Damn Coronavirus!

[pregom]

@6balls - hang in there and thank you!

[6balls]

@pregom thanks will do.

@UWSkier standard soap is fine. Breaks up the oil base of the COVID molecule.

It’s a bizarre deal. Some docs are really scared, some are just rolling up sleeves and diving in. Same for nursing etc. They went into their profession to help but not risk themselves necessarily...now here we are.

A lot of us feel like we are now military in some sense. A lot of us are ok with that it’s time to do our part...more so than even the usual life/death that we deal with...now more than ever we need to be rational, lead, and cure sometimes but comfort always, at this time knowing we are taking more risk than usual, while trying to also care for the emotional needs of our allied staff...not just the medical professionals we have dietary, maintenance, janitorial, housekeeping...all have their own concerns.

Very tough.

[MillerTime38]

@6balls have any of you that feel like you are military been in the military? Don’t get me wrong I appreciate and respect everything you all are doing but once this is contained it’s life back normal, surrounded by friends and family a little different than military life ??‍♂️

[mmskiboat]

@6balls I cannot imagine your daily life at the moment. Thank you and all of other people working on the frontlines of this. Please stay safe.

[The_MS]

If we get to the point of the nation wearing masks everywhere we go, say good by to any large arena where we sit next to each other to attend stuff like sporting events.

[BraceMaker]

@The_MS how're you going to drink your beer? With out that why would you be there?

 

So far the people who have showed up at my work wearing masks and gloves I would describe as having possibly the worst understanding of what is and isn't good practice. Gloved up hands going into their pockets, taking mask on and off, wiping their eyes, or my favorite one putting their cellphone into their mask to hold it like a hands free after having just swiped their phone repeatedly with their glove to turn it on.

 

All I'm saying is our cultural intellect is not such that most people are intuitively successful at their usage.

[MillerTime38]

@The_MS believe it or not baseball is huge in japan, and they get tens of thousands of fans and it is a really great atmosphere (way better than any professional event in the states, except maybe hockey)

@BraceMaker at least they are trying, since you are an expert educate them next time ??‍♂️

[Than_Bogan]

@6balls It's impossible to express my gratitude and how impressed I am by what you're doing.

 

Also worthy of note are the incredibly well-reasoned, informed, and rational posts you are making here during a time that you are facing unimaginable stress. Although not nearly as important to society as your actual work, these posts under these circumstances are one of the more remarkable things I've ever seen.

 

Has anyone begun to aggregate data on the ventilator's potential lack of effectiveness? I'm somewhat interested in that.

[The_MS]

I just don’t get wearing a mask at the same time being jammed into Target center watching the Timberwolves with constant person to person contact. Great from my couch but I don’t know.

I’m a total fan of live venue music. I just hope we can put this behind and get back to all the stuff we love without changing our way of lives.

[jayski]

@The_MS I don't understand why your going to watch the Timberwolves anyway?

 

Well I guess they are ahead of Golden State... :)

[UWSkier]

@The_MS it's not a constant. I've been to rock concerts in Japan during normal times and nobody was wearing a mask. It depends on the season and the type of event. If it's something you're doing optionally like a concert or sporting event, you accept additional risk. But if it's something you have to do like your daily commute, you should be expecting to protect your fellow citizens and should expect the same from them.

[6balls]

@MillerTime38 I have nothing but respect for the military and the sacrifices they make, the harms way to which they are exposed...it's unreal. That's why I thank all the fatigue clad military in the airports on routine travel.

 

For the general medical profession, however, who didn't sign up for this kind of risk, it is new territory and people are feeling it. That's not just docs, it's staff and otherwise. Some of my time is spent just trying to calm and reassure...it's a time when leaders have to lead.

 

But yeah holy crap thanks to all of our military...always.

[The_MS]

@UWSkier Cheap Trick Live at budokan?

@jayski I guess that is a bad example. I would only go if they ever got good. As dreadful as our Wild are it would be a more likely event for me. Maybe some day.

I am praying that this ends for every one

[ReggieO]

@6balls Thank you for what you do, can't say that enough! Many are in this to help, thanks to all!

[elr]

Be careful out there, my son's ER was slammed with trauma cases in addition to COVID-19 yesterday. Another good reason to stay at home.

[klindy]

I read they were trying to approve using a “splitter” to be able to use a single ventilator for two people.

