2021 is my last year of USAWS

[BS74]

If it's all about the kids and protecting them for sexual predators, why not make it a free course?

[klindy]

@The_MS Correct. And SafeSport is FAR more than just a simple training program. But since you get the overall idea, it's a pretty small step to following thru with the training.

[jgills88]

@BS74 the course is free for USAWS members.

 

For why it's not free in general? Because things cost money. Servers, websites, research, resources, building the course itself, not to mention the staff that they keep to deal with the over 4,000 reports that they've received. It'd be great if the course were free for everyone, but people really hate being taxed, so they went another way with it.

[BraceMaker]

At a certain level you must pay ~30 bucks for a background check but I believe that is only if you are a national team member.

[buechsr]

Irony on full display. Some voices in opposition who haven't even watched the video blame a younger generation, think the program and the issues raised therein are purely common sense, and that they can spot a "perv" trying to make a move. Between the Boy Scouts, the Catholic Church, Nasser, and Sandusky, I would have thought rational people could all agree that if it's possible for those thousands of examples to go undetected, that there's more to learn about how this works than spotting a 60 year old chatting up a 17 year old girl in a bikini out in the open. But, I'd be sadly wrong. If it has to be made about defending lawsuits, if there's no lawsuits to defend because inappropriateness (or worse) was prevented, the mission was accomplished.

 

Keith, I applaud your post and restraint. USAWS cannot (and should not) rest on its laurels on this issue. Those so vociferously opposed are on the wrong side of this, long lineage with USAWS or not. If a poster in this thread drops their membership as a result of USAWS's requirement and you're made aware of it Keith, contact me. I'll pay for up to 5 dropped memberships for a year.

 

Personally, I find it shocking to see some of the posts herein.

 

Proudly signed,

Sheep

[The_MS]

They will still go undetected. This just covers ass and is not prevention. Prevention lies with the parents or guardians decision making and how they raise their kids

[jjackkrash]

I just re-upped my membership this year after letting it lapse for a while. And I bought one for my boy. And his two cousins just signed up so they can ski with us. And my boy's buddy just bought his first ski after getting sick of borrowing ours and he wants to come ski tourneys with us so he'll be joining as well.

 

And I just ordered a pair of jumpers from D3 for me and my boy to share for a while. We'll be plopping over the ramp on labor day at Mint Lake. We're getting jumpers for christ sake!

 

And we can't wait for regionals next year. We'll haul our fiver wherever it is and camp there for the week. I'll make bacon and eggs and pancakes every morning for anyone who is hungry and tell lies around the campfire at night. It is gonna be great.

 

Did I mention we are getting jumpers! Woo Hoo!

 

It is a great time to be a waterskier.

[MattP]

@The_MS that is possibly the dumbest shit you have ever said. At this point I'm ok with you leaving USAWS with an attitude like that. I am pretty over this thread and @Horton should close it.

[dvskier]

I completed my training today, not a great time investment. It was painless.

[BraceMaker]

@skierjp I wouldn't dare presume their responses. But I'm going to go right ahead and presume that they in wearing their board shorts for personal comfort and performance would not in any way shape or form want to be told that they MUST wear board shorts for modesty sake.

 

I will comment that my wife in viewing this tells y'all to pound sand she wears a bikini in the sun, playing volleyball, on the pontoon, at the pool. And she would like you to appreciate that ladies who having different anatomy occasionally fall in such a way that they experience water intrusion into uncomfortable parts of their anatomy. As such she wears shorts for comfort and safety over her bikini bottoms when skiing.

 

I will censor her more.... uncouth opinions.

 

But she implies that if you guys want to be divorced you should show your wives your posts and ask their opinions.

