2021 is my last year of USAWS

[Dirt]

@scoke hit the nail on the head. I believe this requirement will have a very negative impact on the organization. I thought we wanted more participation.

How often are adults left alone with unsupervised minors in this sport?

Just do one more thing and we will allow you to participate. Oh wait, now just one additional thing to participate in this very expensive time consuming sport.

Pretty soon you may be able to get a medal just for jumping through the most hoops.

I won’t quit because of this. I just don’t like it and think it’s completely unnecessary.

Why not require a two hour class on the dangers of alcohol and boating/skiing?

[Dirt]

I was thinking maybe they need to require a negative covid test from each participant within 48 of the tournament and a vaccine card. If it saves just one life…

[BraceMaker]

@Dirt sarcasm or not? if it saves just one life I personally would say reasonable trade. Not sure who would say otherwise.

 

How many hours of classroom time would you take if it saved a kid from being raped.

 

A <1

B 1-3

C I wont consent to any inconvenience her thong was too revealing.

 

Objecting to roadblocks is fine. But jeez these are very minor things

[Dirt]

Its not going to save one kid to require me to do it. Trust me I have had plenty of training and experience on the subject.

How much irrelevant training is reasonable?

People fall off ladders and are crippled and/or brain damaged daily. Should we have mandatory ladder/stair training for the judges towers?

[BraceMaker]

Ok save 1/3rd of a kid? 1/100? What if 5000 inconveniences save one kid from sexual abuse?

 

As you say "trust me I have plenty of experience" But Id respond I did not have that experience a few years back. In the 5 degrees of separation game I have 1 degree from Nasser. Not a clue. My 1 degree of separate didnt have a clue.

 

 

[The_MS]

Well, the world need ditch diggers too

[aupatking]

@BraceMaker would you have caught Larry Nasser if you had taken this training?

A 90 minute training session is not gonna stop a rapist.

I go to 3 tournaments a year if I’m lucky, 4 if I’m feeling very divorcy. Is it reasonable to think me taking a 90 minute training to spend a cumulative 90 minutes with kids around their parents is going to help me spot something?

This training SHOULD be required for coaches. It’s possible an argument could be made for judges, as they are, by definition, “officiating” the tournaments. The site coordinators, probably them too, but every member?

MOST IMPORTANTLY, the children need to be given training OF ANY TYPE, that reaches them. They are the ones we need to be educating. Will the training help me teach my, or you help teach your children? That’s the only thing that really matters to me. If so, yes, it’s worth doing.

[Jody_Seal]

 

"If it saves one minor athlete!"

 

Safe sport!! A joke for sure!! I hope she sues the shit out of the usoc and their watch dogs safe sport!

 

Even reported to the FBI and they turn a blind eye on these athletes.

 

You all sure you want these beuractic clowns in our sport???

 

[BraceMaker]

@aupatking me? No my one degree means I didn't interact with them. The associate who did ya probably could have helped her.

 

I got these letters because my mens league hockey team requires usa hockey membership and that is also requiring the training. My membership in USA Archery also needs safesport training. If I want to shoot any skeet I probably will need to do it there too.

 

If you participate in the sport congrats youre painted with the same brush as any other participant consider yourself lucky to be an athlete.

[Horton]

All those of you who are angry at the leadership of the sport need to realize that things like SafeSport come from the USOC not from little old USAWS. If I may quote myself....

 

USOC told us that if we wanted to get back to the Olympics after 1972 we had to restructure our national organization (AWSA) and expand it beyond its original scope. As a result, we formed USA Water Ski with AWSA as a subordinate organization along with other similar disciplines. It is at this point that the once focused sports federation became a bloated bureaucracy and completely lost its way.

 

At the same time, US Water Ski also became subordinate to International Waterski & Wakeboard Federation (IWWF). The IWWF is an even more bloated bureaucracy that rarely appears to be serving the athletes.

https://www.ballofspray.com/forum#/discussion/22850/the-rise-and-fall-of-water-skiing/p1

 

Chasing the Olympic dream lead us down this path.