 

Interestingly, we have a teammate where I work who has a child who has special needs and who has especially sensitive lungs. Apparently the docs believe if his child was to catch the virus there was a real possibility of a bad outcome. So work sent him home to lower the risk of transmission. As I understand he’s a super sharp guy and he designed a 4-way splitter for a ventilator. He produced the splitter on the divisions 3D printer and they are testing it now. The challenges of recovery from being on a vent notwithstanding as @6balls said earlier, it would be awesome to be able to double or quadruple the “supply” of ventilators overnight. I’m sure there are a hundred different challenges but in the face of a crisis, this seems like a pretty simple solution.

[UWSkier]

I have to wonder if all this cooping people up at home is leading to an increase in ER visits for other things. I was just out in the garage working with sharp blades and decided about halfway through to skip that project for now...

 

I could see ERs busier than usual with nails through the foot, sliced fingers, ladder falls, etc.

[ral]

@Than_Bogan, it frightens me a bit to see how engineers from anywhere in the world think alike...

[DaveD]

@UWSkier My son works in an ER and said their traffic is down because everyone's afraid to go to the hospital for stupid stuff now.

[slow]

https://vimeo.com/399733860 Best common since video i have seen from a NYC doctor in the trenches i have seen

[6balls]

@UWSkier traffic in ER/hospital can be down, but acuity up. People who stub their toe are not coming to the ER anymore (if they are smart). Our clinic volumes are down in a big way, but some of that is by intention...by putting off routine, non-essential stuff for later (physicals, routine disease management in well-controlled patients)...and of course no elective surgeries and then no pre-op exams.

 

One thing that is promising is high flow nasal cannula O2 under a mask...not the kind of 15 liter per minutes we can do typically by wall but maybe 60(no misprint) liters per minute humidified...requires a turbo-charger of sorts. Can buy time for ventilatory decisions based on supply/demand/condition. We are attempting to get some "turbo chargers"--not what they are called but you get the picture.

 

Can't speak to hard evidence, but something that is coming from epicenters (cities hard hit) that we may be able to use when our surge hits.

 

Vent splitters are interesting, but only if it really turns out that vents save lives vs. prolong lives...I don't know that for sure, either. As mentioned prior the post-vent care thing is an entirely separate, secondary issue.

 

This stuff changes fast.

 

Goofy is we still have our cadre of folks that are non COVID that need hospitalization. COPD exacerbation, heart failure, pneumonia, diabetic conditions, emergency surgeries, heart attacks and on and on. Sick folks potentially exposed to a new sickness...interesting times.

 

All we can do is learn from those before us, prepare as best as possible, and be prepared to roll with the punches in a very fluid, resource-limited situation.

 

My guess is (ok better than a guess...data) the next cities to pop are Chicago and New Orleans. Time will tell...but we are still in the exponents stage on daily data of cases and deaths.

 

Now...having said all of that...please do consider the risk of death percentages and whether or not most of you would take that personal bet all day long and twice on Sunday...or every day in Vegas. For your friends and relatives this may be different...the older folks, the older smokers, those older with co-morbid disease are at higher risk. Age and co-morbidity are the most significant risk factors, but you will have anecdotes of young, healthy folks hit hard or passing in the media...anecdotes that are a real human toll and not to be minimized for them or their families, but anecdotes. Remember stats and data when thinking about yourselves.

 

Be smart, be rational, roll with the punches, do what's right for not only you but others around you.

[Stevie Boy]

In the UK they are talking about the lock down continuing into June ! Absolute Pants ! Damn Coronavirus !

[MillerTime38]

@6balls thoughts and prayers for you and everyone on the front line fighting this. I just hope everyone passes along the info you are sharing here and people take this serious. I know everyone wants to get back to life as normal (myself included) but this pandemic is nothing to take lightly.

[MillerTime38]

@The_MS the timberwolves still exist? Hmmmm

Not everyone wears a mask(under normal circumstances) just those that may have an illness or are worried they may get other people sick.

[BigGerald3]

Stay safe 6 balls!

[Garn]

I just have to say that way back when I started this thread complaining that my conference in Orlando was cancelled so I can't go out to Rini's place, I had no idea that it would result in over 300 comments. That is definitely a record for me.

[Jody_Seal]

Florida just went lock down..

See you in September!

[Rednucleus]

Maybe some states are starting to understand "sooner than later".

Here's a kind of long but excellent read IMO

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56

And interesting to see last night the CDC is leaning toward "everyone wear masks in public" - maybe they are following BOS?

Stay safe friends!

[ral]

@Garn, it was a different world then...

[6balls]

FL waited way too long. Hate to see their stats in the coming weeks.

[liquid d]

bs...Florida's main centers were already shut down...just the minor counties shut down now. The problem we had was 5000 friggin new yorkers that jumped on a plane as soon as they shut down NY! aholes!

and then a crapload of New Orleans LA...decided to haul butt to Florida when all hell broke loose over there!