 

[jayski]

@MattP pretty sure @The_MS has said dumber shit, we all have, you just did...and really his last post was understandable from a certain perspective, obviously not yours...now understand we all have a line, this is a line that some do not want to cross and others have no issue crossing...now your post could be construed as abusive and bullying, which is inappropriate with ALL sports organizations...so we could all be a little removed and look from the outside in on this situation with an open mind or spew direct negative rhetoric and put ourselves in a position to be reported ;)

 

oh and I just noticed your SAC region chairman...even more reason to act more appropriately than that post lol

[The_MS]

[jimbrake]

@The_MS "Genova Convention". You did that on purpose, didn't you?

[The_MS]

Of coarse not. You know I can’t spell

[dvskier]

You spell much better than @Horton

[Jody_Seal]

@klindy

Their it is in plane English!

 

Its About the MONEY!!

Want their protection extortion you play by their rules and they are coming after more money!!

 

[BS74]

@jgills88 : So, How many 3 event skiers in the last 5 years have been banned/or probation? How many water sports people in total? I'm guessing it's just a hand full. I wonder how much money that comes out to per violation verses the amount of money they will take in! As @Jody_Seal says, it's always about the money! Bottom line, as someone else said, It's not this course as much as all the Bull S--T AWSA has done over the last 25 years, this is just another event. I skied about 16 Nationals in the 80's and 90's and a couple in early 2000's, and then I quit AWSA in 2008 and haven't looked back.

[BraceMaker]

@Jody_Seal - that says they need more money to accomplish their mission of catching more perverts.

 

Sign me up for a donation.

 

Seems like a better $ spend than a lot of the other nonsense I pay for.

[Ali]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/01/30/usa-gymnastics-offers-215-million-settlement-larry-nassar-victims/

 

10 million a year from USA track and field to try and prevent it happening to them. If you were running USA track and field what would you do?

[The_MS]

Just send them your money, you don’t have to sign up for that. Please post your donation receipt and maybe other will follow.

[The_MS]

Nasser pulled that off behind the backs of officials, teachers, parents, athletes, collage professors and many other big time institutions. Were all those people stupid and ignorant? I’m sure if they all would have taken the 90 minute course, none of that would have happened.

[BraceMaker]

@The_MS yes they all including myself who knows some of those athletes and their parents and was in their circle dirong those years need more training.

You need more training.

 

90 minutes x every person required to take it is a lot of minutes. You are just obsessed with how you would have known better. That is false plenty of people who had the same idea were shocked.

 

 

[The_MS]

So the parents of the athletes that attended MI State should all be required to have training?

[BraceMaker]

Those parents are offered training now. Are you a parent of an athlete or do you participate in the sport?

 

[The_MS]

Offered is not mandatory.

I was Collage football and track & field

I hate kids so I didn’t have any

[BraceMaker]

parent of athlete not = to athlete

parent offered

athlete mandatory

 

This is a very simple flowchart.

[scuppers]

Thank goodness we have @The_MS & @Jody_Seal.

I mean that very sincerely. I really want to write so much more but like @MrJones I keep erasing. It is all about the money - and the parenting, with a very heavy emphasis on parenting.

[BS74]

@Ali : Так что я думаю, что мы можем подать в суд на демократов и президента за то, что они не обеспечили безопасность границы!

[bigtex2011]

@BS74 I think I must have missed something or was the shark officially jumped

[Horton]

@bs74 I converted the original text of your post and am awarding you a Triple Britney. As everyone knows non-waterski politics are strictly forbidden here.

 

[NameUnavailable]

@Bruce_Butterfield is spot on here.....I know him and that is not always the case...lol

[Jody_Seal]

Free Britney! She will bring us all together!

 

[VONMAN]

2015 was the last year I was a member. Submitting my Driving record (auto) and the actual boat driving test was a joke. But it had to be done for insurance for the club. I have no skin in the game now, but I wonder how I'm looked at by people and a Organization I once supported?

I still love to ski and try to give back to the sport by going to Tournaments and videoing the event. Showed up to one event and asked if I could film from the boat only to be told no because I wasn't a member. I wasn't asking to be paid, it was for the enjoyment of the skiers to view on U-Tube. It's All about the Money. The fun side of our sport is Dying a slow Death, wake up.

