Looking for an older boat

[scorban2]

All,

 

I'm looking to pull the trigger on buying an actual ski boat. Looking at the 91-94 ProStars, but also came accross a 93 Malibu Echelon in my searches. 93 Malibu. I know the ProStars are great slalom boats, but does anyone have any experience with the early Echelons?

 

Also, I've also found references to the 91-94 prostars being a rougher ride than most in chop. While we try to avoid it, at times we cruise through some chop on the way to smooth parts of the river when the winds are right. Is the ride really that much worse on these boats than other ski boats of the era?

 

 

[Teddy]

I have never owned an Echelon but had friend who did and skied with them. A nice ski boat from that era. If it's in good condition it would be a good choice.

 

I owned a 92 ProStar for several years and my wife is still disappointed I sold it. I recently skied behind my old boat and it is still a great slalom tug. The only thing it lacks is zero off and fuel injection. On the other hand Stargazer with z-box does a pretty good job of emulating zero-off and if you have to fix a fuel problem a carb is way cheaper than a fuel injection system.

 

 

[aupatking]

I've got a 95 Ski Nautique for sale with a fuel injected GT40, cheap. Real cheap for a baller

 

[aupatking]

I've got a 95 Ski Nautique for sale, with a fuel injected GT40, cheap to a baller

[FSSPCat]

Skied behind a 95 Echelon last week. The wake is wayyyyy more firm than my 2000 Response LX. I can't say I have skied behind an older Prostar, but I hear they're good. That Nautique from @aupatking would be worth a look though. A fuely is always nice.

[Ilivetoski]

@scotchipman $14K for a 23 year old boat with 1,200 hours... that's a great looking boat but the price is insane.

 

I've never skied an older prostar, but have read good things. I've skied one echelon and it has a firmer wake that I like. Personally if I were you I would look at a 98-99 Nautique. Rides great in rough water, great wake, handles well, overall good boat.

[pudgyskier]

We will be advertising our 2002 Ski Nautique soon….. Original owner, GT 40 runs strong, Perfect pass, tandem trailer, new tires, spare and swing away tongue. 1300+ hours, oil and tranny oil changed every 50, fuel filter every 100, Plugs and wires every 2 years.,,

[Cent]

The 91 to 94 Pro Stars are fine boats. I have owned a 94. Used one yesterday. My brother still owns one and won't sell it. The wakes are excellent and I would have no complaints about the ride for a Slalom boat.

Boats got bigger after 94 and some got modified seeking broader appeal and generally the wake was not as good. If you find a good one I think you will like it.

[ALPJr]

91-94 Prostar is one of the all time best imo. We owned a 92 for 10 years. Just slow down and cruise through choppy water. No need to go fast or ski in it anyway. There are good ones around. Ours was very clean and solid and we sold it for 7k after 6 months on SIA in 2014.

[aupatking]

 

[2001Sunsport]

Not sure where you are located, but I have my 1994 Supra Comp TS6M for sale in the "stuff for sale" section.

[slow]

The Nautique TSC1 are the boats to buy if you can find one. Preferably with a gt40. Solid, handles and skis fantastic.

[ironhorse]

aupatking - nice boat. Can you send me your location and a price? Thanks

[Bill22]

@Nautibynature has a '92 (maybe '94) prostar. It has a nice wake.

[UWSkier]

I'm a Malibu guy generally, but between the Echelon and that vintage PS190, I'd go for the PS190. Just better slalom wakes. Echelon is a fantastic boat to drive, will ride the chop better than the MC, and makes a respectable wake, but as others have stated, it's a firmer wake.

[swc5150]

As stated, a 91-94 Prostar would be preferable to an Echelon. It skis better, tracks better, and was built better (superior materials and craftsmanship). A '94 will have EFI standard too, if that matters to you. I wouldn't pay $14k one for, as you can find them under $10k all day long. If you're going to spend that kind of money, find a Ski Nautique TSC1. You could easily find a 97-99 for that kind of cash.

[DCook]

I've owned my '95 Prostar 205 (still the older hull, before MC screwed it up). I loved it. Due to flooding at our club, i even had @jdhughes in a public course last week, and he jumped in for a second set. That said, yesterday i tried to cross a 3,000 acre lake into a 20 mph headwind. I had to turn around. The boat hates any rough water. But if you want a great wake under $20k, that hull is the way to go.