 

[klindy]

@Horton rhe last two posts from you are EXTREMELY MISLEADING. “A desire to “return to the olympics is NOT a direct reason Safe Sport is part of USAWSWS. You purposely or conveniently left out about 30 years of history and detail.

[Horton]

@klindy

"You purposely or conveniently left out about 30 years of history and detail."

 

You seem to have no idea what my point was. I have no idea what you are pissed about.

[klindy]

“Chasing the Olympic dream lead us down this path.” That comment insinuates that we wouldn’t have to deal withSafeSport (or any(?) of these harassment) issues of it wasn’t for some “Olympic dream” 35+ Years ago. Untrue.

[Horton]

@klindy I was trying to say if you could roll back time and keep AWSA as a focused independent organization it would be more in control of its own destiny and not forced to be beholden to organizations like SafeSport.

 

Thank you for overreacting. What was the other thing that you think I said that was completely misleading?

[klindy]

@Horton this whole thread is filled with misinformation, opinion and emotion with little attention paid to just plain operating the organization in a responsible manner. Liability risk is real. The need for various insurance to responsibly manage that risk is real. Whether we align with SafeSport, some other program or we roll our own, doesn’t mean we can just ignore the need to manage our fiduciary responsibilities. Each option has advantages and disadvantages. Every single member has an opportunity to participate in the process to evaluate and help decide which is the best way to run the organization. Almost no one (on this thread certainly) has ever volunteered for a committee or board. Few have even participated in electing those who have volunteered.

[Horton]

@klindy well maybe you should work harder on communicating your message instead of randomly attacking me.

 

The funny thing about this conversation is the original original original intent of my above post was to insinuate that whatever the membership is angry about is really not the fault of the current leadership. Perhaps I was too nuanced.

 

Also, what was the other thing that you think I said that was completely misleading?

[jayski]

@klindy just an fyi I have volunteered for more than one committee and offerded to take over a comimittee but asked for a short conversation with one of the 'upper' board memebrs to clarify desired direction for said committee...I bugged him for a few months then gave up...you have people willing to help...so don't generalize of 'no one volunteers' when you and the board shut them out...

[Bruce_Butterfield]

@klindy "Every single member has an opportunity to participate in the process to evaluate and help decide which is the best way to run the organization."

 

From my perspective, that is the primary source of the heartburn - many members feel they are left out and/or have no input to the organization at large. Having no observable input leads to frustration, anger and helplessness.

 

While members do vote on regional EVPs, directors, etc, even those on the AWSA board were blind sided by the safesport mandate, were they not? If the people elected by the members have little or no control, how do individual members actually have any input?

[ALPJr]

Just my novice observation, I don’t see an inconvenience, or an assault on members autonomy, or an indication that the org’s leadership has lost its way. In fact to me in the East the membership, organization, leadership and tournament scene seems to be more healthy than it’s been in 25 years.

[bigtex2011]

I vote for @jayski to head up marketing and mud wrestling.

[gjohnson]

If only people believed victims instead on the rapists, safesport wouldn’t have been created.,

[Dirt]

Safesport is a joke. It didn’t help those gymnasts. The training is unnecessary and ladder training would be more beneficial. I believe proper footwear training should be required to prevent stubbed toes, rolled and broken ankles and fire ant bites.

[NameUnavailable]

@Bruce_Butterfield good points.

 

The hope is protecting kids(which is great)

 

The irony is...if it was not for all of us getting our kids in to the skiing USAWS would have been out of business long ago.

[The_MS]

Liability? Why are we less liable if everyone is trained and some kid gets assaulted? Johnny Cochran will get a Max payout with or without the training

 

 

 

 

 

[dbutcher]

If we really want to participate in ski tournaments, we are going to do the Safe Sport thing. It's like paying taxes. Nobody wants to, but we all have to - or suffer the consequences. Writing and complaining about Safe Sport changes nothing and has caused much irritation amongst good people. I'd rather not have to take the training, but I will because I want to remain active in AWSA competition. This thread is much ado about nothing.

