Vapor Boots

[yardsale]

Just curious, how do these release? ...say when a guy goes out the front....

 

 

I've been on powershells for many years and that has a pretty obvious plan b with the interlock.

[ToddL]

For me, when I go out the front, both feet come out with the liners still on my feet. Thus, the liners release from the shells.

 

There is a lot of comments on prior threads expressing the importance of proper bungie cord lacing technique. Basically, the fore foot laces are kept tight, the ankle laces are kept loose. Individual preference is a factor. My advice is to keep the top laces as loose as possible but tight enough that they laces do not get popped out of the top hooks during skiing. This is probably much looser than the tension spec provided by Radar. I've never felt disconnected using this method. There isn't any pre-release concern. The bottom laces provide the tip control and the side stiffness of the bindings proved edge control.

[ski6jones]

I've been on the Vapors since they were RS-1's, and use them just as @ToddL describes. I'm very comfortable with the release characteristics and control.

[Jordan]

I use a vapor front and toe kicker on the rear....I admittedly tie it too tight, but I have always released with booties on my foot. There is a rubber piece sewn into the rear upper of the vapor boot that stretches a little helping in release

[yardsale]

great info, my ankles thank you.

[Texas6]

Vapors. Not recommending this, but I run my tops and bottoms fairly tight and with small ankles have no issue releasing

[andjules]

I don't think people need to go to extremes on the Vapors' bungie tension; in fact, the point is to find a comfortable balance between loose vs tight. Put them on, on the dock, tighten the bungies as much as feels comfortable, and try a forward release, on the dock. If you have to work very hard to have the liner release, loosen the bungies until it only takes a reasonable amount of effort. From then on, keep them about that tight, go skiing, stop worrying about them - they're very safe and tolerate a fairly wide margin of error.

 

That said, when you first start using them, if you've always believed snug/tighter is better... you may be surprised how little the top bungie tightness affects your skiing - you can loosen them more than you think and it's unlikely you'll notice a difference in your performance. At least that was my experience.

[Dalsons]

Can anyone comment on how size runs in the Vapor boot. I'm size 9.5 shoe. Appears they only run in whole sizes. Is bigger better?

[Jordan]

they run small...I have the same size foot as you and the 10s seemed too small until the liner was heated. Even then, I cut the toes out of some old socks to use as toe caps to create some extra space in the liner....after that they are the most comfortable binders I have ever tried.

[skinonstop]

I would recommend going up at least one size. I normally wear an 11-11.5 tennis shoe and the size 12 vapors were still snug.

[Horton]

I upsize a little. I wear a 10 1/2 shoe and a 11 Vapor Boot.

The 10 Boot is too small and the 12 is too big. The 11 is just right. (I am Goldilocks)

[thompjs]

I have 9.5 foot and 10 is correct size

[TWB]

I also recommend going up a size. I'm a size 10 dress shoe, and size 11 running shoe. I went with a size 12 Vapor, and I'm glad I did. I switched last year from a reflex (black cuff). I was worried about a lack of lateral support switching from a hard shell, but felt immediately comfortable with the Vapor. In fact, I felt even more connected to the ski. Ran a pb after switching.

 

[TFisher]

On the topic of vapors -

 

1) Are they an easier transition from rubbers than other hardshells?

2) Any injury feedback (or lack of injuries)?

 

I'm currently on a approach front and connelly draft rear. Sprained rear ankle 2x in the draft and have spent all winter rehabbing. Would prefer not to do that again and am considering vapors.

 

Other option is to get a rear toe kicker or a large approach rear (or something similar).

 

TF

[andjules]

@TFisher

1) Yes, from all accounts, Vapors are an easier transition when coming from traditional rubber bindings. They're not really hardshells - more "semi-rigid".

2) This is a big topic. To summarize, there are some very cool binding systems that address a number of different fall situations, e.g. lateral/twisting falls. That said, those systems tend to be both finicky & expensive. I'm of the camp that 98%+ of ankle-wrecking falls are essentially out-the-front falls, and in that regard, the Vapors are fantastic. I switched after snapping my achilles on traditional rubber high-wraps, and have never looked back. Simple, affordable, comfortable, safe.

[baja]

@TFisher easy transition from Wiley's to RS-1's for me 6 years ago. Updated to Strada's in 2013. My ski buddy just switched from Wiley's a month ago and no issue in the 2016 Vapors once he took the plastic lateral stiffeners out. Moderately tight lower laces and then easy pull on upper laces for me. No injuries.

[PBD]

I'm not sure how anyone answers the question on comparing transitions. Once your out of rubber you've probably transitioned and can't compare how any of the other products transition as you have already made the switch.

 

Regarding sizing, I've never been in a size 12 anything until I went into these boots. I had virtually no room at the toe in the 11's when I put my foot in the shell without the liner. I'm usually around a 10.5

[andjules]

@PBD re:transitions, I've read many, many posts on this board about it commonly taking several sets to get used to hardshells, not being able to run your opening pass on your first set, etc.. Haven't read any on significant struggles switching from rubber to these kinds of 'hybrids'.

[Jordan]

switched from old Animals to vapors....no issues whatsoever.....other than increased comfort.

[matt_b]

Just got my new Vapors today. I usually wear a size 9.5-10. I first had RS-1's size 10 and they were awesome, Then went to some newer vapors in 10 and they seemed narrow and weren't as comfortable. Went to 11 this time, mainly for a little extra width as they do seem to run narrow. Looking forward to trying these out, maybe this weekend.

My experience on tightening. I tightened my first set quite a bit, got lean locked and received a bad injury. Not convinced that it was how tight they were, just a weird fall. I keep them a bit loose now with no issues in the last 5+ years.

