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New hull for 2013 prostar 197


slalomboy96
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I believe you have you choice of colors on the WTT this year. I've heard a lot of grumblings about the 197 wakes, so last week I set a new PB behind @Richard Doane's 197 - twice! For what it's woth I was @ the dreaded 22' off pass and never noticed more than a skip when crossing the wakes. I skied behind the 200 at the same tournament and thought it was sweet too!

 

Don't forget the 197 has the killer three event vibe.

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The CC200 is a sweet boat and I'm not saying any thing against the CC200 but I skied it twice this week and my PS197WTT 2011 has a lower/softer wake at all line lengths. Both are Promo boats of 2011. I think MC gets undeserved bad press from folks hitting the wake with a flat ski.

 

At regionals, I saw a number of skiers hitting the Carbon Pro wake with a fat ski and they got air while others sliced thru like a hot knife thru butter.

 

I recently spoke with a very prominent Pro skier on the MC design team and was told they are working hard on a new design. Wouldn't say exactly what they're doing, buy said it will make me want to trade up!

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@slalomboy96 - I heard this weekend from a reliable source that there is going to be a new design (all around) for the 2014 MC 197. Don't know any specifics, but that it will be LOVED by the slalom guys and probably a little smaller than the current 197.
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MC's President of Sales, Scott Crutchfield, told me and Charles over dinner one night that the new hull will be out when it's ready, not a minute before. Which is why is wasn't out for 2012 or 2013. They've tried numerous designs, have scrapped a few designs, etc. He acknowledged that they have had inconsistencies boat to boat that need to be addressed, but don't want to debut a new hull just to have a new hull and it not be at least as good as the competition, ie the CC200 and TXI. In other threads I've posted some of the design parameters they've worked on such as a 19' overall length, barrel shaped hull bottom(not a true flat bottom) at stern with no reverse chines at the gunnels, etc.
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Looking back at the last 20 years of me skiing, I cant pick one time where I'd rather have the MC over any of the other 3.. Is the quality in MC? I think it is. Is the wake as good as the 200 or the carbon pro, or the response.. no.
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I saw this on TT. Sounds legit?

 

"I have first hand reliable intel on the new Prostar for 2014. It will be named Prostar 201. MC wants to one up CC again ( cc196 vs MC197) . It will share some of the same characterisics of the new Xstar. It will have the funky rub rail dip and will also incorprate a small pickle fork front bow to address the complaints of the small seating area of the 197. It will have a rear swooping mini tower that does not interfere with shortline. . It will have a built in boom that stores itself in the gunnel when not in use. A push of a button will release the boom and it will telescope out automatically! No power tower, but now you got this cool auto feature. The engine will be pushed forward 3 inches as well as the gas tank to improve weight distibution. The storage locker is thinner but goes all the way to the floor. The dash will have no gauges. It will be one offset( simalar to CC) six inch screen . It will display all info and zero off. It will have two rope release systems, one specific to trick the other to slalom. The wake is supposed to be so faint and soft that it will sure to see new world records. As far as power plant, there is talk of a turbo charged V6 that is supposed to get better gas consumption than anything we have seen before.Thats about all I know right now, I am rooted to have WTT #1! Please do not share any of this info outside of TT , as it is all very secret."

 