[Booze]

@VONMAN - wasn't a member of what?

 

[unksskis]

Only USA-WS members are to be in the boat during a tournament, that’s been a known rule forever, assuming for liability.

[RichardDoane]

it is sad that our society lives in fear of "liability", instead of using common sense like the good old days.....

[The_MS]

In this case I guess I don’t understand the liability issue. Will the training just make the end payout smaller? A good lawyer is going to get his clients a payout weather there is training or not. The organization can’t just say that everyone is trained so we are covered.

[RichardDoane]

and who is to say that the bad actors won't just take the SS training to continue being part of the organization

[Hallpass]

@MS "In this case I guess I don’t understand the liability issue. Will the training just make the end payout smaller? A good lawyer is going to get his clients a payout weather there is training or not. The organization can’t just say that everyone is trained so we are covered."

 

Legal argument could go many ways, but the basic argument is that if the organization could have taken reasonable precautions (here safesport training), and failed to do so, then they are negligent. As you suggest, it is unlikely that training alone would eliminate liability. However it would be one of many factors assessed by a jury, and could potentially reduce the award, and/or the percent of responsibility attributed to the organization.

[klindy]

@The_MS The legal argument is whether or not insurance is available at all or at a reasonable cost. Any payout is important but the biggest risk is making sure the insurance carrier pays it all (up to any limits). None are good but risk is at least partially controlled if you have effective insurance to handle any claim.

[Mastercrafter]

…

[Drago]

@RichardDoane Assuming you're not one of the "bad actors"; the training is for you to help identify potential situations, avoid situations that may enable the "bad actor", and creates a duty for you to report violations of SafeSport (unlike the administration at Michigan who took it upon themselves to not act despite multiple complaints).

There is a young athlete version you can have your kids peruse as well, if maybe they don't fully listen to you or think you're being a helicopter dad.

"Common sense" has many levels. My common sense 20 years ago would be to assume a priest has only good, kind intentions.

[RazorRoss3]

Ok, to back up @Than_Bogan, the level of undress of a person (male or female) has 0 impact on their right to not be harassed/abused/assaulted. And I think we can all agree that harassing/abusing/assaulting other members of our sport is bad.

 

This training is not to prevent the proverbial “panel van”. It’s to prevent the situations we’ve seen where everyone is surprised to learn that person X was a predator. Because person X was in a position of trust, they had innocuous reasons for interacting with youth athletes, and they used that trust, and those innocuous reasons to do harm.

 

Now, I think it’s safe to say that for most, the above is not really the argument at hand. What some of you are complaining about is that you don’t like the board telling you what to do… well, I think it’s a dumb hill to die on and a pretty stupid reason to quit competitive skiing but here is me not telling you what to do. Make up your own mind, make your own choice, and for the love of skiing @Horton shut this thread down. This is way more about politics than it is anything else at this point and even if it weren’t I think it’s clear no one is about to change their mind.

[MDB1056]

That this thread exists is an indictment on the general population as a whole. Sad but true. Agree with @RazorRoss3 , shut it down

[unksskis]

Not at all. This is pulling the curtain on a lot of people in the sport, there is no reason to close this thread.

[jayski]

The funny thing is (not really though) that organizations think this training will actually help their liability issue...sure to a certain extent, but we all know it's just a line, and lawyers (no offence to good decent ones) will easily find ways to say that line wasn't good enough, more should of been done and your at fault...

 

IT'S NEVER ENDING!!

 

Frustration with the masses grow because of this, the goal posts keep moving, and not just in this subject

[Zman]

---

[ski6jones]

It's been a long time since I've read such condescension on this site. People have differing opinions on things. Who knew?

[Zman]

Hey @ski6jones When do you change your signature to read, "Cedar Ridge, MS"?

Hope you're doing well.

OK, now for my "Off Topic" checks. Anything off topic is thread is probably a good thing. B)

[ski6jones]

With any luck sometime next year. The guys at LOK are taking good care of me in the meantime.