All new 2019 Senate Pro

[C5Quest]

That’s what I though. I’ve never had a ski at “factory settings” from the factory

[mcskier41]

@Brooks, I second what Scott says. Currently on 66" '16 Vapor skiing 34 mph weighing in at 155 lbs

[mcskier41]

LOL, I'm feeling a slight prejudice towards us lighter, not over weight skiers with you only offering 67" and 69" in the Pro. So I start eating donuts and french fries and bulk up to ski a 67"

[Shane]

@Brooks I would also be interested in a 65" if you made one.

[C5Quest]

So the theme I’m picking up here is that the Senate allows you to maybe downsize due to the extra width and stability? Im just in weird weight range (175+) but vertically challenged at 5’’7” puts me at in between sizes. It seems the recommendations are to drop a size. Makes sense are you gain surface area from the extra width. Love the speed and bouncy of my 67 Lithium Senate but I def see the benefits of a 65 with my short frame and getting to shorter line lengths. Honestly my most enjoyable sets are at end of a day after working hard on my 66 Vapor Pro Build I can jump on that Senate and rip a relaxing set. So fun! Thank you Radar for feeding my addiction!!

[ReggieO]

Any further updates on the release of the 65's?

 

[C5Quest]

I’d prob buy a 65 as a backup which would prob become a primary

[chicoman88]

I'm currently trying out a 2018 Vapor Pro Build, 69.5" and the 19 Senate Pro, 69" (I'm 6 ft, 230 lbs., 34 mph). I've been on both of them twice (coming off an 18 Syndicate Omni) and LOVE them both. Love, as in, I can't decide which one to keep. I thought that the Omni was smooth on the water until I rode both of these skis, and especially the Senate. It rides like a dream on the water. It seems to have the perfect center of gravity, for lack of a better term. I just like exactly where it sits as you're skiing. What I felt like though, was that the Pro Build seemed to turn a little better, while the Senate was smoother and went through the wake SO well. I'm thinking I'd like to keep the Senate (due to its smoothness) if I can get it to turn like the Pro Build. Does anyone have any updated settings for it? Chris Rossi/Brooks Wilson? The Radar site only has the stock setting thus far. Maybe a short/deep setting or just short? I might be good on depth right now, and I'm wondering about boot placement changes. Would one hole shorter from the stock setting on the boots give me a little tighter/quicker turn?

Also, thanks to Radar for taking care of us big guys. All these other companies are leaving the big guys by the wayside on high end skis. Apparently they're the only ones who care to help us get new pb's.

[C5Quest]

The obvious choice is to keep both!

[UWSkier]

+1 for the big guys! There are enough great skis for smaller dudes. There are entire brands who don't even bother making skis for us clydes... :(

[m_pags]

I've been on a 69" Senate Pro for about a month now. I'm 6'-3" 195# and ski @ 32.3. With the stock #'s and coming off a 68" 2016 Vapor the Senate felt big. Brooks give me new #'s (6.975, 2.450 & .795) Vapor boot middle hole 31.75 and now I'm really liking the ski. It feels smaller and turns quicker.

[Sethro]

I’d love to try a 69” someday. I’m still loving my 2016 Vapor though, so I can’t justify a new ski.

[A_B]

The CG fin on a 69” Senate seems to work pretty well. I’m running deeper and shorter setup at about stock dft one hole back on sequence plate. Only 2 sets on it. Looked for a little more smear on second set and went too far. Will add a fuzz of depth back for next set. 7 degree modified homemade S Wing with a little less flare up than the real S. Loving the offside turn. Need a little work on the onside. It was too “stuck” then felt good with less depth but I was overpowering the offside and sliding out. Will split the difference on the next set.

[C5Quest]

I just “had” to order a 65 Senate Lithium until a 65 Senate Pro makes an appearance.....Hello Radar?? Are you listening?? Is this thing on??

[brooks]

@C5Quest listening!! But it’s still going to be a bit!

[C5Quest]

Haha. I know. ?

[C5Quest]

Will have a mint 2018 67’ Senate Lithium up for grab shortly if anyone is interested. Details to follow

[A_B]

Just a FYI. The new Pro Builds use a .010 thinner fin and fin box. A CG fin is a very tight fit making dft fine adjustments very difficult.

 

From what I have seen so far, the new PB Senate turns much better than the 2015 Lithium Senate, so may not need the CG fin. It didn't like the deep and short fin setup I had liked on the old Senate. It was literally nose diving into the buoys. So I went to the new recommended shallow and long fin and was overturning everywhere. I need to back down me or the ski. Only have 1 set on each setting, so hope the weather holds out. Bumped the fin forward for next session and took some length out, as I felt I had too much tip. I am at 31.5" and that is as far back as I can go on the Sequence plate without moving my bindings back on the plate. That might be what I need in the end, but will see how this goes with fin adjustment for now. I think I rode the old Senate around 30.5" or 30.75", so the balance point is messing with me right now.