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Great, another 60K plus over sized waterski barge. I think now would be the time to buy a 197. The boat will be the one that everyone wants when they see the sticker shock of the new boat. Buy a 197 now and run it for a few years and get your money back out of it when you sell.
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I highly doubt the 2014 Prostar will have a pickle fork front end or all the other BS spewed out on TT. Some of those guys dream up this "reliable info" and put it out there as the truth. I too am waiting to see what MC has in store, just because I know it will be bad ass. That, and being a MC fan. Also that other talk over on TT about MC doing away with all DD boats, I do not see that also. If they indeed do, they would have officially taken themselves out of the Ski boat market. Even Centurion had to get back into the ski boat market and look what they brought. A bad ass bare bones tug!
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What I'd like most to see out of the above rumor-mill is a turbo. The biggest problem at the recent Predator Bay Pro Shoot-Out was the lack of boat power at 3,500 feet. We had CC pulling our nationals and MC pulling the shoot-out, and they both struggled to keep up with 36mph shortline and pretty much sucked for jumping ... even the big motors. The only way to take altitude out of the equation is turbo charging.
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@SkiJay - I agree with you on the twin turbo V6. Imagine the hole shot and the fuel economy. I know that VW was doing something with a diesel engine in Europe. Can anyone comment on that? Since a diesel has sooo much torque I'd like to see one of those in a boat....
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I plan to run my 2005 197 for as long as I can. I'm at about 1150 hours now. The boat gets an oil change every 50 hours and a full "overhaul" of the engine (new distributor, plug wires, belts, hoses, etc) every two years. Runs as strong as the day I bought it. As someone who skis 28 off and shorter, I honestly don't notice much difference between any of the boats I ski behind in terms of either the wakes or my scores. Does the N200 have a flatter table? Sure. Do I get bigger scores behind it? Nope. Does the TXi track better? Yep. Do I notice that the wakes are that much different or better? Nope. I'll get a different boat someday when this one won't run anymore, but until then, I don't think the cost of upgrading gets me anything other than a shiny new toy.
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Good post @razorskier1. I love me some wake behind the 2012 Bu, or the Carbon pro.. I was able to get about 4 balls better out of the Carbon Pro a few days ago, but I think I could possibly do the same behind my boat with enough practice.
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@Razorskier1 I hear this all the time from skiers at 28off and shorter.

 

This isn't meant for you directly, but I think many accomplished skiers have forgotten what it's like to struggle behind the MC wake at beginning speeds and line lengths.

 

Talk to anyone who skies 28off and longer, or slower than 34mph, and they are almost always unhappy to see a MC at the starting dock.

 

I think MC makes a high quality boat, but if I ever bought one my wife would stop skiing.

 

I can tell you from first hand experience, after spending a week a Trophy Lakes skiing behind their 2013 TT for 5 days and then flipping over to H2Osmosis and their SN200 for the next 2, the difference in the wake is staggering at 32mph / 15off and below.

 

What I don't understand is that CC has designed a hull as early as '97 (TSC1) that is still considered exceptional today. What has MC done with their hull design in those same 15 years? Their lack of innovation in this specific area (hull design) seems incongruent with how well they have supported slalom skiing through the years (e.g. Pro Tour).

 

I know one G3 skier whose family intentionally purchases a MC because of the poor wake characteristics so it will "make her a better skier in tournaments." It has worked, she skies really well, but why has MC settled for this kind of reputation for so long?

 

When tournaments are pulled in this area, the MC either goes in round 1 with the CC pulling 2 & 3 (turn and burn), or CC pulls rounds 1 & 2 with MC pulling round 3 (and many skiers opting out after they get the score they want in rounds 1 & 2).

 

Just my thoughts...no intent to start a boat war.

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Two technical issues will need to be addressed with a twin turbo V6, lag and heat dissipation of the turbos. Water cooling the turbos will solve that one, the lag will be a bit more of a challenge since the pull up from idle is a key performance element. New lighter technology would be very cool, but it will come at a cost and also only be of interest to a small segment of the market. The iron small block is still the popular choice due to low cost while the car market has gone the aluminum route (LS series). That implies to me, a high tech V6 will be a hard sell since it won't be inexpensive and there are no EPA regulations pushing better economy.
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@ScarletArrow I ski 2 times a week behind a 08 MC 197 TT. I do most of my skiing at 15off, 22off, and trying 28off. 22off is the worst. 22off 32mph is painfull. 22off 34mph its a little better. 28 off its not to bad. The boat handles well. Tracks pretty good. Workmanship seems nice.

 

My point has always been that these boats are some of the most expensive of all ski boats. I just can't believe that's the best they can do and they've stuck with it this long. Definitely due for an update. I hope MC is listening.