[scoke]

I flatly 100% disagree.

 

Your apathy is very scary. “but we have to”.

WOW, no we don’t, we can vote with our wallet. We can look into replacing leadership, (previously yes, now-not really).

 

These are initiatives and decisions, not-voted on, but instituted by a few individuals without consulting leaders/representatives and average members such as you and me.

The decisions have been made by the current blowing of the winds of social media culture with no proven results. Like pissing in the wind!

 

As I stated earlier, we’ll see at the end of the first month and then quarter when they “purge the rolls” of folks who did not attend the training. THEN when those non tournament skiers do not renew, it will be obvious to the effects. Membership will quickly start to go down as well as membership revenue. Next summer as the quarter over quarter financials look bleak, we’ll see then.

 

I don’t have time to watch the video and we’ll see what happens when they cancel my membership. I’ll still have the money in my pocket, not theirs. Me watching a video has 0.00% of changing anything in this world related to the topic. It’s just a feel good measure.

 

But if the money received from the bureaucrats covers the total lost membership, awsa is now financially dependent on the government and “if it just saves one person” it’s worth it right?

 

@dbutcher

 

I've exceeded my quota of posting on this website for quite a while. phew.

 

 

[lpskier]

The regional meetings in the summer and winter are the meetings to attend if you want your voice heard. All sorts of National proposals are discussed and we vote to determine how our regional representatives will vote on the items at the summer and winter AWSA board meetings. Sure, the winter regional meeting is a pain to attend, but the summer meeting is usually held at Regionals. I am always surprised how poorly it is attended.

[The_MS]

@dbutcher I am not just writing and complaining. I’m am doing something that hopefully others will do, which will effect the bottom line of the organization. $$$$. No membership, no money and then they can organize ideas and not take the easy route of acceptance.

I would gladly pay more membership money and sign a waiver if we would just stand up and say no to this kind of crap. I would be much more proud to belong to an organization like that.

Like I stated many times, to me it’s not about the time or money, it’s the BS crap that just keeps coming year after year.

[BraceMaker]

@Dirt would have been a trick for the U.S center for safesport founded 2017 to have done much when he was already in custody at that time.

 

@The_MS Unless AWSA leaves the whole USA sports umbrella your protest is mute. USA hockey has 600,000 participants, gymnastics has 200,000 participants. USA archery grew by 2000 members in Q1 of 2021

 

Protest as much as you like but don't expect a result. We did a recruitment event with skills and drills and team recruitment for leagues, we do mens and womens teams with some coed leagues too. All players will be signing up for usa hockey and they all will be doing the safesport training for 2021. Membership in USA hockey required to play, safe sport required for membership. About 50 new skaters joining the sport out of 1 rink in 1 day.

 

Men aged 35+ griping about the requirement is not the membership its just the officials boat owners, lake owners etc.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dirt]

@BraceMaker I respect you and your opinion. I know very little about what went on in gymnastics.

I will gripe about every stupid bureaucratic requirement they add.

[The_MS]

Then we need out from the USA umbrella.

[Hallpass]

:) Johnnie Cochran died in 2005. Leave him out of this.

 

[6balls]

@hallpass his firm lives, I do med-malpractice consulting for them.

 

So maybe a shift: what can all of us do who are not abusers in order to prevent said abuse? We can be good people ourselves, and feel ok about it--but what can we do to both identify/take action when/if we suspect it? What if it's at one of our sports events? Do we sit under a tent and kinda talk about it but not do anything?

 

What can we do to empower the abused to press charges--in my mind these are the real issues. Perhaps this is the most important of all.

 

This is far bigger than sport.

 

[Stevie Boy]

The thought of perverts among us, disturbs me, unfortunately they do not walk around with a badge declaring that they are a pervert, they are cunning and experts at disguise, they could be your best buddy, next door neighbour, the most unlikely of people, are you going to be able to spot them, the likelyhood is no.

Education of youngsters and people at risk has to be the key, they have to feel that they can come forward and state their concerns.