 

The ski is a piece of art though! Radar has some badass looking stuff.

 

 

 

[C5Quest]

Any comparison to the 2018 Senate yet? The 18 Senate Lithium rode high and was smooth and lightning fast.

[mxhideout]

I'd love to try this ski out, but not sure if I should keep on progressing with my current '14 Vice Carbon... I just started skiing the course in July and finally made a complete pass going 28 @ -15 in a grassroots tourney a couple weekends ago (currently don't have access to a course). I'm hoping to be up to 32mph early next season. I like my vice carbon, but it feels almost too stable and I would like to try something that is a little more aggressive in the turns (my technique obviously still needs A LOT of work). Mine is a 67" and I would like to try a 65". I know my speed isn't up yet, but I'm 5'6" 143lbs.

[dvskier]

Excited to try my Senate Pro tomorrow! Got it yesterday thanks to @brooks , a pleasure to deal with.

[jipster43]

A 65 would be cool.

[dvskier]

It's coming.

[Deanoski]

A 66 would be cool also

[dvskier]

Senates come in odd numbers, the unlikely to see a 66 any time soon.

[C5Quest]

Looking at numbers the 65 Senate has more surface area than a 66 Vapor so I’m guessing this eliminates the need for 66? Or fills the gap so no need?

[dvskier]

I rode mine yesterday, unbelievable performance increase from my 2017 Senate Graphite. Very easy deep water start, nice roll into gates, smooth turns. It's going to take another couple sets to get used to but I'm very happy with it at this point. I'm 5'9" at 175, old guy 72 years old but loving the new ride.

[C5Quest]

Assuming your in a 67? How did size feel?

[dvskier]

Felt great, like I said easier deep water start, popped right out. Not that the 17 Graphite was difficult. Turns easily, I'll find out more early next week when I take a couple more sets on it.

[dvskier]

Set a new practice PB this afternoon, straight up off the dock 3@32.3 mph, 15 off. This ski is amazing, it will do everything you need to be a successful skier. I was very upset about M8 max speed going to 32.3. Now not so much, the Senate Pro made it easier for this 72 year old guy. Props to Brooks and Team Radar!,

[Dacon62]

@dvskier don’t have the Pro Build but have the ‘19 Lithium model and feel the same way. Great ski!!

Congrats on the PB!

[A_B]

Anyone riding the deep and shorter setup on the new Pro Senate?

[C5Quest]

Is there a deep/short or long/shallow for the senate? Have only seen that on the radar site for the Vapor. Can you get away with same numbers ?

[Dacon62]

@brooks any alternative settings as per @C5Quest request above?

 

[brooks]

@C5Quest right now we’re only publishing the one set of numbers for the ski as the recommended settings. With that said there are a lot of numbers that can be ridden to achieve different things. Were You looking for the ski to do something in particular?

[ChasingOldDreams]

hrm... need a little guidance... skiing 28-30 mph. Not as good as you guys, but improving steadily... 5'10" - 215 lbs... (yeah im a work in progress, in my 30's)

 

What's the difference between the 2019 Senate Pro, Lithium, and Graphite for some one like myself? Maybe in the realm of forgiving, smooth through turns, deep water starts, ability to improve with the ski? I understand there's some differences in manufacturing location, is the quality just as good across all 3 ski's?

 

leaning into a 69" as i just want a little help with deep water starts and to work less while up..

 

thanks in advance, would love to hear more first hand experiences.

 

 

[Jmoski]

@ChasingOldDreams - I just switched onto a Senate Pro and it's really perfect for me (running the course at 30-32 mph) stable, smooth, and very fast when I get stacked correctly behind it.

 

IMHO the Senate Graphite is the best 34 mph ski for the money. So if cost is a big factor, you will not be disappointed by the Graphite. My friend is on year 2 on his and he loves it (pushes 28' off) - no quality concerns. I've skied his as well, but its hard for me to compare as we have different bindings.

 

My perspective is the Pro with the PMI core is the lightest and most reactive of the three, hence offering best performance without compromising on attributes you listed above. How much better than the lithium and the graphite? That I can't really quantify.

 

Finally, I find the Senate reinforces good habits, and I am now earlier into the buoys than ever. On the few times I tried to snap a quick hook turn off the back after falling behind in the course, the Senate just said "nope" and wouldn't let me, where the Vapor was like, "sure dumbass - here we go - watch what happens."

 

[C5Quest]

@brooks, Besides kickass? I’ll have to ride it and find out. ?. Hoping the 65 will have the stability of the 67 with the nimbleness of the Vapor. Can’t wait.

[C5Quest]

@ChasingOldDreams From the trend I’m seeing on this thread I’m guessing @brooks would put you on a 67. Then again what do I know. You could probably be happy on either

[dvskier]

215 is pretty big for a 67 Senate at 28-30 mph. I’d go with a 69. Any of the Senates are great skis. I’ went to the Pro Build and couldn’t be happier. It’s very quick, predictable, smooth in the course.