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@ScarletArrow -- I can't disagree with you or @gregy on the slower speeds and the "22 off hump". I also drive a TXi about once a week. I have never liked the Malibu LXi. Too big, bad driving position, felt like a barge. The TXi is a big improvement in all those areas, tracks better than my MC, and has nice wakes. First time I've ever thought a Malibu might be on the list of possible next boats.

 

My wife skis open water at 32mph 15 off and in course at 28 and 30mph 15 off. Most of her time is open water. That being said, the open water skiing has made her very efficient at getting through the wakes with minimal disturbance.

 

My real hope is that I can find a new boat someday that is QUIETER!!! I ski early on a public lake and I need to keep the locals from getting to irritated with me! The MC is pretty quiet. The old 196s were silent by comparison. Oddly, two folks on my lake have Moomba's and you can't hear them at all even at wide open throttle. If Moomba can do it, why can't MC, Malibu, and CC?

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@Rasorskier1 - I just skied a 2012 MC197 TT and it is one of the best wakes I have skied behind. I haven't skied behind a SN200, so I can't compare against that, but I have skied behind some BU's and SN's. As far as noise, I think it's pretty quiet. With that said though I have heard a MC X7 and it is quiet loud. Perhaps one of the caps is missing on the exhaust. We have an '07 Moomba and it is pretty quiet, more quiet than the SN's or the one MC at our club at least. Just my two cents.
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@DooSPX -- mine is quieter than any other boat on my lake. It is just that at 6:30 in the morning it still is loud enough to upset some folks. Honestly, the Moomba doesn't make a sound, but they use a different muffler that won't fit in my MC (my mechanic owns a Moomba and was willing to trade mufflers because he thinks his boat is too quiet!).
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I may be wrong, but this is how I see it. MC's priorities are not to make a new tournamen ski boat right now. The suits and bean counters at MC rather spend the money on the redesign of the 100k+ wave makers. It's just makes more financial sense. They already pretty much guaranetee 100 or so sales of the current 197TT , so why invest the $$ only possibly move a small amount more. With 3 others in the game there probably isnt enough market share to make sense right now. So they will get to it when they get to it.
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That's essentially it in a nutshell. Margin on a $100k X35 is almost triple what the margin is on a 197. Skiers are cheap. lol Not to mention, in 2012 MC oversold prodution by over 200 boats. They had to cancel 16 orders for stock that Charles had for that reason. So when you can't keep up with production as it is, it makes no fiscal sense for the company to sell a 197 with $10k of margin vs a X35 with $28k of margin. Money talks, unfortunately.
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Talked to my local dealer before he went down there for a dealer meeting. He said they are updating all their hulls, but he thought the pig boats would be first, the 197 a lower priority. No question they make more money on the big pigs, and they sell a lot of them. As an aside, at least in my local area, Malibu has shifted their sales strategy significantly. They sell pretty much 100% v-drives to unsuspecting stern-drive owners telling them that it skis just as good as a direct drive but has a better interior layout. We are, unfortunately, the minority for the ski boat makers.
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CC isn't having any problems selling 200's, so there's a market for such a boat out there. CC is also moving a ton of wakeboats, so I'd think MC would want to follow suit? From a consumer's point of view (not just looking at them as tow tractors), the 200 makes the 197 seem very aged.
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The boat that will become the new Prostar has been in development since the end of 2010, MC wants a boat that will once again put CC on notice. @swc5150 MC sells alot more boats than CC, and CC's own policy of once it leaves the factory it's sold also screws with the number of boats built vs. number sold in a given year.
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In that case, I'd be curious to see titled units, 200 v 197. Those in the MC know have mentioned on this site that they don't sell many DD boats, and CC is pumping out 200's (and dealership inventories don't seem overstocked, at least in the midwest). If the 197 is selling so well, then why no new hull in the past 12 years? I'm not trying to bash MC, as we've owned 8 of them. I just wish they'd focus on skiers a little more. The fit and finish of the 197 is beautiful. The rest of the boat is just plain outdated compared to the 200. I've been hearing about a "game changing" Prostar for a few years now, and am ready to see it. I just hope it doesn't share the deck lines of the new X Star. I would not be shocked if it has a mini pickle fork either.
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