Wood stringers was one of the negative to them as well.  I think the Tru Tracs and Lapoints were very similar and I'd expect them to ski very well too.  I believe the Eclipse was a continuation of the Falcon hull but was composite construction and open bow.

@stevezie agree with your review completely I had a 2000 Eclipse and it was always praised for its wakes and pull.  It had the Scorpion Merc and cruise control plus a lot of torque filed onto the rudder made it pretty decent to drive in the course but it still took some skill.   A really hard right turn also invited a "chine flop" but I never found it felling unsafe.......@Dano The Eclipse did have basically the same running surface as the Falcons-Lapoints but they widened and lengthened it above the water line.  It was almost 20'8"!  

 

[ALPJr]

91 - 94 PS 190. If you want to get technical a 91 - 94 with the 1/1 tranny, which is ~50 lbs lighter than the powerslot, and the 1.1 shaft is another ~8 lbs lighter. Small and fluffy. 

[schafer]

On 3/9/2024 at 2:06 PM, JAS said:

Bubble Butt no question.

How had nobody said this sooner. 
driving and skiing it’s the best “old” boat for slalom. 

[Drago]

4 hours ago, schafer said:

How had nobody said this sooner. 
driving and skiing it’s the best “old” boat for slalom. 

Sarcasm? (The first sentence)

[jhughes]

Anyone driving the 91-94 MC and the bubble back SN (or even a NWZ SN) back to back would never look at the MC again. Sometimes you just don't want to meet your heroes. Trust me.
 

It seems like CC was the only manufacturer who designed anything with the driver in mind for a very long time. 

[Dano]

@jhughes not everybody is in love with Cc.  Other brands drive fine too. They are just different. Other wakes are great too.  Cc to me is a great boat but I just don’t see it as being leaps and bounds ahead of others.  Having skied the bubble butts that everybody raves about, I think it has some great wakes but I don’t think they are so much better than other brands that the other brands are irrelevant.