[C5Quest]

I missed the speed (28-30). Maybe 69. But if you improve quickly and bump up speed the 67 might work. Are you able to demo both. That’s really the best way to know

[jhughes]

@C5Quest Why don't you just go to a 19 Vapor instead? I don't understand the desire for a smaller Senate when that ski kinda exists already as a Vapor and is the most stable, yet nimble ski I've ever been on.

[C5Quest]

@jhughes. I’m on a 19 vapor. Also have a senate as a backup and keep mostly at another site. My 18 senate is a 67 but just feels big. Looking for the stability in a slightly smaller package. Also have my nephew who will probably be using it most of the time so the 65 will be perfectly suited for him.

[ChasingOldDreams]

Wow! First of thank you @Jmoski @C5Quest and @dvskier !

 

The advice and conversation with folks that are far more knowledgeable in this world goes extremely appreciated.

 

I do want the 69" , my past two ski's have ben the HO TX 67, which i returned after taking a nasty concussion that put me out for the season and then recently have been using the Obrien world team slalom 68". I feel exponentially more comfortable on the 68" the ski just sprays me too much and seem to be working a bit harder on it. If anything the shorter ski's have encouraged me to ski at faster speeds, though my driver emplors me that i should be fine.

 

Maybe in a year i'll be light enough and skiing at fast enough speeds to move back to a 67", ill either sell the 69" then or i will just use it for open water fun.

 

Any one have experience with the new Vector BOA boots? I really would like to give the hybrid HRT rear a shot, any first hand accounts would be greatly appreciated.

 

cheers

[C5Quest]

I have the Vector BOAs on my 18 Senate. Like them a lot and very comfortable. Have the double boots but have also tried the HRT BOA. Depending what your looking for and preference both great options. What size are you. ? I’m

Actually selling my Vector BOAs and the HRT. PM me for details

[Jmoski]

@ChasingOldDreams - what is your current bindings set up?

 

I currently run with the HRT rear, which I have grown to really like. It was a big adjustment going from a double boot set up to a 1/2 rear, but I am happy I made the change.

[A_B]

Have put 3 rounds on the new 69" Pro Senate, and I can say that it does not like the deep/short fin, or CG fin similar settings. Maybe it is because I can't get my Sequence plate back under 31.75", as I use to run my old Senate a hole back and deep/short. It is like the forward binding is fighting with the fin setup.

 

Jumped in after a quick reset before we quit yesterday and skied a couple passes at 6.975 2.455 .777 and it seemed more in harmony. Would still love to try the bindings back around 31" with the deep/short fin, but that is going to take some major work to get there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ChasingOldDreams]

Thanks all, i had a chance to speak with Brooks live, he recommended the Senate Pro build 69" w/ Vector BOA's for me and the HRT Vector BOA rear. Im 215 lbs, 5'10" in my 30's. Sticking point for me was that the ski will last me while and allow me to scale up 34 mph at which point sounds like ill want to take a look at moving back down to 67" if i can lose some weight ;-)

 

@C5Quest on the boots, definitely a possibility for another ski i have, but seeing if i can work out a deal with the vendor selling me the Senate PB on an extra set for my beginners ski. Don't let me hold you up, will reach out if it makes sense.

 

 

[ChasingOldDreams]

Oh man my 69" Senate Pro Build came and she is a beauty, the new bindings fit really well, i would say the HRT rear is a bit bigger than i thought. I really like the even pressure the boa tightening system gave me. Snug enough to use some soap to get into, but not so tight that i couldn't release in water after finishing a run.

 

I mentioned that sometimes i have trouble getting out of the water at starts (nerve damage causes weakness in my lead leg) the new length and increased surface area popped me up first try, the sheer happiness alone was worth it.

 

She is LIGHT!! even with the bindings i can hold the ski at length with one hand pretty easily.

 

Felt like i was riding on a car on rails with air suspension.. today was pretty bumpy, so no course, but even then compared with other like condition experiences i barely noticed the beating the waves were handing me.

 

It's definitely more responsive than any ski i've had, any input i give her she responds immediately, that translated to a better overall experience as i didn't have to work as hard. I may have to tweak the fin settings a bit more, but i had all the confidence in the world cutting left. Heading right she really wanted to get on edge, so i learn to appreciate the drivability, this is my weak side anyways and i have work to do here. Through the wake was like a hot knife thru butter, far better than any other ski i've been on.

 

Overall extremely happy with the purchase. Bill at Performance Ski had these in stock and took care of me! Really like the initial setup.

 

I will get some guys who are more skilled than i am up on it late next week and share their feedback.

 

cheers

[Stevie Boy]

Looking to view the video of Freddie Winter on the Radar Senate Pro, but I do not use Facebook maybe Freddie would be kind enough to put it on here or has anybody else got ideas how to view it, I have no intention of signing up to Facebook.