We have a designated person who fills that role and takes the responsibility, I think most of us understand whats is appropiate and what is not with or without a course or exam.

The biggest enemy is when people walk on by, see things and say nothing, the nicest Man/Woman in your community, could be the biggest monster out there, do not be afraid to question other peoples actions.

Do Not Walk On By.

[BraceMaker]

@Stevie Boy the juxtaposition is that concurrently there are two threads one congratulating a skier for a great performance and another complaining how they are quitting this sport if they have to spend even 90 minutes on training. In one the subject is widely known to have broken the facial bones of a gal widely known and popular in the sport who most members here had full spread HO ads of her in approach bindings and a bikini on their computer c.2007

 

This sport failed her badly safesport failed her badly. Had this event occured in 2018 Mr. Smith would be on lifetime ban with no recourse. Befause it was a few years earlier. Kobe.

[MDB1056]

This is about the most ridiculous thread I’ve ever seen on BOS, and unfortunately is an indictment of the myopic view of so much of the membership. USAWS, AWSA, IWWF, etc etc don’t care if you like this new requirement or not. It’s a requirement for the obvious reasons that shouldn’t even warrant noting. Your choice is to shut up and ski, or quit. They don’t care. It’s your choice but the requirement isn’t going anywhere. It’s a safety component. Someone here please identify ONE other sport where something positioned as a safety factor has been repealed. And for those who feel that quitting will really move the membership needle and have any impact…. place your bets. It’s great to have impassioned members in any sport and I love this sport as much as anyone , but there has to be a reality check here. I’m sure I’ll get flamed or sanctioned or both or quintuple Brittney Pandas . So be it. This is just an online forum……. It’s not your life

[scuppers]

@MDB1056. WOW - pretty bold statement.

[Horton]

@MDB1056 what no one seems to get is USAWS did not really have a choice to implement Safe Sport or not.

[bbruzzese]

I think there may be more that's not being got...

[MDB1056]

@Horton - EXACTLY . How is that not understood

[Dirt]

@MDB1056 with all due respect, I couldn’t disagree more. I don’t think you should tell people to shut up. This a forum where people voice their opinions mostly respectfully.

[Stevie Boy]

@MDB1056 if you want to highlight the issues surrounding this thread and bring awareness to this community of the need to protect the vunerable.

31.6K Views is a pretty good result.

So I have to disagree, this thread, has achieved so much more, than what the originator was trying to get across.

 

[markn]

@MDB1056 based on your profile, evidently you are not a current paid member of USAWS and not subject to the requirement. Kind of like people who do not pay taxes telling those that do to pay more.

If you are a current USAWS member and your profile does not reflect that, then while I disagree with your stance, I respect your opinion.

[MDB1056]

@Dirt , use of "shut up" was used figuratively, not literally. So in lieu of stop whining, stop complaining, stop grumbling. Not trying to thwart discussion rather only note this thread ran off the rails from the start.

 

@markn , paid my taxes for many years. I don't compete any longer. Point lost in this whole thread though is that this is not about skiing, so whether I'm active USAWS or not is irrelevant.

 

Thank you for your comments gentlemen.

[markn]

@MDB1056 perhaps not relevant to you, but I stand by my position. As a non-member, you are not mandated to conform to a requirement. How can you be critical of those who are paid members and who object to the mandate. I am one of those who will not be renewing my membership. Once no longer a paying member, my position on any aspect of AWSAW becomes irrelevant.

[The_MS]

Not paying taxes but loves spending other people’s time and money.

[unksskis]

You all have voiced your opinions, been heard, argued for and against, and at this point you're just continuing to complain because you don't feel like you were heard, where as @MDB1056 points out, it was heard, it just doesn't matter. You're continuing to complain and state that you're leaving, and then get mad when people say, "Ok, bye".

[The_MS]

@unksskis

 

 

[bigtex2011]

I can't wait to take my safesport video. Popcorn and a cold can of the rocky mountains finest. Good times

[unksskis]