[thager]

Look for a 91 -94 Hydrodyne inboard. Not big three but very well built. Very good shortline wakes and bigger wakes for tricks and boarding at slower speeds. Cheaper than the others and built like a tank. My 93 Comp had the 285hp Indmar engine and they also came with the 310hp GT-40. I have a 2002 196 but my wife still liked the Dyne better for tracking. Thought I saw a really nice one on CL Minneapolis with 150 hrs. recently.

[DW]

@scorban2 : The Echelon is a good option, the key to maintain a flat wake is to minimize transom weight via removing the rear seat and keeping the tank low on fuel. If you do that, since the same hull as the Response, you will find the wake same as Response. SV23 hull which was introduced in the Echelon is what put Malibu on the map for slalom skiing. The wake does change across the line lengths, flattens nicely at 32-38 which is the sweet spot for the Echelon. If you are a barefooter, the Echelon wake is second only to a Sanger for that. SV23 hull is also all glass, no wood. Malibu will be GM power and should be a Mercruiser for that year/model.

 

 

[Nautibynature]

@Bill22 mine is a 94, but 91-94 is same hull. If I were to sell mine it would be priced around $14k

[Bill22]

@Nautibynature yeah but yours is low hours and super clean.

[swc5150]

$14k for a '94 Prostar? That's a very tough sell, no matter how good of shape it's in. If you can get it, take it and run.

[LoopSki]

Deep down I dont think the seller wants to sell it! @swc5150

[scorban2]

All, thanks for the comments. You're helping to reaffirm my thoughts on going for the ProStar. I currently only ski behind an i/o other than a handful of sets behind a 2016 ProStar during lessons, so likely any these boats will be much better than what I'm used to. I've done very little course skiing, so the wake at 15 and 22 off is what I'm most concerned about as that's where I free ski, and where I'd be in the course for a while. From what I gather, the 91-94 PS is superior at those lengths specifically compared to some of the others.

 

@ALPJr How many hours did your's have that sold for $7k? That seems a bit lower than most of what I've been seeing. Might be a negotiating point.

 

I've been eyeing these two that I've found over the past few weeks. Not FI, but that's by no means a deal breaker.

93 on SIA

91 on Craiglist

[BraceMaker]

Have a '94 myself - not sure if the fuel injection is as big of a seller as everyone says - in my book anytime it falters I'm worried I'm going to be shopping for unavailable MEFI parts from the 90's. Where as when my older carbed boats faltered I was pretty confident in what they wanted. I'm not sure at this point if it failed if I would bother trying to fix the FI or if I'd drop a carb onto it.

[ski6jones]

94-96 SN are also all glass and have good wakes through 32 off. The boat @aupatking has would be a nice starter boat. I just sold my 94 SN Open Bow. Great boat.

[Nautibynature]

https://goo.gl/pzpZ1x check this 91 PS 190 out.

[Cent]

A few thoughts.

I prefer the wakes of a 91-94 MC over the Nautique of that era so to my mind your making a good choice in looking for a MC.

If you find a 94 with EFI MC emphasized changing the fuel filter as scheduled. I believe they found approximately 90 per cent of boats that came in with a performance issue were fixable with a filter change.

Finally good maintenance can be more important than hours in key respects and it is worth paying more for a well maintained boat.

[ALPJr]

@scorban2 about 1,100 hours and 100% clean, solid and meticulously maintained. Meh, probably could have held out for more.

[UWSkier]

If you want a 15 and 22 off wake, the MC is certainly your best bet. Nautique 22 off rooster is much bigger than the MC at 22.

[ALPJr]

Did you see the photo of @kpickett '94 MC wake, I mean what wake?

[swc5150]

A '94 MC will have no wake, while a '94 SN will have no spray. Pick your poison:)

[PurdueSkier]

I own a 94 echelon and until recently also regularly skied and drove a 94 ProStar 190. I believe both boats are of similar quality and value. Both boats are all fiberglass. My

Echelon has the optional fuel injected 454 so both Boats were also fuel injected. The echelon tracks better than the pro star but as mentioned above the ProStar has a softer wake. Weight changes and a prop change to the echelon made the Wake softer but not quite as good as the ProStar. I would not hesitate to buy either one as a good starter boat.

[Nautibynature]

Here is a sweet 25th Anniversary S&S

https://goo.gl/6vgGSQ

[cruznski]

I owned a '92 ProStar and although I sold mine a long time ago, it indeed had really nice wakes, exceptional I would say, and was light and responsive. In a way, I wish the industry still made boats with wakes as good as that era of ProStar at 15 and 22 off. Mine had the Powerslot (gear reduced) transmission, which is recommended. It was a great boat, but if you do have to travel often on larger lakes where there is wind, the Nautiques of that era fare much better in lake chop. I used to take my old Ski Nautique out in the ocean here in Santa Cruz to go salmon fishing, but that's another story. Jeez my ski buddies gave me a hard time bout having that fishy smelling boat at the dock.