[Jordan]

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[PurdueSkier]

This has probably already been discussed, but it looks like RADAR changed their rear binding plate and inserts. I have an older pair of stradas on my S2. The new boots/plate don't look like they will work. Do I have to order a special plate or is the standard mounting still an option when you buy them?

[andjules]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned on this thread:

While there is a consensus that you should lean towards upsizing, there's some divergence about 'how much'. Remember that some folks never get around to heat-molding them; however, it's easy to do, and will pack them out a bit (a "a-bit-too-snug" unmolded liner will become a "just right" liner by taking the 10-15m to heat-mold them to your foot).

[Zman]

Pretty much what others said on sizing. I have 8-1/2 foot and were 9 Vapors. Fit is perfect, and never heated, just were them a lot. Also, I wear them loose with top laces, but not so loose they come off top hooks. Lower laces very snug.

[Bill22]

+1 for no issue switching from rubber Venom to Vapors. I have a skinny, long foot so I use an arch support insole inside the liner to get the right fit. I did the home bake method to heat mold mine.

[UWSkier]

My experience is the same @andjules

 

Size 14 foot here was feeling squashed in my Vapors until heat molding. They feel great now. Don't underestimate the importance of the toe-cap method of molding.

[perfski]

@PurdueSkier Plates have not changed....you can use the split plates (front and rear) or the Sequence Plate (single plate). They will fit your S2 fine. IF we can help reach out.

[SkiJay]

Over tightening the boot upper is where most of the risk is, and it only returns a little more control and feel. The lower laces are the opposite. The tighter these are, within reason, the more feel and edge control we get—without dramatically increasing the release risk.

 

And the new boa system on the lower boot of the 2016 Vapors is no gimmick. The boa gives us total access to fine-tuning how tight the lower boot is. And it's so accessible and easy use that even with gloves on, you can crank them tight for the pass, then release them while Chet Raley talks to you for 15 minutes at each end.

[ironhorse]

As mentioned by most. These do fit small. I had them double up the toe cap on each foot when heat molding and it worked great. I'm a size 12 dress shoe and heat molded a size 12 double toe capped boot.

[Chef23]

On the migration front I found the migration to Strada bindings from Wiley rubber to be seamless. With the new Vapors I think to get the easy migration you need to remove the plastic stiffening tabs in them.

 

For comparison a couple of years ago I tried my Reflex trick binding on my slalom ski and it took me 3 sets before I could run my opener. The first set I couldn't even get the ski to turn on one of the sides.

 

I am planning to go to the new Vapor I love the idea of the Boa lower control. I run the bottom tight and the top just snug like @SkiJay indicated.

[yardsale]

When mounting your boots, are you guys staying at spec or forward holes or back? This is on a 2016 lith vapor.

[Chef23]

Measure from the stitching on the bottom rear of the boot to the tail of the ski and use the stock settings.

[Jordan]

i have '14...I had to move the boots back...start at stock...try adjusting from there

[yardsale]

Nice thanks. Was looking for people's experience from stock. I kept having to move mine forward on my Goode.

[ozski]

Love the idea of the BOA system for clamping your foot down nice and firm. I've just ordered one of the 2016's and can't wait to try it out. Switching from the Radar Profile boot I don't expect any adaptation issues. No shortage of people telling me to try the Reflex but I just can't go there I'm afraid.

[Texas6]

2016's are really nice. Remove the support shims from the liners, and expect them to feel great after about 3-4 sets once they break in a bit.

[paul413ski]

Moulded the lining removed the stuffners like a comfy trainer awsome boot

[jlittle]

Do the '16s come with foot beds? Insoles is what I mean. Or, if need be, do you buy after market and put them in the liners?

[Youd270]

@ozski a mate has a Profile and I have the '16 Vapor. There is a fair amount of difference in stiffness and overall fit and they do take a bit to break in, but you wont regret the change. I found a bigger gap from Profile to Vapor than from Vector to Profile. @jlittle yes they do come with an insole

[jlittle]

Thanks @Youd270 That's what I thought. Mine did not.

[Texas6]

2016's are definitely stiffer than the previous Vapor versions. Coming off three seasons on my old pair, they were like a comfortable old shoe; new ones are starting to feel great 4-5 sets in. The dial for the lower is fantastic

[Zman]

Have 2 pair of 2013 Strada boots. Really like them, and they release very well. Having 2 pair, I can't wear these things out. As soon as I do, will upgrade to latest Vapors.

[The_MS]

I am waiting for the water to warm up and I will move into my 16 Vapor. I have not molded them yet, how hot and how long in the oven?

[mbabiash]

In my opinion, putting them in the oven deforms the liner too much.

If the liners are not too far from fitting, I would use the rice in the panty hose method.

To each his/her own.

[thager]

Could try a hair drier with a hose attached and placed in the boot. Midwest did mine similar to that.

[Texas6]

@MS - preheat oven to 200 degrees and then put them in for 10 minutes but watch them to make sure your oven temp is consistent with temps, and you don't melt them. Once they lose form take them out, make sure you're wearing a sock, use the toe spacer if you want more space up front (or an extra thick sock over existing sock cut so it only covers toes), and stick your liners and feet in the boot shell...stand there for ten mins

[Texas6]

@Zman, I only upgraded so I could have a second pair on my travel ski, and definitely didn't wear out the old ones. Tough boots

[The_MS]

Thanks @Texas6

[igkya]

@MS to add to @Texas6 comments... Do not put boots directly on oven rack. Preheat oven, then place boots on a cold cookie sheet/baking pan and then place in the oven once it reaches 200 degrees.

 

FYI - I just went through this process. The 2016 boots seem to run a bit smaller than the 2010 Strada liners and are much stiffer. I needed to mold one a second time and use a larger toe cap.

[The_MS]

Good stuff