Interstate travel is hard to stop.

[Wish]

@liquid d Yep

[BigGerald3]

No idea why planes are still flying out of NY?

[Dano]

Yup hard to imagine why passenger planes are still flying anywhere. Seems like if you want people to stay home and avoid crowds and close contact. Maybe removing modes of transportation where hundreds of people sit in a confined space would make a lot of sense.

 

[rawly]

Interesting to see how people have changed their opinions on this virus in the just under 30 days that this thread has been running. I will stick with my comment about the big orange guy.

[6balls]

Unfortunate lack of social/political responsibility overall by many...both individuals and by some of those in power. Travel by air would have been easier to stop. By ground inter-state (and intra-state) is tougher for sure.

 

Now (in part due to issues like @liquid d brings up), metro's are gonna heat up and you could have an intra-state problem to the minor counties in each state...who like ours in MN are going to be ill equipped for the numbers if a wave as predicted comes to them. The more who grasp the seriousness and take personal responsibility, the better our collective odds.

 

Frustrating all around. Hope the best for you all. The coming weeks as metro's other than NY heat up with cases will be interesting...as will be the case of more rural spread from said metro's. Be safe.

[MillerTime38]

I saw two more cruise ships with people Infected waiting off Florida coast trying to get permission to dock.....who the f*ck got on a cruise ship with this going around? I believe the ship set off in early March. Many countries and other states refused to let the ships dock, as they should have. You can’t fix stupid. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/5101845002

[The_MS]

Ship is registered in NL and started in Buenos Aires on Mar 7..

[DW]

In my efforts to assist via blood donation yesterday, it was very apparent that people are taking the virus seriously and thank goodness for them, the staff as well. I did find it pretty interesting how careful I was and how my actions were geared to reduce risk and avoid an invisible 'enemy', particularly given I, and I am sure many BOS'ers, routinely engage in relatively 'high risk' activities. I attribute that to a lack of control element over the risk of infection.

 

Since it was a one day event for me, I as others tip my hat and send a huge thank you to all the people that put themselves on the front line every day. We certainly appreciate your service, efforts, dedication and bravery to help keep society moving.

[matthewbrown]

@liquid d did you just blame the boat driver for missing 39? :D

[BraceMaker]

@MillerTime38 - some of the interviews from passengers indicated they thought south america was safe so they figured why not. My theory is don't go places where they don't report accurately on crime, drugs, or diseases. That's why I avoid DC.

[Than_Bogan]

@matthewbrown If that's the explanation, then my boat drivers must be truly TERRIBLE...

[klindy]

@BraceMaker with the routine Legionella outbreaks, other viral and bacterial concerns when you're literally trapped on a boat with 1-4000 other people for an extended period of time, I completely agree with @MillerTime38. That's just plain stupid to even think it'll "be ok".

[BraceMaker]

@klindy clearly I dont want to be on a cruise ship ever... And I've been in Rio ;)

[ral]

@BraceMaker, even with the DC joke to soften it, your posting does not resonate well with some of us in this forum.

 

Need to consider as well that, in this case, most likely, passengers coming from overseas to South America were bringing the disease and not the other way around.

[BraceMaker]

I suppose people can be sensitive about it. I'd wager most people on here haven't spent a minute thinking about what this disease is doing anywhere other than China Italy and the states.

 

The reporting is fascinating around Bolsonaro .

 

Tracking pneumonia related fatalities in countries reporting few covid illnesses while having spikes of pneumonia deaths is also something people should be critical of.

 

So all I mean to shed light on is that these passengers made choices based on what was probably somewhat under reported illness is a number of places (DC included).

 

Brazil popped to the front of my tale as the reporting about the governor's resistance to the orders of the president are essentially not reported but I think a really likely hot bed as we transition into summer and expect our cases to lighten the southern hemisphere switches to winter.

 

I think people here in the states should be more aware, so if that touches a nerve you have my apologies. I don't think the narrative that we've been presented is wholly accurate.

[liquid d]

@matthewbrown only a time or two!

[ral]

Apology accepted. Most likely, South American news are not mainstream at all in the USA. But down here we do get crazy news about Bolsonaro and AMLO...

[jimbrake]

@MillerTime38 - my question is who TF would ever get on a cruise ship ever, even in times of no pandemic?

[MillerTime38]

@jimbrake agreed we probably aren’t dealing with people of a sound mind to begin with.

 

North Korea isn’t reporting any positive cases so maybe we should all try to visit there.....