[6balls]

97 and up SN 196 doesn't have spray or wake...agree with prior posts you get into $12-14K for a '91-94 MC (which in my view is too much) you get into SN 196 range. I like the 91-94 MC's for sure...but not if approaching the price point of a TSC1 Nautique.

[Wish]

+1 for SN 97-99. Easily find them sub 12k and there's a few down her sub 10k. Someone wants to hand me 14k for mine it's theirs.

[MISkier]

@scorban2, I'm not sure where you are, but you showed boats in OH and Madison. Here is something a little different in Southwest Michigan. I know the owner and it was really well cared for. I've skied it many times. You'll get fuel injection on this. It's listed in SIA as an LX, but it is a closed bow.

 

1997 Malibu Response

 

Edited: I am sure he is selling this because the ski club now has a club boat.

[Wish]

@MISkier really nice boat

[BrennanKMN]

My first inboard was a TSC1 Nautique. Best thing I ever bought. I ski a 93 MC regularly. It is a great wake no doubt, but everything else on my 97 Nautique was far and away better IMO. If your budget can accommodate it, get a TSC1 Nautique otherwise I'd be getting the MC.

[Skoot1123]

Absolutely love my 2001 SN196. Extremely solid boat. Runs like a top and handles like a Ferrari. I haven't looked on ski it again but try looking there and at Onlyinboards.com. Hope you find what your looking for!

[ALPJr]

I would also put the 95 - 97 MC 190 or the 98 to 2000 MC Sport Star on the list. Great great hull

[MISkier]

@ALPJr, that 95-97 hull was great and lived on in those other models you listed, as well as the 195. I had a 2000 PS 205 also based on that 95-97 190 hull and it drove and skied great.

[Cent]

If your not into short line and needing to knock down spray the 91- to 94 MC will work well and may cost less than the the 95,96,97 or 98 MC. I have owned and used all of those hulls. 95,96, 97 are a step up for spray. Lots of people liked those hulls.

 

98 is more complicated as wakes got larger and then they came out with an add on modification; some have it and some do not.

 

I had a 95 Sammy Duvall with the LT1 that was one of two made as display boats for the Pro Tour when the 95 hull came out; the two had slightly different instrumentation. I kept it for a long time as it was primarily silver metal flake and was a 25 th anniversary wedding boat. Nevertheless 91 to 94 will do well if spray is not an issue. Spray is unlikely to be an issue until 32 off and shorter. It is my understanding MC kept making those 95-97 hills as special orders for places like ski schools even after the 98 came out. So anything from 91-97 probably works pretty well for you. . As I think I noted we still have a 94 in the family.

 

Again look for good maintenance. Make sure oil was changed at lest annually if possible. Our family 94 has had a tune up but nothing else needed yet other than fluid changes. The 95 was the same. In that 95 era they had a type of lifetime engine warranty if you used Mobil 1.

 

I hope you find what you need.

[scorban2]

Thanks again for all of the responses. I'd like to stay <$10K budget wise, but am not opposed to flexing a bit for the right boat. I've found multiple 91-93 (non efi) boats that fit that range. I'm in North Central IL, but am open to a 6-7 hour drive to get something.

 

Is there much of a difference in interior room between the TSC1 196 and the 91-94 Prostars?

[Andre]

@scorban2

Very similar interior room an both boats.Just a bit roomier on the MC because of fuel tank location.

Have a 94 MC since 2002 and couldn't be more happy of my choice.Live on a lake so no need for transom storage...which is too small to store a ski anyway.

2 great boat.

Get EFI is my best advice.

[DW]

@scorban2 : Are you going to do all the maintenance? If you plan on some dealer support with you new toy, you might want to check you area dealers as an input to your brand selection.

[scorban2]

@DW Good point. I'll be doing all of the normal maintenance myself. Not sure where the closest Nautique dealer is for something major, but Liquid Edge in Farmer City isn't too far, and I work with them for coaching too.

[Wish]

TSC-1 will feel bigger.

[BraceMaker]

@Wish For me Prostar 190 to TSC-1 the biggest thing I notice is how wet my crotch is whenever I drive the neighbors boat! I can't keep that bow out of the water for the life of me.